Hornby Caledonian Single - how to make more realistic

[drt7uk]

I just got the most recent Hornby Caledonian Single to go with my Rails Class 812, mostly because I was after the coaches. It's a smart model but I've been reluctant to get it in the past because I do dislike the front bogie...

 

Has anyone else modified theirs to get rid of the hideous gap, and make it look a bit more realistic?

 

This is what the real thing looks like at the front:

 

Any advice welcome! thank you

Edited April 25, 2022 by drt7uk
Incorrect name

[Michael Hodgson]

I can see the temptation as it is an attractive loco in a very pretty livery.  Good for its time, but I'm not sure how well it will sit with the modern standards of 812

 

If you fabricated bogie splashers, surely that should at least hide the worst of the gap.  I don't know how that would impact running reliability especially on sharper curves though.

 

 

[Legend]

Looks like there is space to fit some sort of splashers  . I have the seventies model , I’d maybe be inclined just to build the bogie base up a bit using plasticard and painting black , just to hide the gap .  You just need to watch you retain some vertical movement if you have inclines 
 

Fortunately  I managed to get the rake of coaches separately off of eBay . 

Edited April 20, 2022 by Legend

[Wheatley]

I agree, some representation of the bogie splashers mounted on some dummy frames might work. I wouldn't mount them on the bogie, rather, make them rigid but high enough to clear the wheels. The bogie wheels look finer than my 1970s one at least !

 

I have the LRM kit and I have no idea yet how I'm going to make scale splashers work with 3rd rad curves. Rigid front and rear axles and a lot of side play on the others is one option (ie treat it as you would a long 0-8-0), but probably not practicable on the Hornby one. 

[60800]

This and the Midland Spinner are at the top of my list for Steam locos desperate for a 21st century tooling.

 

For me the gap between bogie and running plate is not the biggest issue as some splashers / dummy frames are easy to make - it's the slab sides of the boiler behind the smokebox that have always put me off it.

 

Cheers,

  60800

[johnd]

2 minutes ago, 60800 said:

This and the Midland Spinner are at the top of my list for Steam locos desperate for a 21st century tooling.

 

For me the gap between bogie and running plate is not the biggest issue as some splashers / dummy frames are easy to make - it's the slab sides of the boiler behind the smokebox that have always put me off it.

 

Cheers,

  60800

 

The Midland spinner sounds good, I'd go for one of them.

[Moxy]

There's an article in Railway Modeller for June 1979, entitled 'Minor surgery to an old lady,' which covers improvements to the then Triang Caledonian Single.  I presume the current R2610 is the same body moulding.

 

One of the reasons for its strange looks it is around 6mm too long, which the article addresses by telling you where to shorten the body, but the author also shortened the front bogie and moved its pivot point back a bit.  That's a bit more than what I would class as 'minor' surgery,  but it might be worth looking the article up if anyone is interested in doing the conversion.

[Bon Accord]

Some years ago one of the members here made some modifications to their CR123 with a view to improving the looks, this included modifying the bogie amongst other things.

I'm pretty sure it was Kingfisher24 as he has tackled a number of Scottish subjects both kitbashes and RTR rebuilds, however the photographs on his blogposts have been lost with the server migration.

Might be worth sending him a PM?

[Steamport Southport]

On 21/04/2022 at 13:16, Bon Accord said:

Some years ago one of the members here made some modifications to their CR123 with a view to improving the looks, this included modifying the bogie amongst other things.

I'm pretty sure it was Kingfisher24 as he has tackled a number of Scottish subjects both kitbashes and RTR rebuilds, however the photographs on his blogposts have been lost with the server migration.

Might be worth sending him a PM?

 

I have a feeling that was using the Amercom GBL copy so might be in the lengthy GBL thread. Personally I feel less guilty about cutting those up.

 

 

BTW it was the Midland ones that were called Spinners, this was just known as The Single or 123. I don't think it suffered with the "spinning" problem the MR ones had when starting trains.

 

 

Jason

[drt7uk]

On 21/04/2022 at 09:30, 60800 said:

This and the Midland Spinner are at the top of my list for Steam locos desperate for a 21st century tooling.

 

For me the gap between bogie and running plate is not the biggest issue as some splashers / dummy frames are easy to make - it's the slab sides of the boiler behind the smokebox that have always put me off it.

 

Cheers,

  60800

 

Thanks, how would you go about making the splashers if you were me?

[33C]

How about using the mudguards from an Airfix, 88mm gun, trimmed and shaped and stuck to an H shaped piece of plasticard to sit on the bogie. Cut a slot in the centre of the H to accommodate the pivot or remove the rivet completely so the swing arm sits on top, drill through the H, replace the rivet and superglue at the bottom so it still swings. (or use a longer bolt/nut.) 

[60800]

4 hours ago, drt7uk said:

 

Thanks, how would you go about making the splashers if you were me?

I'd have a solid rectangular block of plastic as the core for strength, then I'd make each frame / splasher side out of plasticard and glue them onto the block, which would be glued to the underside of the loco body.

 

This discussion is actually making me look at buying one, so I'll document what I do if I do.

