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Hornby announce TT:120

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Phil Parker

Phil Parker

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, NCB said:

What would be useful would be Gibson or somebody producing locomotive driving wheels for example 4'6 or 5'; t would open up the scale to people doing their own thing.

 

 

The 3mm Society already has a range of wheels. I'd be inclinded to the ones aimed at 14.2mm gauge modellers, fitted with shorter axles.

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melmerby

melmerby

Posted
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8 hours ago, Phil Parker said:

The number of posts I've read raging that they want the benefits of a group, but don't see why they sould pay to be a member is amazing.

It's the same with everything.

People moan that the local <school/road/bin collection/bus service/hospital> needs to improve, then want to have the very taxes that pay for them, cut.

 

We have an in our road that will not separate his waste into landfill and recycling bins because "I pay the council to do that"

 

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HSB

HSB

Posted
Posted
48 minutes ago, Phil Parker said:

 

The 3mm Society already has a range of wheels. I'd be inclinded to the ones aimed at 14.2mm gauge modellers, fitted with shorter axles.

They have a set of standards for using their finescale wheels for 12mm gauge. I was planning to experiment with some but most are marked as 'out of stock' at the moment.

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Porfuera

Porfuera

Posted
Posted (edited)

For anyone not on the Hornby mailing list, the latest TT:120 email:

 

"Not long to wait now - the next Hornby TT:120 set, 'The Easterner' is due in stock at the end of January.

The Easterner Electric Train Set features the iconic Class A4, ‘William Whitelaw’ locomotive and is accompanied by three BR Maroon Mk.I coaches – two Composite Coaches and a Brake Coach. Included in the pack is a 3rd radius starter oval plus siding, buffer stop, controller, wall plug transformer, power connecting track and railer – everything needed to get up and running."

 

Plus a link to what is coming in the next three months (the same 7 pages as before, I guess) - but it still doesn't include the Class 08s!

Edited by Porfuera
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Pacific231G

Pacific231G

Posted
Posted (edited)
19 hours ago, britishcolumbian said:

Rokal weren't particularly consistent, IIRC varying from 1:120 to 1:100. I think the first consistent scale using 12 mm track (other than Hal Joyce's TT) was Wesa of Switzerland with 1:130 on 12 mm track.

Curious. Since the main problem with any "smallest yet" scale, and not just with British prototypes, has always been cramming the moving bits into scale locos, why would Wesa have gone for a scale that made the track effectively broad gauge (1560mm or 5ft 1inch)? 

 

Peco used a modified Rokal German Pacific with Tri-ang stock in the diorama scene they used to illustrate TT-3 and then publicise their 12mm gauge spiked track and it doesn't look out of scale so must have been to a somewhat larger scale than 1:120. 

Looking at images of Rokal stock they do look rather cruder than HP's from the same period- more trainset than model railway (but then so do Tri-ang's first TT stock- Peco's "wonderful wagons" in TT were far better- I had a couple of them). HP's offerings look to be simplified in terms of detail compared with HO of the perriod but generally well proportioned with reasonably fine valve gear and rods.  

 

Off topic but looking for images of HP TT stock i've found out when the first H0 models were built in America. It was in 1929 by the scratchbuilder George D Stock who went on to market parts and then complete kits from 1934. This was of course several years after 1926 when A. R. Walkely succesfully demonstrated 3.5mm/ft scale with his portable shunting layout. I think the term H0 was first coined by J.N. Maskelyne in MRN to differentiate the two scales using the same 16.5mm gauge.

 

Edited by Pacific231G
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Grovenor

Grovenor

Posted
Posted (edited)
Quote

Wesa of Switzerland with 1:130 on 12 mm track.

My recollection is that Wesa was not 12 mm gauge but 13 mm, I don't recall the scale but more likely 1:100 than 1:130.

 

Wikipedia here under historical well down the page

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_rail_transport_modelling_scale_standards

gives the scale as 1:110 for early production and 1:100 for later production but google images would suggest that scale accuracy was not really a feature.

Edited by Grovenor
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Pacific231G

Pacific231G

Posted
Posted (edited)
42 minutes ago, Grovenor said:

My recollection is that Wesa was not 12 mm gauge but 13 mm, I don't recall the scale but more likely 1:100 than 1:130.

Yes. I've just checked and they did use 13mm gauge. Some sources quote 13.5mm but 13mm is what is marked on their boxes (see https://www.flickr.com/photos/kecko/21927754998 ) Apparently they started with 1:110 but went to 1:100 so, though not so narrow gauge as Tri-ang's TT (TT-3), it was still overscale for the gauge. I wondered if Hal joyce had copyrighted TT but, If production began in 1945 Wesa would have come slightly before him (It sounds a bit like LoneStar producing 000 before Arnold etc commercialised N gauge but I think Lone Star was also 9mm gauge )

 

The Wiki entry isn't 100% accurate. It does for example give a gauge of 16.5 mm for NMRA's OO scale when "American OO" is actually 19mm gauge (accurate to scale to the nearest half millimetre) a gauge that was also being used by some modellers in Britain for 4mm scale before WW2 .

