The return of exhibitions - a further poll

[MarkC]

NHS Vaccination Certificates? This isn't good reading - and, frankly, comes as no surprise to me 

 

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2021/10/03/man-arrested-police-alerted-fake-vaccine-passports-sold-750/

 

QUOTE

A man has been arrested after police were alerted to fake vaccine passports being sold online for £750. 

The genuine certificates were being advertised through the encrypted messaging app, Telegram, by a person who identified themselves as “Doctor J”.

An investigation by the Mail on Sunday newspaper uncovered the scam.

An undercover reporter ordered a pass on behalf of an unvaccinated person, and four days later their status appeared on the NHS app as fully-inoculated with the Pfizer vaccine. 

The unique QR code was then used to gain access to a nightclub in London, the Louvre Museum in Paris and on the Government’s passenger locator form, the newspaper reported.

Vaccine passports are not currently mandatory in England, but could be brought in under the Government’s “Plan B” for the autumn and winter if the NHS becomes overwhelmed. 

From November 11, all carers working in England must be fully vaccinated if they want to work in a Care Quality Commission-registered care home.

23-year-old man arrested in connection with incident

Hampshire Constabulary said they were alerted to “counterfeit Covid passports” being produced in the Basingstoke area, and a 23-year-old man from Oakley has been arrested in connection with the incident. 

“It's claimed passports were being produced to bypass current Covid border and venue controls,” a spokesman for the force said.

“Officers are now liaising with the newspaper, Department of Health & Social Care and NHS England as part of the investigation.”

The Telegram channel hosted by Doctor J had almost 500 subscribers when discovered by the newspaper.

The host claimed they could manipulate a patients’ NHS records to make it appear they had been double jabbed. They also claimed to have already processed 10 orders that week. 

It is understood there is no evidence the NHS system has been hacked, but that an individual may have abused their access to official records.

NHS England is currently identifying any suspected fraudulent vaccination records and will be removing them from the system. 

'Defrauding the NHS and the taxpayer will not be tolerated'

An NHS spokesperson said: “Defrauding the NHS and the taxpayer will not be tolerated and after the Mail On Sunday shared their investigation we immediately took steps to identify potentially fraudulent vaccination records. 

“The information has been passed directly to the relevant authorities.”

Posts from individuals who have reportedly purchased fake passes were also shared on the encrypted site, according to the newspaper.

“It's on there [the NHS App]! Haven't a clue how you've done that I honestly thought it was a scam,” wrote one person.

“Mate your [sic] a life saver I can now keep my job and don't have to put my life at risk. I have already started passing your details on to my work colleagues.”

UNQUOTE

 

And at a stroke, the brown stuff has hit the wind propelling device. Who can now trust the NHS App?

[Nearholmer]

31 minutes ago, Crisis Rail said:

All seems depressingly grim.

That’s pandemics for you.

 

31 minutes ago, Crisis Rail said:

Maybe we should just forget about Exhibitions?

 

Until..........?

Answering only for myself:

 

I will be forgetting about attending big ones until the  circulation of Covid has dropped-back significantly from where it is now, which I suspect means until next spring.

 

Smaller events, with good precautions in place I’m already happy to attend, and am delighted they have re-commenced.

[corneliuslundie]

I had considered going to Manchester as my first show, but it has been cancelled. I would like to go to Stafford (we normally have a club outing there) but if the situation is no better than now I shan't. So I suspect that it will; be late spring at the earliest before I get to a show. Expo EM North if it happens perhaps.

Jonathan 

[Colin_McLeod]

7 hours ago, 2750Papyrus said:

I would like to see exhibition conditions of entry as follows:

 

1) Visitors able to produce "vaccine passport" or equivalent given green wrist bands, mask wearing to be discretionary.

 

2) Visitors unable to produce such documentation to be given orange wristbands and required to wear a mask (FFP2?), available at point of entry if required.

 

 

 

I wouldn't bother with the orange armbands.  If you don't qualify for a green one you don't get in.

 

While there are still people dying at the rate of 50,000 per annum, I would also insist on fresh masks  (not the dirty ones pulled out of the pocket) for everyone.

 

 

[Chris M]

1 hour ago, corneliuslundie said:

I had considered going to Manchester as my first show, but it has been cancelled. I would like to go to Stafford (we normally have a club outing there) but if the situation is no better than now I shan't. So I suspect that it will; be late spring at the earliest before I get to a show. Expo EM North if it happens perhaps.

