Results - The 00 Wishlist Poll 2022

[TheSignalEngineer]

Thanks for your efforts. 

It looks like my lt stash should be fairly safe, only a Venerable K's kit for a panelled Autocoach appeatred in the Top 50. This year only two other items of interst appeared in the Top 50 where I have already upgraded/converted RTR or built kits. I must be slipping. 

 

Eric

 

[Steamport Southport]

On 03/01/2023 at 08:09, griffgriff said:

Very interesting and thanks for your efforts.
 

There are some very reasonable suggestions in there and some that don’t make sense (except they do because people voted from them ;) )

 

I shall digest the who list at my leisure but one thing that manufacturers might take note of…. The limited appeal of large express passenger locomotives.

 

Griff

 

Nearly all been done though so you can't really say that large express passenger locomotives don't have appeal when they probably sell far more of them than anything else.

 

We really are into the one offs such as Great Northern and The Great Bear when it comes to Pacifics. And if there is a market for things like GT3 then surely those two would sell.

 

 

Jason

[Steamport Southport]

20 hours ago, The Black Hat said:

To be honest Brian, Its probably my perception at fault. I have gone and done the top 10 for each engine class as shown in the category list, so looked at that section an awful lot more, but when looking in the top to bottom list, I just felt that stock, such as NER stuff, Autocoach, Milk Wagons. LNWR wagons, plus more...  all showed up higher than before. You might be explaining that given things grouped together for voting, I was just adding to a post earlier, but added that thought it looked that way. Certainly NER stock is polling higher compared to engine choices, which is good, but if overall items are down, you'd be right to know. Of course people could dial down into the numbers as I have done with engines but the latter is what most are interested in and what drive the market and with DCC The Next Generation coming, some models I think will appear that are not even on the poll at all... such as A4, King, Castle, Black 5...  

 

I do hope people aren't asking for a new Black Five considering they were only announced last year!

 

 

 

Jason

[BMacdermott]

Hello everyone

 

Following on from 'the limited appeal of large express passenger locos'...

 

Let's say such is 4-6-0 and above from items in The Poll.

 

GWR

The Saint and County are in The Top 50.

Great Bear has slipped down the ladder a little but still High Polling.

The Grange is Low Polling (made in 2005).

 

SR

The WC/BB is in The Top 50 (made in 2001).

The Rebuilt Merchant Navy is High Polling (made in 2000).

The LSWR T1 'Paddlebox' is High Polling.

 

LMS

Bowen Cooke Claughton, Caprotti Black 5 and Long Firebox Jubilee are High Polling.

 

LNER

B16/1 - arguably not an 'express loco' per se but used on such - is Top 50.

B17/5 - High Polling.

B2 - Low Polling and has been for years.

GNR A1 - Low Polling (new entry in 2022).

A1/1 60113 - Low Polling but always is.

A1 - Low Polling (made in 2001)

A2/1 - Low Polling

A3 - Low Polling (made in 2005).

A4 - Low Polling (made in 2004).

 

BR

Caprotti Std 5 - High Polling

Std Class 5 - Middle Polling (made in 2002)

 

Brian (on behalf of The 00 Poll Team)

[Dunsignalling]

45 minutes ago, Steamport Southport said:

 

I do hope people aren't asking for a new Black Five considering they were only announced last year!

 

 

 

Jason

I don't think announcements exclude subjects from the poll, only existing models produced within the specified period. Hornby and Bachmann have so far been content to leave one another alone with Hornby doing the Stanier 5MT and Bachmann the Riddles, but there's no guarantee "the others" will go along with that...

 

In any event, the word that came out of Margate was that the new Hornby Black Fives are now not expected until Q4 of 2023. With things in China as they are, it won't take much to push them into 2024.

 

John

 

 

 

 

Edited January 4, 2023 by Dunsignalling

[BMacdermott]

Thanks John

 

Yes, that's correct. This year, we excluded anything made after 2005 from The Poll (except the 14xx where we thought it was 'acceptable' to list it due to the demise of the maker).

 

Brian

[toby_tl10]

30 minutes ago, Dunsignalling said:

In any event, the word that came out of Margate was that the new Hornby Black Fives are now not expected until Q4 of 2023. With things in China as they are, it won't take much to push them into 2024.

In fact, all 4 variants slated for winter 2024-25, according to the Hornby website.

 

https://uk.Hornby.com/products/lms-stanier-5mt-black-5-4-6-0-5200-era-3-r30224

https://uk.Hornby.com/products/br-stanier-5mt-black-5-4-6-0-44726-steam-generator-era-5-r30225ss

https://uk.Hornby.com/products/br-stanier-5mt-black-5-4-6-0-45157-glasgow-highlander-era-5-r30226

https://uk.Hornby.com/products/br-stanier-5mt-black-5-caprotti-4-6-0-44755-era-4-web-exclusive-r30227

[griffgriff]

2 hours ago, Steamport Southport said:

 

Nearly all been done though so you can't really say that large express passenger locomotives don't have appeal when they probably sell far more of them than anything else.

