Sonic Models OO Gauge Robinson A5

[K Hatton]

Good news:

 

Rails now sell the sound decoders for this separately to the actual model! 

 

New chip fitted and tested, sound and performance still the same. 

 

Trialled with a 20x14x4 "bass enhanced" speaker (from Roads&Rails) sound is much better to my ears. 

 

 

I was debating fitting a 26x14x7 however without lifting the DCC board the speaker would only fit facing upwards and would be touching the bottom of the processor board (not sure if this would affect the speaker/board long-term as there seemed to be a slight magnetic attraction?)

 

 

Edited September 1, 2023 by K Hatton

[jaym481]

On 01/09/2023 at 03:24, K Hatton said:

Good news:

 

Rails now sell the sound decoders for this separately to the actual model! 

 

New chip fitted and tested, sound and performance still the same. 

 

So you have one? I looked and the listing still says "only with the purchase of a locomotive" but they probably didn't bother to change the text. I wonder if that's also the case with the NER railcar.

 

Do you know what the manufacturer of the decoder is? If it's ESU I'm tempted. I have an ESU sound decoder in it now, but with a generic sound project. The A5 performance is extraordinary in combination with the ESU.

[K Hatton]

1 hour ago, jaym481 said:

So you have one? I looked and the listing still says "only with the purchase of a locomotive" but they probably didn't bother to change the text. I wonder if that's also the case with the NER railcar.

 

Do you know what the manufacturer of the decoder is? If it's ESU I'm tempted. I have an ESU sound decoder in it now, but with a generic sound project. The A5 performance is extraordinary in combination with the ESU.

Yes. After I stuffed the first decoder I rang Rails directly to ask the question and subsequently ordered the decoder on its own.

 

The replacement decoder is exactly the same Loksound 5 micro as the first (except it works!)

 

I've posted mine off to Roads&Rails as they have agreed to fit the ESU stay alive and the replacement speaker for a very reasonable price so will update on performance when I have it back.

 

Also question: is it possible to upload video clips as well as images? If so I can provide a video when it comes back (if anyone wants to hear it?) 

[amdaley]

I bought one of these months ago.

I did the usual running in on a rolling road & it seemed fine.

I got a stock of decoders from Rails during the week so today I decided to fit one to the A5.

 

I had a tough job trying to get the body off.

The front was free enough but the rear end just wouldn't slide out.

I was concerned that I was going to break the thing.

I was just about to put it back in the display cabinet when suddenly it decided to surrender.

I fitted the decoder, gave it the cab address & its running away now on the rolling road.

Strangely enough the body went back on without a murmur ?

Lovely looking loco. 

[K Hatton]

I've found the back end of mine can be tight at times when taking the body off/putting it back on (glad to know it isn't just me). 

 

Some gentle wiggling is usually enough to get past the tight spots. 

[jaym481]

I think you can upload videos if they have a file extension matching the ones listed and are less than 10MB. Otherwise you need to find a hosting site and link to it.

[34theletterbetweenB&D]

14 hours ago, K Hatton said:

I've found the back end of mine can be tight at times when taking the body off/putting it back on (glad to know it isn't just me). 

 

Some gentle wiggling is usually enough to get past the tight spots. 

Pretty sure it's overall length that's the problem, Get the rear in first by moving the mechanism as far forward as it will go when there's less than 5mm vertical to go when seating the mechanism. Keep forgetting my intention to take a file to the mechanism and make it a loose fit...

[charliepetty]

On 05/09/2023 at 15:18, jaym481 said:

So you have one? I looked and the listing still says "only with the purchase of a locomotive" but they probably didn't bother to change the text. I wonder if that's also the case with the NER railcar.

 

Do you know what the manufacturer of the decoder is? If it's ESU I'm tempted. I have an ESU sound decoder in it now, but with a generic sound project. The A5 performance is extraordinary in combination with the ESU.

The decoders are ESU Next 18s with a wheeltappers file, as is the NER Railcar.  The NE Bo-Bo is again a Next 18 with a Legomanbiffo sound file.

 

All available from www.dckits-devideos.co.uk

 

[K Hatton]

Update for anyone still interested. 