 

Cheers,

  60800

[drt7uk]

So as an update, I've stuck a small black car wheel balance weight and a couple of layers of black plasticard to reduce the gap between the front bogie and the chasis.

 

Following @60800's advice I've now designed some spashers on photoshop using this graphic that someone else had helpfully uploaded.

 

The splashers are 43mm wide. I've calculated that there is 3mm to play with without the wheels hitting any splashers. I've made 2 different versions, one that is 5mm high at the very ends, which is more prototypical in shape, and one that is 3mm (level with the straight line bar in the middle). Ideally the 5mm version will work fine but I suspect it will still catch the wheels. Let's see.

 

I'll print on white card at work tomorrow, and stick to the ends of the black weight. If that's too flimsy I'll stick the white card to a bit of black plasticard and then stick that to the black weight.

 

Will let you know how I get on. If anyone wants to download the graphic, here is the link to download from google drive that (unlike the below image) is A5 in size at 600 DPI. If you open up an A4 Word document you'll be able to print two of these horizontally and they should print out the correct 43mm x 3/5mm size. 

[60800]

@drt7uk

 

Much more technical than my approach would have been haha - thankyou for the templates. 

 

My project is being delayed slightly as I've just managed to get a Midland Compound (NRM 1000)

 

Would you be able to take a photo of the single with the body off please? I'd like to see how easy / hard it's going to be to modify the chassis to allow the boiler to be made fully round behind the smokebox.

 

Cheers,

  60800

[Ruffnut Thorston]

The main reasons for the dimensional discrepancies of the Caley Single are the usual Tri-ang Railways increased buffer beam height, and being made to fit on the same chassis block as the previously released Lord Of The Isles model...

 

For an illustration of the chassis block, there were some in this Great British Locomotive Collection post of mine that detailed the modifications made to the GBL body, that was "inspired" by the Tri-ang Railways model...but the photos are missing just now...🤷‍♀️

 

 

So, there seem to be only a few Service Sheets covering this chassis, and all feature the Lord Of The Isles model.

 

The motor is inside the boiler...

 

 

The later DCC ready models use a modified chassis block...

 

 

 

Edited April 27, 2022 by Ruffnut Thorston
Link added. Additional information

[No Decorum]

This is a little more up to date. I have sheet 313B but I can’t attach it for some reason.

https://www.lendonsmodelshop.co.uk/pdf/Hornby Service Sheets/No.313C Caledonian 4-2-2.pdf

Edited April 28, 2022 by No Decorum
The link works so workaround removed.

[drt7uk]

Here's an update. Not bad. I've not tested yet, but appears to clear the wheels without snagging.

 

I might try and reprint them 3mm less wide, as I think the splashers look a bit too stretched.

 

What do others think?

[drt7uk]

On 25/04/2022 at 22:42, 60800 said:

@drt7uk

Would you be able to take a photo of the single with the body off please? I'd like to see how easy / hard it's going to be to modify the chassis to allow the boiler to be made fully round behind the smokebox.

 

Cheers,

  60800

 

Apologies but I'm not able to remove the body now because of the way I've stuck the splashers + weights on. But I know Sam's Trains have done a video on how to repair the Triang one if you search his channel.

[Wheatley]

Nice. Agree about the splashers needing to be  a bit shorter. 

[Ruffnut Thorston]

9 hours ago, No Decorum said:

This is a little more up to date. I have sheet 313B but I can’t attach it for some reason.

https://www.lendonsmodelshop.co.uk/pdf/Hornby Service Sheets/No.313C Caledonian 4-2-2.pdf

 

Here it is. Thanks for the link. 🙂

Hornby have a Dean fixation! 

The real loco has nothing to do with Mr. Dean.😉

Edited April 29, 2022 by Ruffnut Thorston
Typo

[phil-b259]

9 hours ago, drt7uk said:

Here's an update. Not bad. I've not tested yet, but appears to clear the wheels without snagging.

 

I might try and reprint them 3mm less wide, as I think the splashers look a bit too stretched.

 

What do others think?

 

 

Pretty good - but I feel it would have looked even better to have found a way of building a support structure on top of the bogie itself and then stick them to that rather than on the underside of the body.

[JohnR]

Is it worth replacing the bogie wheels with ones with a finer flange - it is quite prominent.

[drt7uk]

3 hours ago, phil-b259 said:

 

 

Pretty good - but I feel it would have looked even better to have found a way of building a support structure on top of the bogie itself and then stick them to that rather than on the underside of the body.

 

It's a good point but that could also look weird going around corners too. Fundamental problem is the way the bogie is attached to the chasis, on that weird little arm.

 

An alternative would be to have it attached to the chasis directly above it. If I could be confident that would allow it to go around 3rd radius curves (accepting that it won't handle anything tighter than that) then maybe that's something worth doing.

 

@JohnR good point re the flanges.

[Halvarras]

4 hours ago, JohnR said:

Is it worth replacing the bogie wheels with ones with a finer flange - it is quite prominent.

 

Only if @drt7uk has a pot of Caledonian Blue paint, a very fine brush and a very steady hand......or knows somebody who has.

(Which is not impossible of course!)

[drt7uk]

Update - made them narrower...think they look pretty good now, all things considered.