Hornby announce TT:120

[Flying Pig]

3 minutes ago, Hroth said:

where I would beg to differ!  A BR Green guise would have been more "iconic" and have fitted in with their steam releases, particularly the A4.  The blue livery is acceptable, but perhaps one of the post-private liveries could have been put back instead?

 

I think the choice was between blue and green for the third model.  The others have quite high 'shiny' quotients: GBRf is current and DB is attractive and possibly aimed at German collectors.  Unfortunately team 350 and team wagon seem to have got their release schedules muddled so there isn't a matched short goods train ready to go with Phase 1, which would have made a nice train set in either 1960 or 1980 guise.  It will sort itself out over time but imo its a bit of a blunder.

[BRTrainz]

My comment on Kadees had less to do with the pivot, and more to do with the Kadee design simply not being rigid enough when coupled to really work right with CCMs.

Are Dapol Easi-Shunts more rigid when coupled than Kadee/Microtrains couplings (not pivots the coupling itself)?

Having read the various replies, I think might buy a pack of Dapol couplings and see how they work (though I'm still not expecting much for my purposes).

Also planning to order a pair of the Roco/Fleischmann couplings and give them a go.

Chances are I'll just stick with the Tillig type for economy regardless, seeing as it works ok for me and 90% of the stock out there (other than old BTTB and Rokal) already has some variant fitted.

[Ravenser]

21 hours ago, Pacific231G said:

Unfortunately, unlike  Kadee (not KayDee)  for H0, Microtrains (formerly a Kadee brand till Keith and Dale Edwards split the company) haven't yet produced a Magnematic coupler for the standard NEM 355  N & TT coupler pocket (the spec is the same for both scales). Dapol though have and I'd like to know what, if any, experience of them anyone has had. Since they're the same for both scales they ought to be less obtrusive in TT than in N.

 

My limited experience with Dapol knuckle couplers in N is that they are prone to the droop illustrated earlier , and may need packing with a sliver of very thin card or 5 thou plasticard.

 

They are fairly effective but don't seem quite as certain as Kadees. I've so far struggled with delayed action . And they ae about twice the cost of HO Kadees

[britishcolumbian]

22 hours ago, Pacific231G said:

Unfortunately, unlike  Kadee (not KayDee)  for H0, Microtrains (formerly a Kadee brand till Keith and Dale Edwards split the company) haven't yet produced a Magnematic coupler for the standard NEM 355  N & TT coupler pocket (the spec is the same for both scales). Dapol though have and I'd like to know what, if any, experience of them anyone has had. Since they're the same for both scales they ought to be less obtrusive in TT than in N.

It's been several years since I've seen it but I seem to recall the Dapol coupler being slightly larger than the Microtrains N scale coupler? The MT is oversized for N scale but just about to scale for TT and so not obtrusive at all. Even the slightly larger Kadee HOn3 coupler looks fine on NorAm TT scale stock (and mates with MT without problems). I can't remember for sure but ISTR that the Dapol coupler did indeed mate with the MT as well.

 

So for North American, or Russian/ex Soviet, or Chinese/Mongolian/Korean, or Cuban outline any of the three is as good as you could want. But for models of railways that don't use an AAR or Janney coupler I'm not sure I'd go that route. It's as unprototypical as any other coupler, and to my eyes at least would look more obtrusive on Continental stock than the Tillig coupler... perhaps more so. But I'll give it a look, I have a 3D print of a 16 ton min, I'll try mounting an MT to it and see how it looks...

[Pacific231G]

4 hours ago, boxbrownie said:

No, Kadees have two pivoting pins, one for the horn and one in the mount so the whole coupling can swivel, you just stop the main swivel action for close coupling.

Indeed. The standard Kadee couplings designed for a standard NMRA draft gear box (which they often come with) can swing from side to side on the pivot pin in the box but are centred by a spring arrangement (used to be a springy brass device but now tends to be nylon whiskers) , the other spring is in the coupler head. The NEM pocket though holds the coupler shank in a fixed position so Kadee added an external pivot to enabler the coupler to work in the same way. Though they look much the same, Kadee couplers don't work in quite the same way as the AAR coupler and are actually rather more automatic. 

 

The standard ex Soviet SA-3 coupler, used on broad gauge railways throughout Russia, Mongolia and the former Soviet block  is not a Janney type (with a hinged knuckle held closed by a coupling pin that falls into place when they couple and has to be lifted to release the knuckle for uncoupling) but is based on the Willison coupler (patented by John Willison in Derby in 1916 but unknown in  Britain) that uses mating hooks that are kept together by wedges or lugs that lock them into place when they couple. They do look rater different from the AAR couplers which Kadees are designed to resemble.

this diagram  is animated here

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/d/d5/Sa3.gif

 

Willison's have long been the type favoured by the UIC in its hundred year saga  of trying and failing to get agreement on a European automatic  coupler and were, for example, used on suburban trains on the lines from Paris Gare du Nord. There they were used in conjuction with side buffers and screw link couplers so could have been as prototypical as drophead buckeyes here.