 

Loco is back from Roads&Rails with stay alive and replacement speaker fitted.

 

Performance has improved dramatically. No stuttering/false starts and smooth running even over points etc. 

 

Speaker is better than before but still not quite bassey enough for my liking tbh (although given the limited space available there aren't many other options without moving the DCC board)

[zr2498]

It might be worth looking at what Mike Wild has done. If you are signed up to key Model World you can hear it unning with larger speaker fitted into the cab. Installation described in HM 196 Oct 23. I have the Wheeltappers as per the original supply from Rails but might upgrade the speaker.

 

[zr2498]

Sound and stay alive installed in A5

 

I have used the same technique as carried out by Mike Wild (HM 196), with the speaker installed inside the cab, and crew also added. Speaker from DCKits 25 X 15.5 X 11mm Midi bass Slim.

Crew temporarily fixed with black tack until I go back into the cab for weathering.

 

 

As the loco came with sound already installed (Wheeltappers sound files via Rails), it had an ESU LokSound 5 Micro sound decoder already installed.

I tried the fit of an ESU (small) stay alive which would 'just' fit as shown further up thread, but on running there was always some small contact with the drive shaft which could be heard with the sound turned off.

 

 

I gave up on that, and decided to use the DCC Concepts Zen 3-wire route. This kit has the small capacitor option and the interface chip is physically separated. When connecting to an ESU decoder a 3-wire harness is also needed.

As I had already done the tricky soldering to the decoder, I connected the new kit to the existing wires.

 

 

The interface chip will just fit under the PCB, when set an angle and with the original speaker removed.

 

 

The small capacitor is located under the drive shaft. Note, it is tilted and set close to the gear train so the cable can reach the the interface chip.

 

 

Cables tidied up

 

 

Completed - sound is so much better, and the stay alive was tested with sound lasting for 6 seconds without power

 

 

Some reference info

 

 

Not forgetting the CV settings on the ESU decoder (for the stay alive)

 

Edited October 14, 2023 by zr2498
Extra info added

[34theletterbetweenB&D]

On 12/07/2023 at 11:00, 34theletterbetweenB&D said:

And it is all the motor, there's nothing interfering with it. (This is the first time that I have had a dud motor that has survived my 'infant mortality' test of  at least 10 hours running within the first week from purchase.)

Belated update. Actually not the motor at all, some weird responses to commands began, and the decoder 'resigned', no address. Reset and re-addressed, it worked fine for a month then 'resigned' again in the same style. Put a known good decoder in, and has run perfectly with this since mid August.

 

The first decoder has refused to reset successfully this time, so will be returned.

[OOgaugeJaf]

Is there a plan to do another run?

 

could the A5 be the basis to develop an A8? Thoughts

[34theletterbetweenB&D]

 

3 hours ago, OOgaugeJaf said:

Is there a plan to do another run?

Ask Rails. There are still some of the first run of A5's in stock, which suggests 'not yet'.

3 hours ago, OOgaugeJaf said:

...could the A5 be the basis to develop an A8? Thoughts

You are not the only one hoping that this designer brings out another OO product - or three. As he is ex-Bachmann I did wonder if his somewhat exotic first subject choice related to this background, as it is a very logical tank loco adjunct to Bachmann's three Robinson tender locos.

 

So my feeling is that unless the designer is a total fan for beefy pacific tanks it would be a very unlikely next OO subject choice. (And there's little to develop from: just because the A5 is a pacific tank, the current demand for very high fidelity makes starting from scratch the preferred course. Elements such as the drive and running gear layout are all generated in CAD after input of dimensions; and even the neat way in which the cab top is secured to be removeable on the A5 wouldn't readily carry over, because the different layout of the A8 with the full width cab side finished as one piece with the tank and bunker side would make the join difficult to disguise.)

 

What other obvious gaps did Bachmann leave thaqt competotors haven't pounced on? LNWR and NER mixed traffic designs, and a GNR 0-6-0 would top my list.

 

 

[micklner]

They could easily bring out a A5/2 which was used in the LNER and BR North East area with reduced height fittings. A lot cheaper to make than a all new Loco as well.

