Is ordering directly from Hornby the best option?

[Robin Brasher]

If Hornby charges the full price but honours that price at the date of the order this may be cheaper than ordering from a shop with a 10% discount if the price rises by more than 10% before Hornby delivers the model.

 

The picture shows a Lord of the Isles locomotive that Hornby is planning to resurrect in the RS48 Victorian set which is due in 2022.  

[AY Mod]

I wouldn't be able to look the shopkeeper of my local in the eye if I did; he always plays fair by me and the benefits are better than price-hunting or hedging.

[Black 5 Bear]

Infact, Derails of Coleford didn't implement the Hornby January 10% hike on pre-ordered items to their credit.

Additionally, locos are tested and inspected prior to despatch which negates the necessity to return items in most cases.

I know where I'd rather spend my cash and that's with a small/independent.

 

 

[Johan DC]

Since Brexit it is (for me at least) mostly the cheapest option. But I refuse to, so or I take the extra cost (about £25 each time) or I have it delivered to a friend, and pick it up there. Or have my father bring it when he goes to the UK. Sometimes Hattons can be an option, since they are registred here as well. Not aware of any other shop. 

[SamThomas]

Bottom line is not always the most cost effective/most enjoyable experience in the long run.

 

Unless absolutely everything you buy*** is from Hornby then you need to support your independant stores.

 

*** Track, Lineside Accessories, Buildings, Scenics & DCC Equipment.

[Bulleidboy100]

I have bought from many of the usual major outlets over the years, but more recently have bought directly from Hornby. I have been a Hornby Club member for very many years, and they have recently reintroduced the 10% discount for Club members and you get free postage on orders over £50. I know many retailers will give you 10% discount, but how many honour the price as at the time of the order, which Hornby do - this is important as some orders may not arrive for twelve months (or more), by which time the price may have increased.  I placed a couple of orders with Hornby following their 2022 announcements, and have now received (email) two vouchers, each one offering 12.5% discount off my next orders - these vouchers are valid until the end of April. This discount is not additional to the Club 10%. Also with the recent "tier" system as far as certain retailers are concerned, ordering with Hornby means you will get your loco. I do also buy from my two local model railway outlets.

Edited January 23, 2022 by Bulleidboy100
amendment

[SamThomas]

11 hours ago, Bulleidboy100 said:

 I know many retailers will give you 10% discount, but how many honour the price as at the time of the order, which Hornby do -

If Hornby honoured the trade price then the retailers could honour the price in turn.

 

If a retailer sold with a 10% discount to the customer, paid Hornby 10% more for the stock & sent the items shipping free (via a compentant service provide) he would not be making very much money at all.

 

Hornby are giving nothing away - they are simply taking the retailers margin & making the same as they would with trade sales.

 

n.b. Figures quoted are only guesswork.

[PaulRhB]

Unfortunately I was forced into ordering direct for the APT by their late cancellation of my retailers allocation. No one else had the full set by then. Hornby wants you to go direct by their shenanigans but personally I’ve put in my pre orders with the usual shops. 

[Edge]

I buy from Kernow and Hattons mostly, but my W1 was a purchase directly from Hornby because my pre-order was cancelled and it was already sold out everywhere else.

 

 It’s horses for courses as far as I am concerned. Hornby guarantee availability but almost never discount anything whereas the retailers can usually give a discount but can’t guarantee the availability because of the nature of things now.

 

not sure that there can be a hard and fast ‘rule’ for how to get cheaper. Just play it by ear with the items you want

Edited January 24, 2022 by Edge

[jcredfer]

Interesting, I thought that Hornby had stopped messing about with the shop allocations, after they calculated that they were burning their own fingers by doing so.  Was the APT late cancellation a one-off, or have I simply missed the trend returning?

 

 

[PaulRhB]

6 minutes ago, jcredfer said:

Interesting, I thought that Hornby had stopped messing about with the shop allocations, after they calculated that they were burning their own fingers by doing so.  Was the APT late cancellation a one-off, or have I simply missed the trend returning?

 

 

Done with APT and W1 so they are very much still doing it. 

[Geep7]

Unfortunately I seem to have had my hand forced into pre-ordering direct from Hornby, but not for the UK outline releases. It appears that there is no UK stockist of Electrotren where I can do a pre-order, so unless I order from a model shop in Europe (and all the complexity that entails), I now have no option but to order direct from Hornby's website.

[GeoffBird]

14 hours ago, Johan DC said:

Since Brexit it is (for me at least) mostly the cheapest option. But I refuse to, so or I take the extra cost (about £25 each time) or I have it delivered to a friend, and pick it up there. Or have my father bring it when he goes to the UK. Sometimes Hattons can be an option, since they are registred here as well. Not aware of any other shop. 

 

 

I live in Austria so I tend to use Hattons a lot as they use IOSS . which means that for items under €130 I can pay the UK vat and nothing else when it arrives here in Austria.