Edited November 30, 2022 by Pacific231G

[Johan DC]

For the EU residents of the TT-club, I got the badge/pin/catalogue in the mail today here in Belgium. 

[irishmail]

1 minute ago, Johan DC said:

For the EU residents of the TT-club, I got the badge/pin/catalogue in the mail today here in Belgium. 

Still waiting for mine, hopefully not too long now.

[Michanglais]

9 hours ago, britishcolumbian said:

It is.

 

Just as a word of caution when it comes to using Fleischmann Profi Couplings - they require very good, even, well-laid trackwork, extremely smooth changes in gradient, etc. or they will simply uncouple. The slightest discrepancies will cause them to randomly uncouple. 

 

I live in a small European apartment with no room for a permanent layout. I run N scale on a century-old parquet floor using Kato Unitrack. Just the slightest unevenness in the track will see half your train left behind and my good old parquet floor is now far from even. I have swapped to magnetic close-couplers, which work just fine and cope with the uneven trackwork. 

 

I believe work is on-going to produce magnetic couplings that allow for remote uncoupling but I can't swear to that and don't have any references, I'm afraid - just rumours on French train forums.

[Michanglais]

5 hours ago, irishmail said:

For those of us in the TT:120 club,  Hornby have got the second part of the Train Termial blog up in the members area.  Some nice images of the 08 and samples of the HST & Mk3 coach.

Good news re Ladders, they will be removed on the production models for the relevant versions, so Hornby do listen to feedback from' customers'.

 

Thanks for the Heads-Up!

 

The Mk3 is looking rather good (always had a soft spot for Mk3s) but I do hope they tint the glazing a little, it's such a prominent 'feature' on the real thing.

 

Time will tell... must be patient and not jump to conclusions!

 

 

[Les1952]

6 hours ago, irishmail said:

For those of us in the TT:120 club,  Hornby have got the second part of the Train Termial blog up in the members area.  Some nice images of the 08 and samples of the HST & Mk3 coach.

Good news re Ladders, they will be removed on the production models for the relevant versions, so Hornby do listen to feedback from' customers'.

 

From a conversation SK was having at Gaydon while I was standing close (earwigging again...) the ladders were never intended to be there on variants that shouldn't have them.  The models on show were livery prototypes, which don't always follow the fittings of the final version.

 

As an example the 60084 on show at Gaydon had a GN tender- right for A3s but not THAT A3, which had (and has on the production examples) a high-sided LNER tender, as seen on the front of the catalogue.

 

Les

 

Edited November 30, 2022 by Les1952
typos...

[boxbrownie]

4 hours ago, BRTrainz said:

My comment on Kadees had less to do with the pivot, and more to do with the Kadee design simply not being rigid enough when coupled to really work right with CCMs.

 

They work perfectly when modified as I described on all my CCU fitted stock.

 

I had issues with Kadees on the AS Deltic CCU components when fitted but after modding they work great, I think the AS CCU component has some stiction in some units and it causes issues.

[teletougos]

Thanks for the heads up about the  08 and HST pics on the Train Terminal blog post. 

 

Interesting with the HST, they show the machined chassis block. That kind of pic is interesting to scratchbuilders & foragers for mechanism parts. Hope they do the same with the Cl 66 (and I personally hope it's a similar design.)

 

OTOH, I haven't enabled 'Disqus' because even greyed out, I can see that folk don't half complain a lot!!  ( As you might be able to tell, have never been on a model railway company's  discussion 'community' before, but with Hornby it was necessary to have an account in order to get the discount.)

 

Do Hornby really want to invite this kind of discussion on their own platforms? Not pointing at any one individual, just the tone of it all, when my eyes run over the postings.  Sounds like it wd. quickly run your spirits down if you were the person charged with having to moderate it. 

Edited December 1, 2022 by teletougos

[boxbrownie]

2 hours ago, teletougos said:

Thanks for the heads up about the  08 and HST pics on the Train Terminal blog post. 

 

Interesting with the HST, they show the machined chassis block. That kind of pic is interesting to scratchbuilders & foragers for mechanism parts. Hope they do the same with the Cl 66 (and I personally hope it's a similar design.)

 

OTOH, I haven't enabled 'Disqus' because even greyed out, I can see that folk don't half complain a lot!!  ( As you might be able to tell, have never been on a model railway company's  discussion 'community' before, but with Hornby it was necessary to have an account in order to get the discount.)

 

Do Hornby really want to invite this kind of discussion on their own platforms? Not pointing at any one individual, just the tone of it all, when my eyes run over the postings.  Sounds like it wd. quickly run your spirits down if you were the person charged with having to moderate it. 

Yes but no deserved criticism results in less than perfect products.

 

I criticised the flanges on the pony trucks of the TT Pacific’s because they look too big, but I did say it needs to be seems in the flesh, and the final production versions before we can decide one way or the other.