Edited February 25 by micklner

[RichardT]

It would be lovely if Sonic could get around to producing the A5 in their N range before doing another product for the incredibly over-supplied 4mm market…especially as there’s already a 4mm kit for an A8. (Tongue partially in-cheek: I know they’d be daft to ignore the market opportunities in 4mm; but it’s still mildly irritating when we get a new manufacturer in N who them promptly diverts effort into 00! Especially given current glacial delivery timescales.)

 

RichardT

Edited February 25 by RichardT

[34theletterbetweenB&D]

11 minutes ago, RichardT said:

I know they’d be daft to ignore the market opportunities in 4mm; but it’s still mildly irritating when we get a new manufacturer in N who them promptly diverts effort into 00!

The necessity to put food on the table and have enough left over for future projects may have some bearing on this?

[RichardT]

59 minutes ago, 34theletterbetweenB&D said:

The necessity to put food on the table and have enough left over for future projects may have some bearing on this?

When will I learn that tone just doesn’t come across in online comments. 🤣🤣🤣

 

RichardT

[Silver Sidelines]

On 22/08/2023 at 09:04, K Hatton said:

 

 It can be sat idling with sound on fine but go to pull away and it moves 2-3mm then cuts out dead? Given a poke/prod the whole procedure repeats.

 

It's usually fine when the wheels are turning but just stalls when setting off. 

 

As usual I am late to the party. 

 

I have been attempting to run these models with the lid off.  This removes a lot of weight.  It is soon apparent that the springing in front and rear pony trucks is mega strong with a tendancy to lift the driving wheels off the track.  Without the body on mine cuts out in all manner of places.  It is a rigid six coupled mechanism and the cutting out issue may simply be down to a loss of rail contact.  As an aside the springing arrangement for the front truck is hardly fit for purpose.  There is a small diameter 'washer' that is supposed to fit inside the spring.  My spring is too  large a diameter to grip the washer and the whole spring arrangement has a tendancy to jam up inside the bogie.  I have removed the Sonic washer and replaced it with a standard shiny steel washer on top of the spring and between the spring and bogie.  It seems to work fine, the bogie rotates perfectly and I think there is less tendancy for the bogie to lift the driving wheels.

 

Cheers  Ray

[RogerTE]

On 25/02/2024 at 13:54, OOgaugeJaf said:

Is there a plan to do another run?

 

could the A5 be the basis to develop an A8? Thoughts

I , for various reasons, have not been in a position to purchase one until now, but it looks like all the GCR-liveried ones are sold out.

 

I contacted SONIC and they have replied there are no plans to do another run.

[OOgaugeJaf]

On 06/03/2024 at 12:56, RogerTE said:

I , for various reasons, have not been in a position to purchase one until now, but it looks like all the GCR-liveried ones are sold out.

 

I contacted SONIC and they have replied there are no plans to do another run.

Ebay it is for another BR version. If they come up

[34theletterbetweenB&D]

On 05/03/2024 at 14:15, Silver Sidelines said:

It is soon apparent that the springing in front and rear pony trucks is mega strong with a tendency to lift the driving wheels off the track. 

The Sonic model's mechanism was something of a Bachmann nostalgia trip in this respect, both the split chassis and early Blue Riband steam introductions had this characteristic 'oversprung carrying wheels' tendency. I still remember what a pleasant surprise it was on my first purchase of a 'softly sprung carrying wheels' Bachmann model: the very fine Fairburn 2-6-4T. Ah, no need to dismantle and cut down the spring.

 

Downside of course was no further supply of spare coil spring pieces to place on Hornby loco bogies: their assembly diagrams may have shown a spring, but it would be another decade before Hornby's contractors regularly found the 'springs box' and detailed an assembly operative to install one...

 

On 06/03/2024 at 12:56, RogerTE said:

I contacted SONIC and they have replied there are no plans to do another run.

Buit while the tooling exists there is always hope. Quite a lot of activity now in the 'tooled by Brand X, now on offer via Brand Y' department 

[drt7uk]

Sorry if this has been covered already...but does anyone else have a running plate that's slightly bent, causing the side panels to the rear of the cab to go slightly up on either side...and have you done anything to correct this?

 

I'm not brave enough to take mine apart for fear of breaking it, especially since the GCR version isn't available any more