Jonathan 

 

I'm happy to be an exhibitor at Stafford as things stand today.  I've been double vaccinated and will no doubt get a booster later this year. I will also have my flu jab and have had a pneumonia jab. All this doesn't make me invincible but is a sensible precaution in the same way as wearing a seatbelt is a sensible precaution when travelling in a car. You could still get seriously injured or killed but the seat belt will usually prevent it. It should be considered that using the roads is inherently dangerous - there are 5 deaths and over 400 reported injuries to road users every day on average in the UK and yet most of us still use the roads without worrying about the risk. If you are double vaccinated the chances of being hospitalised or dying from Covid are now very low even for old bu&&ers like me. Having a good life is all about considering risk and balancing that with doing what you want to do.

[caradoc]

3 hours ago, Legend said:

Is Cathcart on ? I haven’t seen any notifications . Is it in Pollockshields town hall as usual ?  

 

Yes, it's on ! At Pollokshaws Burgh Hall again, as per recent years.

 

https://www.clydesidemrc.com/cathcart-exhibition

 

[Nearholmer]

1 hour ago, Chris M said:

It should be considered that using the roads is inherently dangerous

I do think it would be very useful if some well-based individual risk comparators were published. Dementia and heart disease are I think the most common causes of death, and it ought to be fairly simple to compare risks from those with risks from Covid, for instance.

 

My gut feel is that driving is still probably lower risk than Covid, but that is only based on a crude comparison between deaths per annum from each cause, and doesn’t factor-in vaccination, or the considerable differences by age.

[jonhall]

Hands, Face, Space and Fresh air, are the tools that have done us quite well so far. At exhibitions like GETS, space and fresh air were by the nature of the thing, rather limited, so I think hands and face play a bigger part in protecting ourselves. Yes we have a new tool in the form of the various vaccines, but not (or at least trying not to) catching the disease seems to me a preferable route to take at the moment.  

 

Folkestone today was a very different experience - VERY quiet, even for a Sunday, and apparently it was even quieter yesterday, its not clear if the terrible weather, petrol crisis, or rather limited advertising was the problem (I suspect all 3 in combination).

 

Jon

[Phil Parker]

Ultimately, this is all going to come down to the individual to decide. Last week I went to the Elsecar garden rail show - 450 people, pretty much all without masks during the day. It's a reasonable sized hall, and ALL the doors, including 3 sets of double loading doors, were open so there was a reasonable amount of air movement. The only time I chatted to anyone for more than 5 minutes, I did it outside (actually using one of the barriered off areas outside one set of doors). Otherwise preferring to keep at least a metre between myself and others when talking. It felt OK, and I've since tested negative for Covid (LFT, which according to Tim Spectre are rubbish, so YMMV).

 

Yesterday, I sat in cinema to watch the Bond film. No masks, but we were at the back of the auditorium, so no filthy breath heading towards us. Plenty of air room above, and ventilation too judging from the temperature which required a coat, but not freezing like proper air-con. I felt a bit uncomfortable to start with, but got over it. I had a mask, but on the basis that this only protects others, and none of them cared about me, I didn't bother. I'll happily wear one in shops, even though this is increasingly rare, to protect the staff. Making it from the cinema to the car park without touching handrails on escalators, and opening doors with my foot was fine, I'm in that habit, even though sanitiser is my constant companion.

 

The cinema was my first "fun" trip for over a year. To date, I've saved opportunities to catch Covid for work jobs. I finally decided that this is daft. I've been on a train twice (and changed once as I felt uncomfortable), in the last 20 months, something I love. Same for a bus ride. No pubs. No restaurants, not even fast food ones (food eaten in the car) and no holidays. If all the things I enjoy are out-of-bounds, then there is little point in waking up in the morning. Hence, some gentle pushing of the envelope.

 

More pertinently, I'm booked in to the Great British Model Railway Show at the end of the month as a demonstrator. Either I get comfortable with people, or cancel. I can wear a mask, but since I'll spend the day being talked to by people without them, many of whom can't even manage to wash their hands after a toilet trip such is their enthusiasm for hygiene, that options are limited. Double-banking the tables would improve separation, and I'm seriously considering it. A top-quality mask (the sort that protects me) is another option, but that makes talking all but impossible so I might as well not be there.

 

Like it or not, it appears Covid is here to stay and we are going to have to find a way to deal with it. With very few exceptions, no-one is forced to go to a toy train show, so if you don't feel comfortable, stay away would seem to be sensible advice. Look to see what (if any) considerations have been made before you go, but realise the organisers can't micro-manage the crowd unless they employ some very serious security staff (if you mandate masks, you can't have volunteers ejecting people who take them off during the day, that's a job for professionals), something reflected in the ticket price. along with enlarged aisles and reduced stand numbers etc. Hopefully, events will evolve into acceptably Covid safe forms that will satisfy as many people as possible.