 

I personally like (very much) the launch of TT120, I just hope Hornby follow through.

[BRTrainz]

17 hours ago, boxbrownie said:

They work perfectly when modified as I described on all my CCU fitted stock.

 

I had issues with Kadees on the AS Deltic CCU components when fitted but after modding they work great, I think the AS CCU component has some stiction in some units and it causes issues.

I stand corrected then.

At any rate I've gone and ordered Dapol Easi-Shunts in all three lengths to test on the CCU fitted TT stock I have.

[boxbrownie]

4 minutes ago, BRTrainz said:

I stand corrected then.

At any rate I've gone and ordered Dapol Easi-Shunts in all three lengths to test on the CCU fitted TT stock I have.

Well it probably varies to a degree by whose CCU your are using, keep us informed on the Easishunts.

 

Couplers that are perfect are the modellers dream.. 

[NCB]

What do you use for fixing set track down ? I'm looking for a means of doing it such that it's very easy to lift the track. I'm thinking of very small black self tapping screws. What do you think?

[Jeff Smith]

A lot of people use white pva - it grips enough to hold the track but can still be lifted fairly easily.  Don't use screws or pins/nails as it can distort the track.

[irishmail]

1 hour ago, NCB said:

What do you use for fixing set track down ? I'm looking for a means of doing it such that it's very easy to lift the track. I'm thinking of very small black self tapping screws. What do you think?

 

58 minutes ago, Jeff Smith said:

A lot of people use white pva - it grips enough to hold the track but can still be lifted fairly easily.  Don't use screws or pins/nails as it can distort the track.

I use PVA myself, use weights whilst drying, I used food cans laid longways in the 4'.  Advantage of PVA is if you ever want to lift the track it can be softend with a bit of water.

I have heard of others using copydex, but no experiance of that myself.

[NCB]

All of my 3 millimetre track is scratchbuilt built off board and loosely held in place with  double sided tape to keep it in place and then ballasted using PVA or similar. Easily removable it is not. I'm looking for something where I can experiment with different formations and easily keep in place without taking it up in the very short term . I have just Googled the following which I think  may do the trick. The idea is to just screw the track down lightly to avoid distortion and it should then be easily unscrewed. What do you think?

 

https://www.etsy.com/uk/listing/1210462467/model-railway-track-screws-decent?click_key=28c65675dbca2af832c0d5d71cc3539ab09478fe%3A1210462467&click_sum=23c103b9&rec_type=ss&ref=pla_similar_listing_top-2&frs=1

[Tim Dubya]

4 minutes ago, irishmail said:

 

I use PVA myself, use weights whilst drying, I used food cans laid longways in the 4'.  Advantage of PVA is if you ever want to lift the track it can be softend with a bit of water.

I have heard of others using copydex, but no experiance of that myself.

 

Copydex is ok and after experimenting with it, my only warning would be to be careful if you want to drill a hole through it, as it will wrap itself around the drill bit.  Resulting in anything stuck to it to join it's mates around your drill.

[NCB]

3 minutes ago, Tim Dubya said:

 

Copydex is ok and after experimenting with it, my only warning would be to be careful if you want to drill a hole through it, as it will wrap itself around the drill bit.  Resulting in anything stuck to it to join it's mates around your drill.

Copydex is fine and is better for sound deadening properties than more rigid PVA.

[BRTrainz]

Some people use a thin layer of latex caulk for fixing down track.

No experience myself as I've only ever done temporary(ish) layouts.

[Robin Brasher]

I have not tried gluing the track to the baseboard but it seems to be a good idea.

 

I have had a lot of problems using track pins on 00 and N gauge track so I obtained some screws from Alan S. Robinson based in Nottingham. I found 6mm track screws were best and I also bought a magnetic screw driver from him. I drilled holes in the track and baseboard first. I still found that the screws split the sleepers sometimes especially in the N gauge track. They were a lot better than track pins and can be easily removed with a screwdriver. They should be suitable for TT:120 track as well.

 

Initially I am planning to loose lay the track as we have flat tables at our club at Furzebrook Village Hall. This will be easier than taking two boards by car. I think the Hornby TT:120 layout that can be built with the track extension packs will be too big to take on a single board in my car.

[teletougos]

5 hours ago, boxbrownie said:

 

I criticised the flanges on the pony trucks of the TT Pacific’s because they look too big, but I did say it needs to be seems in the flesh, and the final production versions before we can decide one way or the other.

 

 

In the photo on the Hornby blog post, the flanges do look better than in some earlier photos.

[Grovenor]

3 hours ago, irishmail said:

 

I use PVA myself, use weights whilst drying, I used food cans laid longways in the 4'.  Advantage of PVA is if you ever want to lift the track it can be softend with a bit of water.

Buy the washable PVA sold for childrens crafts, much easier to soften with water and cheaper as well. I have found it easy to lift plastic sleepered track fixed this way, with or without ballast.