N Gauge Class 44 - with 45 & 46 to follow...

[D9020 Nimbus]

22 hours ago, frobisher said:

 

I suspect it is easier to use the 44 CAD as a basis to develop to the 45 and 46 than the other way around.  Also the 44 doesn't have the multitude of variants the other two have, so they can concentrate on getting them spot on without distraction.

 

Also, in my experience almost anyone who wants Peaks can justify to themselves the odd 44 in the mix "just because".

I know there are quite a few variants of 45s — split boxes, "paired" centre boxes, sealed beam marker lights — but I thought the 46s all had centre headcode boxes, so there are just real headcodes and domino headcodes to allow for.

[Covkid]

23 hours ago, D9020 Nimbus said:

I find the logic of doing the 44 first and moving on to the others only if it sells well totally baffling. There were only 10 44s and they were restricted for most of their lives to freight work on the ex-Midland. The 45s and 46s were much more numerous and widespread.

 

I have no need for a 44 but would definitely be interested in a 46, as there were quite a few based at my local depot (Gateshead). The days when I might purchase a loco to encourage others to be developed — given current economic conditions — have gone, I'm afraid. If you don't make a 46, hopefully Farish will. If not, I can get my existing Farish 46, currently laid up with split gears, repaired if needed.

 

I just do not see how sales of a model of a class of ten locos can determine what the sales would be for the remaining 183—you might as well use the sales of the class 28 as a guide!

 

22 hours ago, frobisher said:

 

I suspect it is easier to use the 44 CAD as a basis to develop to the 45 and 46 than the other way around.  Also the 44 doesn't have the multitude of variants the other two have, so they can concentrate on getting them spot on without distraction.

 

Also, in my experience almost anyone who wants Peaks can justify to themselves the odd 44 in the mix "just because".

 

I am in agreement with the sentiment about using the class 44 as the sounding board for the "Peak" project.  I don't have a 4mm class 44 and don't intend to, but do have a couple of 45s and will have a 46 eventually.  And I model South Staffs which was one of the class 44's last jobs on Toton- Bescots and Toton Whitemoors. 

 

I am sure Rapidoandy already knows this but the large bodyside grille is a different size / length to that of the 45 and 46 so is not a simple set of files to edit.  From a personal matter of opinion I would have selected the 46 as the one to produce as I think all 56 of them had the triangular grille under the main one.  Their scope was literally Penzance Immingham and Kings Cross-Aberdeen on practically anything hooked on the drawbar from heavy coal trains, speedlink, summer saturday holiday trains, overnight parcels and sleepers, weekend ballasts - literally anything.  I actually recall back in 1979 or 1980 a pair being used for bridge testing.   Green and blue with one named.  A good choice in my view    

[frobisher]

1 hour ago, D9020 Nimbus said:

but I thought the 46s all had centre headcode boxes, so there are just real headcodes and domino headcodes to allow for.

 

Which does make them a little more complicated than the 44s :)  The basic shape of the 44 underlies the other two was my thinking.  Get that right and you're golden.  Making/moving holes/grills on that is relatively simple from a CAD point of view.

[BernardTPM]

Will it have the typically rippled side panels? (Yes, I might be acting as Devil's advocate here...)

[Flying Pig]

41 minutes ago, BernardTPM said:

Will it have the typically rippled side panels? (Yes, I might be acting as Devil's advocate here...)

 

Only on DCC-fitted models where the ripples will be digitally controlled in order that no two locos look identical.

[Marke]

Just wanted to record my thumbs up for this development…despite the pain it will inflict on my wallet. Great to see Rapido now proposing to produce the Peak series of locos which are bit more mainstream than the class 28. It’s been a good couple of months for N Gauge announcements. 

[Cowley 47521]

I can think of at least three of us in my group of friends that’ll be each buying a class 45 in 1980s condition when they come out. Great news. 

[Colossus]

I have to add my t’u’pp’nyworth. Absolutely delighted about this announcement. My chosen era is 1969-73 and  I’d begun to give up on a prospect of an up to date (ie re-tooled)  ‘Peak’ to appearing...

 

I personally haven’t been craving a 44 as their more restricted routes are not central to my needs (without the a Rule 1 card being heavily thumbed) but CAD images and the prospect of a really sharp model could change all that. Oh but classic split-box and central split box 45s in pre TOPS blue or later green...bring em on! I’ll have four or five..They have to happen now surely? It would be a cruel world that produced a class 44 then abandoned  the project there.

Very excited @rapidoandy

Edited September 12, 2022 by Colossus

[Hal Nail]

On 11/09/2022 at 16:21, D9020 Nimbus said:

but I thought the 46s all had centre headcode boxes, so there are just real headcodes and domino headcodes to allow for.

Some were built with central split headcodes before having a central fitted and like the 45 they got marker lights later. Loads of other changes through their life as well.

[Colossus]

A question primarily for Andy at Rapido @rapidoandy   ..but also for anyone who can answer this. And I don’t want to hijack the thread and can discuss elsewhere if requested to do so.

