N Gauge Class 44 - with 45 & 46 to follow...

[Suffolk Rob]

Far from an expert on Peaks (or much else to be honest) despite a diet of little other than 45s and 46s  on passenger services in my trainspotting days on Loughborough Station.

 

But I must say that the wire looks much better to me. To a non- expert the alternative looks far more like a compromise even though your intention is quite the opposite, especially so close to the fabulous detail in the grills.

 

Rob

[Cowley 47521]

Yes I think I prefer the wire as well. 

[Andy_C]

The wire option looks much nicer to me. However, which is the 'authentic' or 'correct' one? That's the question.

Edited January 30 by Andy_C

[Kris]

The wire handrails look so much better than the rest. 

[jjb1970]

I prefer the moulded option, on balance it captures the prototype better to my eyes.

[Duncan.]

The handrails on the right, look like the ones I remember. I worked at Tinsley,  never saw those on the left.

[Steadfast]

Peaks are well outside my modelling window, but an interesting discussion as it could shape future projects too.

 

The best argument for having the handrails moulded as part of the bodyshell I can give is the Farish 66. The original 4 door bodyshell has beautifully fine handrails, approximately scale size. The later 5 door "low emission" locos feature wire handrails that stick out way too far, have a diameter no N scale hand could wrap round and just look crude by comparison. 

 

2 pictures below, both linked from Flickr.

 

 

 

Sometimes I feel models use wire handrails and etched components not because then end result looks more like the prototype, but because its an extra on the feature bullet points. The first releases of the new Farish 31s had chunky etched roof grills for example, but the later refurbished shells changed to moulded, which is much finer and in scale.

 

I say look at each prototype on its merits and decide from there.

 

As to the question of the Peaks, I'd go for moulded as they convey the correct flat appearance of the handrails on a 44. I assume they're a separate moulded part looking at the CAD. Would they look finer if moulded as part of the bodyshell, and picked out white in decoration?

 

Just to remind us all what a 44 handrail actually looks like here's a picture linked from Flickr.

 

 

To me that's the clearest evidence yet not to use wire on the 44s - the shape of the real handrails!

 

Jo

[Steven B]

I don't really like either, but of the two CAD images I think I prefer the wire.

 

HOWEVER, rework the CAD so the handrails don't look like a ladder with the rungs removed and I'd probably opt for the moulded version. The class 66 images above show how good they can look. It's probably a little trickier with the Peaks as they're not recessed, but I'm sure your CAD designers are up for the challenge!

 

 

Steven B

[bmb5dnp1]

Hello,

    The moulded handrails for me. The cab handrails are such a significant feature on the 44s compared to class 45/46s that the wire ones would stick out like a sore thumb !

 

                  Dave

 

[jjb1970]

3 hours ago, Steadfast said:

Sometimes I feel models use wire handrails and etched components not because then end result looks more like the prototype, but because its an extra on the feature bullet points. The first releases of the new Farish 31s had chunky etched roof grills for example, but the later refurbished shells changed to moulded, which is much finer and in scale.

 

 

 

I agree, trick features, etched parts etc do not always make for a better model.

[CF MRC]

The art of small scale modelling is what you leave out, not what you put in. The moulded handrails will be far more subtle and if someone wants separate handrails then they could scrape them off and intall their interpretation of the prototype. 
 

Tim
 

[maq1988]

38 minutes ago, CF MRC said:

The art of small scale modelling is what you leave out, not what you put in. The moulded handrails will be far more subtle and if someone wants separate handrails then they could scrape them off and intall their interpretation of the prototype. 
 

Tim
 

 

Oddly I would say the opposite, I think you are far more likely to damage the surrounding bodywork scraping off a block of moulded plastic than popping out two contact points for a wire

[Grimly Feendish]

The molded ones for me. They look subtler and more prototypical. The 66 is a great example.

[CF MRC]

1 hour ago, maq1988 said:

 

Oddly I would say the opposite, I think you are far more likely to damage the surrounding bodywork scraping off a block of moulded plastic than popping out two contact points for a wire

The problem is that the holes for the handrail stanchions are in the wrong place: there wouldn’t be an overwhelming case to replace these wire handrails …..with wire. The nearest thing to prototype would be a separate etch to represent the stanchions and the handrail with the holes in the correct position. However, as they are painted anyway, I think the moulding is a good bet. 
 

Each to their own tho’…

 

Tim

Edited January 30 by CF MRC

[maq1988]

41 minutes ago, CF MRC said:

The problem is that the holes for the handrail stanchions are in the wrong place: there wouldn’t be an overwhelming case to replace these wire handrails …..with wire. The nearest thing to prototype would be a separate etch to represent the stanchions and the handrail with the holes in the correct position. However, as they are painted anyway, I think the moulding is a good bet. 
 

Each to their own tho’…

 

Tim

 

I don't fully disagree, but you swap the incorrect placement of holes of wire handrails that have a prototypical 'gap' behind them, but the wrong overall profile shape - for moulded handrails that are the right profile shape, but without the 'gap' behind them. Either is a compromise.

 

(I'm buying a few either way the handrails are done. Hopefully the 45s and 46s come along soon after. From my viewing distance I'm sure I'd never notice which way round they are 😄 )

 

 

[37081LochLong]

Going on the renders I thought that wire looked good but after reading steadfast's explanation of the 66 and studying photos I'd go for moulded!

 

I've decided to stick with OO now, so I'll no longer be getting one or two of these so I suppose my opinion doesn't count anymore but I'm still watching the project with interest 🙂

Edited January 30 by 37081LochLong

[Davexoc]

I would go for moulded, as part of the bodyshell, which is what the Farish Peak had, but the length of that was a hybrid version, starting a bit low for a 45 at the top and ending as a 44 at the bottom. They still look OK though, and if you look at this photo of D4, the 3/4 profile shows the real thing as very skinny....

 

 

Looking at the separate wire handrails on my Rapido class 28, they are a scale 6" from the body, and not always very parallel. Similarly the wire fitted Farish class 24 and 25s look a bit chunky, although apart from the front ones, sit a bit closer to the body.

Wire works better on the likes of classes 31, 47 and 56 where the body profile changes around the windows....

[Crepello]

If the wire isn’t correct and the moulded is, it’s got to be the moulded.

[melmoth]

Anyone for pre-drilled holes and etched handrails to be fitted by the purchaser?

[Roy L S]

20 minutes ago, melmoth said:

Anyone for pre-drilled holes and etched handrails to be fitted by the purchaser?

I had suggested etched handrails but Andy from Rapido didn't thing that possible. Were it to be, I would suggest that they need to be factory fitted and finished or there would be accusations of it being an "almost" ready to run model - people would (in my opinion) reasonably expect that.

 

Personally, taking the 66 above as an example and reviewing my Farish Peak model I would say moulded on handrails would make for finer ones and if picked out in white would be perfectly acceptable in the case of this specific loco class. 

 

Roy

[Benn]

Having seen what an excellent job Revolution have done with their representation of the flat strip handrails on the 128 DPU, I think that moulded handrails will work just fine.

[DavidLong]

A couple of points about the coloured illustrations. Both D2 and D5 are shown with data panels, is this likely for them in the mid to late 1960s period? There are photos of D2 in 1968 and 1969 which don't show the panels but D5 did have one by mid-1969. Perhaps do one of them with the panel and one without.

It may also have been a bit different to have D5 without the white stripe which it seems to have lost at an early date, possibly 1966 and certainly by 1967.

 

David