[SamThomas]

2 hours ago, Geep7 said:

Unfortunately I seem to have had my hand forced into pre-ordering direct from Hornby, but not for the UK outline releases. It appears that there is no UK stockist of Electrotren where I can do a pre-order, so unless I order from a model shop in Europe (and all the complexity that entails), I now have no option but to order direct from Hornby's website.

Any Gaugemaster stockist can order & pre-order Electrotren, Lima, Rivarossi or Jouef.

[Legend]

Answering directly the OP ....No but sometimes its the only option . They seem to have made it that way . Coronation rolling stock for instance . Seems very limited availability . couldnt find any shops with availability  so the only place ...........Hornby . Left a bitter taste though and certainly will use as last resort 

 

Just as an adendum . I would usually have used Rails or Hattons both of whom offer really good service and packaging in my opinion . The fact I cant use them really hacks me off . 

Edited January 24, 2022 by Legend

[Pete the Elaner]

I would rather use my regular model shop.

They inspect all locos & run them on their test track before selling. They also stock a large range of manufacturers.

I value the service they provide so I will support them by shopping there.

 

I can remember when most towns had a model shop & it was nice to browse around & see what they had, both new & second hand. It is also nice to have a close look at a model before buying. You cannot do that from a few photos on a computer screen.

There are a few exceptions but most of us have helped to kill off many local shops by being keen to make small savings.

 

[Geep7]

53 minutes ago, SamThomas said:

Any Gaugemaster stockist can order & pre-order Electrotren, Lima, Rivarossi or Jouef.

I'd forgotten about Gaugemaster, however, having just looked, if price was a factor, I wouldn't be saving much by ordering from them than direct. I would be saving 4p, at current pre-order price of course.

[AY Mod]

20 minutes ago, Pete the Elaner said:

I would rather use my regular model shop.

 

Online retailers don't know how many sugars I like in my tea. I know Arkwright only does it so I wander round and pick other stuff up whilst he serves others thus recovering the cost of boiling the kettle. There's always a tub of sweets on the counter and buying on the 'net doesn't give me snippets of gossip whilst I browse. I'd have to pay good money to be similarly entertained elsewhere.

 

[The Stationmaster]

In view of the way they treat retailers I'd sooner go without rather than order anything direct from Hornby.  Hornby have brought that on themselves and it's not just the rationing but also partially through their own incompetence in dealing with retailers orders.

 

But the boot on the other foot.  Think about going into, or contacting, your regular retailer to ask for a couple of bits of track and a packet of rail joiners and when he asks if you're interested in buying the new Dean Single set because he has some in stock you have to tell him that you got yours 'direct' from Hornby.  I doubt you'd be offered a cuppa after that conversation.

[Black 5 Bear]

2 hours ago, Legend said:

Answering directly the OP ....No but sometimes its the only option . They seem to have made it that way . Coronation rolling stock for instance . Seems very limited availability . couldnt find any shops with availability  so the only place ...........Hornby . Left a bitter taste though and certainly will use as last resort 

 

Just as an adendum . I would usually have used Rails or Hattons both of whom offer really good service and packaging in my opinion . The fact I cant use them really hacks me off . 

And in the case of the new Caprotti Black Five, it's a "Web Special Release" which is only available through the Hornby website.

 

 

Edited January 24, 2022 by Black 5 Bear

[JSpencer]

My thoughts on this is that direct sales takes a good deal of infrastructure and they need to secure X amount through it to justify it's existence. The previous team set this up, MAYBE thinking it could from their existing Business 2 Business infrastructure and the business case for such could have looked quite pretty.

I am surprised the new team, when they took back stock handling back in house, that they did not dispose of the direct sales thing at the same time (or trimmed it down) and focused more on getting stuff out into shops.

Forcing a market into something they don't want leaves you wide open to the competition. I do not have any stress pre-ordering items made by any other manufacturer out there. 

[Hilux5972]

My “local” model shop is a 2 hour drive away. I prefer to now order direct from Hornby for certain items to guarantee that I get them at the original price, ie the 9F, 2007, photographic grey 10000, but for other items such as track etc I will order from my local shop.
Everyone has their own preference as to where they order from, and no one should be forced to feel bad about not going through their local shops. 

[The Stationmaster]

53 minutes ago, Black 5 Bear said:

And in the case of the Hornby Caprotti Black Five, it's a "Web Special Release" which is only available through the website.

 

 

Which explains why I won't be buying one. (Although I won't be buying any of their Black 5s until I've seen that they are proved capable of correctly matching running numbers with the correct boiler and detail fittings because Black 5 are even worse than Western engines for their detail variations.)

 

5 minutes ago, Hilux5972 said:

My “local” model shop is a 2 hour drive away. I prefer to now order direct from Hornby for certain items to guarantee that I get them at the original price, ie the 9F, 2007, photographic grey 10000, but for other items such as track etc I will order from my local shop.
Everyone has their own preference as to where they order from, and no one should be forced to feel bad about not going through their local shops. 