I refer you all to the fascinating photo of D6 Whernside [ edit! I mean D5 Cross Fell”!].. on the Rapido ‘class 44 page’ on website . I just noticed she’s coupled to a bulk ale tank in Bass Worthington livery. My initial question Andy, do you have details of the date and location of the photo please ?

Secondly, does anyone know definitively what working this might be? My specialist subject is Burton beer& brewery railway history (esp Bass Worthington whom Dad worked for). I know these ale tanks were detachable and movable onto road vehicles; and that in the mid-sixties when ale in cask was beginning to move away from rail to road, there remained a regular flow of bulk ale to Belgium where it would have been bottled for sale there.
It’s likely this was a beer train or a partial beer train (obviously from or to Burton) and also likely it was export beer via London (perhaps Dock Junc. by St Pancras) or Southampton where bulk ale for the continent had been sent by Bass). There was a SX 0650 Horninglow Sidings (Burton)-Dock Jn (St Pancras) in 1961. But I’m more sketchy on ale trains by the mid/late 60s as Bass prepared to abandon ale by rail in mid 1967. Any answers from anyone would be great.

Edited September 13, 2022 by Colossus

[Flying Pig]

Remarkable the interest you can glean from the presence of a single wagon in a photo, @Colossus.  The caption mentions none of that (doesn't even refer to the obviously unusual wagon type) and misses the open boiler filler hatch on D5 and what appear to be the results of a radiator leak.

[Colossus]

I’ve managed to find what appears to be another (B&W) pic on Flickr of seemingly the same train. Seems the pic is at Derby and is in 1968- the year after theBass internal railway system closed which tells me the tank will have been loaded onto the rail wagon from a road vehicle and also explains the particular red livery and type style which looked too modern for mid sixties and were of the sort adopted after the ‘Bass Charrington’ merger in 1967.

It seems to be pointing south in the pic- is it? Anyone?

[woodenhead]

A thread on wandering class 44s, might help those who want a 45 but need to justify a 44 first.

 

[Halvarras]

On 12/09/2022 at 21:21, Hal Nail said:

Some were built with central split headcodes before having a central fitted and like the 45 they got marker lights later. Loads of other changes through their life as well.

 

D138-173 were originally built with split centre headcode panels and no exposed lower 'triangular' grilles. The latter may have applied to all Class 46s as built but a quick search through a couple of likely sources failed to confirm and I have to go.....

[Andy_C]

What’s the guesstimate RRP for a 44 DCC ready (I’ve pre-ordered one anyway)….

[rogerzilla]

On 11/09/2022 at 17:56, BernardTPM said:

Will it have the typically rippled side panels? (Yes, I might be acting as Devil's advocate here...)

That's always the problem with models of the Bulleid Q1.  The really hideous nature of the Q1 prototype depends on rippled cladding.  Models look far too nice.

[jjb1970]

Although I don't do British N I might buy one of these simply because I love the peaks and running it with a rake of JRF container wagons or a JNR blue train set will annoy the purists🤣

[maq1988]

I'm happy to put my name down in the queue for these and some 45s. Its been something I've hoped other manufacturers would do for a long time - Rapido gets there first, Rapido gets my money.

[Brian-1c]

I can remember these original Peaks appearing on express trains coming into Euston and starting to replace steam on these trains.

 

I will definitely have D1, the first one I saw, plus more of the green ones.

[gavingav1]

 

These new models will feature a high-quality specification including:

Directional Lighting

Next18 Decoder Socket

High quality motor and drive mechanism for smooth running

DCC Sound option

NEM Coupler pockets

Separately fitted handrails and wipers

A selection of discs so you may apply your chosen headcode

Etched radiator fan grill with separate fan.

[The Pilotman]

It certainly looks the part and it doesn’t have the “out of gauge” buffer beam of the old Farish model. However, it’s hard to see if the body-side profile issue as mentioned by @Flying Pig has been addressed. Even if it hasn’t that won’t stop me getting 2 or 3 when they get round to doing the Class 45s and 46s.

[TomE]

A few phone pics grabbed through the perspex at Alexandra Palace. Some slight angle differences to show the profile. I think it’s looking promising so far! 
 

 

Tom. 

[woodenhead]

Looking Peaky

[Flying Pig]

Still a bit slab-sided round the cab to my eye. There should be a bit more curve to the edge of the windscreen below the rainstrip.  It's only fractions of a mm, but getting the face right is key.

[TomE]

The one thing I noticed was the rain strip is a continuous curve, whereas there are subtle changes in angle on the real thing.

 

My suspicion is that the windows are flat across the front where the outer windows should rake back very very slightly. 

 

The photo below shows this quite well - notice the slight change in angle between the drivers window and the centre pane: 

 

The areas in question highlighted:

 

 

Subtle, but noticeable in the right light. 

I appreciate these are 3D prints and it's difficult to tell sometimes if features are there or not on these at such small size but looking back at the CAD I don't think it's on there either, and it's the one area that struck me as perhaps needing a little attention. 

Edit to add, this photo shows the changes in angle of the rain strip quite nicely: 

 

 

Tom.  

Edited March 26, 2023 by TomE