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009 micro modeller

009 micro modeller

Posted
Posted
9 minutes ago, Pacific231G said:

(It sounds a bit like LoneStar producing 000 before Arnold etc commercialised N gauge but I think Lone Star was also 9mm gauge) .


Electric Lone Star was 9mm gauge. The original ‘Locos’ range push along diecast stuff was 8.25mm (half 00, as were some of the Triang-inspired rolling stock designs). I think there might have been a somewhat later production of push along stock but with plastic 9mm gauge track instead, although I’m not totally sure on this. I gather also that it was nominally supposed to be 1:152 scale, in contrast to international N scale (1:160) or modern British N (1:148).

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Ravenser

Ravenser

Posted
Posted

It looks like one of the factors that killed TT in Western Europe was that neither the gauge nor the scale were in fact agreed or common ground between the manufacturers.

 

This makes Triang's decision to go with 3mm /12mm rather easier to understand. They weren't being wilfully different, they were picking amongst a spread of existing options

 

However none of that is an issue this time round. We get a clear consistant scale and gauge, the same as every other manufacturer and country, with the track gauge pretty well spot on , and working to a common and coherent standard (NEM310/311)

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009 micro modeller

009 micro modeller

Posted
Posted
8 minutes ago, Ravenser said:

It looks like one of the factors that killed TT in Western Europe was that neither the gauge nor the scale were in fact agreed or common ground between the manufacturers.


The 13mm with either 1:100 or 1:110 scale sounds almost like the American 00 situation (that was 4mm scale on 19mm gauge, so again not a British thing but ending up with a combination very close to that used for British finescale models).

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britishcolumbian

britishcolumbian

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, Grovenor said:

My recollection is that Wesa was not 12 mm gauge but 13 mm, I don't recall the scale but more likely 1:100 than 1:130.

 

Wikipedia here under historical well down the page

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_rail_transport_modelling_scale_standards

gives the scale as 1:110 for early production and 1:100 for later production but google images would suggest that scale accuracy was not really a feature.

Right - I knew there was a thirteen in there somewhere!

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Hobby

Hobby

Posted
Posted

I've had a Rokal 060T and 2-10-2T and they certainly were crude when compared with items from Zeuke of the same era. I never ended up using the Rokal locos but have used many Zeuke and BTTB locos over the years.

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Robin Brasher

Robin Brasher

Posted
Posted
17 hours ago, Porfuera said:

For anyone not on the Hornby mailing list, the latest TT:120 email:

 

"Not long to wait now - the next Hornby TT:120 set, 'The Easterner' is due in stock at the end of January.

The Easterner Electric Train Set features the iconic Class A4, ‘William Whitelaw’ locomotive and is accompanied by three BR Maroon Mk.I coaches – two Composite Coaches and a Brake Coach. Included in the pack is a 3rd radius starter oval plus siding, buffer stop, controller, wall plug transformer, power connecting track and railer – everything needed to get up and running."

 

Plus a link to what is coming in the next three months (the same 7 pages as before, I guess) - but it still doesn't include the Class 08s!

I pressed the 'release date' button and it looks like the Easterner Train set will be the last item to be released in the next three months. It looks like the 'Flying Scotsman' and the A4s together with the Mk1 maroon coaches will appear before the set so perhaps we will see all these within the next three months. This is unless Hornby have put the first item to be released at the back of the list.

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Les1952

Les1952

Posted
Posted
3 hours ago, Robin Brasher said:

I pressed the 'release date' button and it looks like the Easterner Train set will be the last item to be released in the next three months. It looks like the 'Flying Scotsman' and the A4s together with the Mk1 maroon coaches will appear before the set so perhaps we will see all these within the next three months. This is unless Hornby have put the first item to be released at the back of the list.

 

Hornby are saying the Easterner Analogue sets will be at the warehouse on or around next Monday (ie are about to dock) .  Perhaps it is the DIGITAL Easterner set that is at the back of the queue.

 

Les.

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meatloaf

meatloaf

Posted
Posted
4 hours ago, Robin Brasher said:

I pressed the 'release date' button and it looks like the Easterner Train set will be the last item to be released in the next three months. It looks like the 'Flying Scotsman' and the A4s together with the Mk1 maroon coaches will appear before the set so perhaps we will see all these within the next three months. This is unless Hornby have put the first item to be released at the back of the list.

Simon did say in the TT talk that the Easterner will be arriving in the warehouse on 30th Jan

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andrewshimmin

andrewshimmin

Posted
Posted

I think the website doesn't have any more granularity of availability dates than "Winter 2022-23", etc. So sorting by availability date probably gives you a somewhat arbitrary list order based on something else (catalogue serial number or order the items were added to the website) rather than actual expected date.

My understanding is that the Easterner is next (next week) followed by some individual locomotives and carriages (Mk 1 first) and then track packs are March/April together with more carriages and buildings.

Class 43 is now shown as "Autumn 2023". I think all these dates are only vaguely indicative. Hornby is clearly working on everything in Phase 1 & 2, and it'll be released when it's ready.

The Class 55 and Duchess are obviously some way off, but the 08, 43, 66, wagons,  are all about to enter production and so a few months off. And of course as we've learned these last few years, totally unpredictable reasons for further delay are always a possibility!

Patience (says he to himself)...

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