My nearest 'local' model shop is just over a 1 hour drive away but it does give the car a run.  My other 'local' model shop is half a dozen counties away so I visit less often although I use their excellent mail order service.  But a visit in person is a very good reason to take a long distance train ride passing some marvellous scenery on the way making a very pleasant day out.  As with all things if we don't use what 'local' model shops we do have we might well find ourselves kissing them goodbye as has happened to so many of them.

[GeoffBird]

I lived in Austria and have justs read this notice on the Hornby website that wiil be of interest to anyone living in the EU purchasing from Hornby:-

 

"We are happy to introduce a newly improved and convenient means of purchasing your favourite Hornby products online for addresses in the EU.

 

Once you enter an EU address into the website and set it as the default one, all product prices will show in Euros every time you revisit and log into your account. The final price paid will be shown and charged in Euros, meaning no unexpected currency exchange fees on your payment card.

 

At Hornby, we comply with 1st July EU VAT simplification rules. This means that the final price you pay for your purchase also includes your delivery country’s VAT/IVA rate and import duty costs. We also pay the local VAT direct to your government. This means you can await your order’s arrival with peace of mind knowing there will be no surprise charges or fees upon delivery."

  

[adb968008]

I placed my first order on Hornbys website in 2014, same year, but before Simon left Hornby.  The order itself was heavily discounted.

I have over 100 orders on their website (including quite a few cancelations), all sizes from £20 upwards.

 

The advantages at the time was 10% club membership discount, and prices being honoured at time of order through to delivery, an example being 2 years waiting for Pecketts that arrived £20 cheaper than advertised. That said the high street was competitive and prices much cheaper, bargains were everywhere, including some on Hornby.com

 

I stopped pre-ordering in 2018, when Hornby ended their online discounting, ended the 10% club offer and made statements around supporting the high street. This coincided with the ending of mass discounting by retailers. I  didnt pre-order much anywhere in 2018/9 as there was no need.. price wasn't locked, the market uncompetitive and supplies were plentiful.

I restarted some pre-orders from Hornby and retailers in 2020 when supplies were looking risky and foresaw what was coming with pricing and decided to hedge some orders, similarly canceling some orders when my retailer was able to confirm price/supply in 2021, though some remain.

 

For 2022, specifically with Hornby, I think their approach is wrong this year. After getting burned in week 1, ive pretty much rolled back out of 2022, and except for a few items I’m going to take a hands off approach and see what it looks like in price, quality and demand when it shows up.
 

I don’t trust Hornby any more, and I prefer to risk missing out than get mugged one way or another.

 

So Is it reliable ?

Heres what my experience has given me…

Hornby.com positives:

1. it is a hedge against prices, it holds no matter how long it takes, theyve never raised a price on me, and never not been able to supply.

2. with the club discount in place it is the same price or better than the high street.

3. you get the new released goods before the retailer does in many cases.

 

Hornby.com negatives:

1. Getting it is no guarantee its working or undamaged, ive had more returns to Hornby, than any other retailer. (I should add I have more Hornby returns to retailers than all other manufacturers combined too), Hornby wins all leagues on returns, without doubt.

 

2. My experience of customer care is it doesn't really care about the customer.

Be prepared for a very long frustrated test of your patience… though being fair.. its always resolved in the end, but that end can feel as long as a pre-order takes to arrive.

 

3. Ive found Its not worth while for pre-orders of small items bought as “1” of.. such as wagons. coaches. Thats because combined baskets of pre-orders are broken out as single item orders, and if under £50 each then attracts its own postage… I immediately cancel a pre-order as soon as I see this happen… being fair some big retailers do this too.

 

compared to a retailer:

 

positives:

1. The right retailers test everything before sending.

2. The right retailers reserve the item in advance, and hold it for you when ready.

3. The right retailers will work with you on price / postage.

 

negatives:

1. Less good retailers don't test, and just send the item unchecked.

2. Less good retailers have no price loyalty, even if pre-paid and may ask for additional funds before release, and no loyalty to hold items for you… in one case I prepaid and nothing came, 2 months after release I followed up to be told it was sold out, the price rose £20 so they just sold mine and didn't inform me.. I then spent 2 months forcing a refund of my money.

3. Less good retailers don't combine postage / shirk returns.

 

fwiw, I don't have an easy to get to shop (ie nothing that isn't a 4 hour round trip), so I am reliant online, unless I goto a show, or plan a specific day out or just happen to be passing a shop.

 

I split my pre-orders generally around 4 retailers whom I trust, 1 whom gets my bulk business of all manufacturers. Happy to work with me on all the positives above and I like to upgrade my order each time I call for extras as a result.  Then 3 other regulars as useful back up whom occasionally are faster (and hold my credit card details). I have conservatively purchased one off,  adhoc or occasionally from around 50 shops (not inc ebay), most of which were pleasant, in the last 2 decades.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited January 24, 2022 by adb968008