[AY Mod]

8 minutes ago, Phil Parker said:

Double-banking the tables would improve separation, and I'm seriously considering it.

 

I'd say that's a sensible move. Anyone who's behind such a table knows the propensity for a visitor to plonk their knuckles on the table and deliver their greeting all over you.

[bradfordbuffer]

6 hours ago, woodenhead said:

Some locations installed special cleaning equipment to escalators that would constantly soak the touch surfaces in ultraviolet light to combat perceived infection from Covid.

 

However, a German medical team took a whole town to task early in the pandemic to test whether Covid sat around on surfaces and came to the conclusion it didn't and it wasn't where infections were coming from.

 

That all said, I use my elbows a heck of a lot more now than I did.

If only lift control buttons where at wasit hight wouldn't have to use elbows or end of mobile phone 

[Chris M]

Perhaps going slightly off topic but I wonder how trade exhibitors are feeling after an exhibition or so?
I’m wondering whether they are finding exhibitions are still worth their while. They have survived 18 months without going to exhibitions and so must have found other ways of keeping their business going. Attending exhibitions is a drain on both time and cash for trade exhibitors. I’m hoping that most trade exhibitors will decide its still worth attending shows but I expect some will decide to drop out of the exhibition circuit or at least cut back the number of shows.

This is important as income from trade stand rental is a very import to the financial success of so many shows. I’m not being all doom and gloom here; it might be that, with the increased interest in model railways, exhibition organisers will find they have a queue of new businesses wanting stands. I am pretty certain Covid will have had some indirect knock on effects on the views of trade exhibitors and it will interesting to see what happens.

[PhilJ W]

1 minute ago, Chris M said:

Perhaps going slightly off topic but I wonder how trade exhibitors are feeling after an exhibition or so?
I’m wondering whether they are finding exhibitions are still worth their while. They have survived 18 months without going to exhibitions and so must have found other ways of keeping their business going. Attending exhibitions is a drain on both time and cash for trade exhibitors. I’m hoping that most trade exhibitors will decide its still worth attending shows but I expect some will decide to drop out of the exhibition circuit or at least cut back the number of shows.

This is important as income from trade stand rental is a very import to the financial success of so many shows. I’m not being all doom and gloom here; it might be that, with the increased interest in model railways, exhibition organisers will find they have a queue of new businesses wanting stands. I am pretty certain Covid will have had some indirect knock on effects on the views of trade exhibitors and it will interesting to see what happens.

A regular local toy fair has started up again and quite a number of the regular stall holders attended plus a few more that hadn't attended before. One I know took the opportunity to re-furbish his house during the lockdown. A few others are missing but none have succumbed to covid as far as I know. I was speaking to someone from a well known local model shop and he said business was down but was slowly picking up now.

[adb968008]

I was as extreme risk averse to Covid as possible back in 2020.

I’d seen and felt SARS two decades earlier.

I didnt hold back sharing how we changed our lifestyle last year, based on what i’d been through in Asia.

 

Now i’m much more relaxed, largely because I don’t have a choice, but to get on with it.

 

my daughters in school, I cannot change that, and covid stalks its halls, any day she could bring it home, and schools have dropped all restrictions and gone back to 2019 lifestyles…indeed several in her class have recently had covid, so shes been exposed several times, we may have even had it..(societal antibody testing would be nice).

 

But..

 

1. we have a vaccine.

2. regardless what the news says, we have probably the best testing regime in the world for several months… the case counts are probably close to reality, something I am suspect of elsewhere.

3. The variants seem to have slowed in evolution/circulation. 

4. society has opened up to not too far from normality, but cases havent rocketed but been consistent all summer into autumn, and was probably where it was in summer 2020 but we didnt have capacity to test at that level.

5. survival chances seem much better than where we were with overcrowded hospitals, insufficient testing, free ranging exposure and no real immunity.

6. i try to stay away from crowded indoor locations (like London Rush hour tubes, crowded pubs and crowded restaurants), but where the space is large, well ventilated and sufficient personal space to move around, Ive no issue with it.

 

I have made my peace with it, i’m looking more at “big jims attempts to become slim jim” thread as greater concern for my future than covid.. if 1-6 above change then I may need to reevaluate.

 

With only a few exceptions, I’d imagine i’m comfortable with most model railway shows at this point, as a visitor moving around. But  I could understand how an operator or trader maybe concerned if they are in a static location and exposed to the flow past them all day however… but balance that against the audience.. many of those attending shows are more likely to take more precautions than in general civilisation alone, and are in more protected age groups.. which improves the risk profile somewhat further.. Warley scrum is not the same as Bank tube at 5pm.

 

Edited October 3, 2021 by adb968008

[bbishop]

2 hours ago, jonhall said:

Hands, Face, Space and Fresh air, are the tools that have done us quite well so far. At exhibitions like GETS, space and fresh air were by the nature of the thing, rather limited, so I think hands and face play a bigger part in protecting ourselves. Yes we have a new tool in the form of the various vaccines, but not (or at least trying not to) catching the disease seems to me a preferable route to take at the moment.  

 

Folkestone today was a very different experience - VERY quiet, even for a Sunday, and apparently it was even quieter yesterday, its not clear if the terrible weather, petrol crisis, or rather limited advertising was the problem (I suspect all 3 in combination).

 

Jon

Jon, it appears the Tolworth exhibition is going ahead?  I'm interested in making it  my first exhibition for 18 months.  I know you cannot insist on mask wearing, but to what extent are will you recommend it to the punters?

 

Bill

[jonhall]

4 minutes ago, bbishop said:

Jon, it appears the Tolworth exhibition is going ahead?  I'm interested in making it  my first exhibition for 18 months.  I know you cannot insist on mask wearing, but to what extent are will you recommend it to the punters?

 

Bill

 

I have no idea as I think its an act of extreme foolishness to hold (what appears to me as a mere club member) the same show as we would have held 2 years ago as if Covid hasn't happened. Bring cash to get in because the exhibition manager can't be persuaded* to entertain the idea of a card machine.

 

* not that I've even attempted, because JN is even less likely to deviate from his chosen course than 'the lady's not for turning', and I've long learnt that banging my head against a brick wall gives me a headache, and loosens the mortar, but little else.

 

Jon

[PhilJ W]

This one is near enough for me.

 https://www.ukmodelshops.co.uk/event/22268-BraintreeHalsteadMRC_Exhibition

But I won't be going after I saw the entry prices.

Edited October 3, 2021 by PhilJ W

[Andy Hayter]

It does include free train rides on 1:1 stock plus entry to the museum.  Of note: their plea for more traders.

[PhilJ W]

The main difficulty might be finding enough petrol to do the trip.

 

[bradfordbuffer]

4 minutes ago, PhilJ W said:

This one is near enough for me.

 https://www.ukmodelshops.co.uk/event/22268-BraintreeHalsteadMRC_Exhibition

But I won't be going after I saw the entry prices.

12 quid for model show! unlimited train rides! Access to museum? Sounds like a good day out! Take a flask of tea a box full of sarnies...12quid! 3 pints up north 2 if lucky in the smoke....3 coffees from expensive chain? Or stop at home up to you'

[PhilJ W]

14 minutes ago, Andy Hayter said:

It does include free train rides on 1:1 stock plus entry to the museum.  Of note: their plea for more traders.

 

11 minutes ago, bradfordbuffer said:

12 quid for model show! unlimited train rides! Access to museum? Sounds like a good day out! Take a flask of tea a box full of sarnies...12quid! 3 pints up north 2 if lucky in the smoke....3 coffees from expensive chain? Or stop at home up to you'

I should have read it properly so I might go depending on the petrol situation and if my friend wants to go with me. He has a young lad and money's a bit tight for him and he might decide not to go.

Edited October 3, 2021 by PhilJ W

[Mike Bellamy]

1 hour ago, jonhall said:

Bring cash to get in because the exhibition manager can't be persuaded* to entertain the idea of a card machine.

 

 

We had about 400 visitors to our show and I think only 3 asked if we could accept cards as they didn't have £5 in cash - we had two cash machines very close by and they were back in 5 minutes with real money.

[adb968008]

2 hours ago, bbishop said:

Jon, it appears the Tolworth exhibition is going ahead?  I'm interested in making it  my first exhibition for 18 months.  I know you cannot insist on mask wearing, but to what extent are will you recommend it to the punters?

 

Bill

Thanks, glad too see thats going ahead it’ll be on my list too. 

[railroadbill]

I would have gone to a small local show held in a school hall, but it's been cancelled this year. So has a larger one I normally go to held in a sports centre.

Next one for me would be Ally Pally next March, which is apparently going ahead. A large show, but my decision can depend on the situation in the country after the coming winter. I'm more wary than gung-ho about all this.

[PhilJ W]

If Ally Pally is anything like previous shows there there should be plenty of space for social distancing. (Except for certain trade stands).