 

We really are into the one offs such as Great Northern and The Great Bear when it comes to Pacifics. And if there is a market for things like GT3 then surely those two would sell.

 

 

Jason

Without the figures I couldn’t tell you but larger locos are just as likely to found in the bargain bin as anything else.

 

Griff

[PM47079]

Good to see the class 81 having some votes, would be very welcome. 

[BMacdermott]

Hello PM47079

 

The Class 81 has been High Polling since 2013 and was in The Top 50 in 2016 and 2018 (Poll didn't run 2017).

 

In 2019, it was only just outside The Top 50 and - this year - has gone back in and higher than ever before.

 

Brian (on behalf of The 00 Poll Team)

[Dunsignalling]

1 hour ago, toby_tl10 said:

In fact, all 4 variants slated for winter 2024-25, according to the Hornby website.

 

https://uk.Hornby.com/products/lms-stanier-5mt-black-5-4-6-0-5200-era-3-r30224

https://uk.Hornby.com/products/br-stanier-5mt-black-5-4-6-0-44726-steam-generator-era-5-r30225ss

https://uk.Hornby.com/products/br-stanier-5mt-black-5-4-6-0-45157-glasgow-highlander-era-5-r30226

https://uk.Hornby.com/products/br-stanier-5mt-black-5-caprotti-4-6-0-44755-era-4-web-exclusive-r30227

 

Maybe even 2026 then. 🤡

 

Plenty of time for a rival to get one out ahead of them!

[Dunsignalling]

46 minutes ago, griffgriff said:

Without the figures I couldn’t tell you but larger locos are just as likely to found in the bargain bin as anything else.

 

Griff

Yes, some of the Thompson Pacifics have been cropping up at £50+ below RRP already.

[D9020 Nimbus]

1 hour ago, toby_tl10 said:

In fact, all 4 variants slated for winter 2024-25, according to the Hornby website.

 

https://uk.Hornby.com/products/lms-stanier-5mt-black-5-4-6-0-5200-era-3-r30224

https://uk.Hornby.com/products/br-stanier-5mt-black-5-4-6-0-44726-steam-generator-era-5-r30225ss

https://uk.Hornby.com/products/br-stanier-5mt-black-5-4-6-0-45157-glasgow-highlander-era-5-r30226

https://uk.Hornby.com/products/br-stanier-5mt-black-5-caprotti-4-6-0-44755-era-4-web-exclusive-r30227

The curious fact that there is seemingly nothing listed for winter 2023-4 has been noted elsewhere and there is speculation that the 2024-5 is a misprint.

[Steamport Southport]

1 hour ago, griffgriff said:

Without the figures I couldn’t tell you but larger locos are just as likely to found in the bargain bin as anything else.

 

Griff

 

Really? Proof.

 

And £50 off a £200 item isn't bargain bin prices. It's the normal 25% discount you get when a model has been available for some time.

 

 

Jason

Edited January 4, 2023 by Steamport Southport

[griffgriff]

9 minutes ago, Steamport Southport said:

 

Really? Proof.

 

And £50 off a £200 item isn't bargain bin prices. It's the normal 25% discount you get when a model has been available for some time.

 

 

Jason

I love the tone some people on here take….

 

https://www.themodelcentre.com/jan-sale/rail/oo-gauge?cat=15526

 

A fair representation of types here.
 

Please remember this is a ‘toy train” forum. Academic rigour I’ll leave at work!
 

Griff
 

 

[Robin Brasher]

R3834 A2 4-6-2 'Steady Aim' list price £229.99 now  £160 Hattons

R3855x 4-6-2 'Queen Maud' list price £254. 49 now £178 at Hornby.

 

I am not risking waiting 12 months after 'City of London' and 'Golden Fleece' appear but one of these may turn into a bargain then.

[Dunsignalling]

50 minutes ago, griffgriff said:

I love the tone some people on here take….

 

https://www.themodelcentre.com/jan-sale/rail/oo-gauge?cat=15526

 

A fair representation of types here.
 

Please remember this is a ‘toy train” forum. Academic rigour I’ll leave at work!
 

Griff
 

 

If nothing else, the level of discounting on the multiple units at gives a heavy hint that the reticence of much of the trade to offer models of them may be well-founded.

 

Also, I've been muttering "you do not need another Hymek" under my breath for the last ten minutes.🥸

 

John

Edited January 4, 2023 by Dunsignalling

[Andy Hayter]

2 hours ago, griffgriff said:

Without the figures I couldn’t tell you but larger locos are just as likely to found in the bargain bin as anything else.

 

Griff

 

 

At the risk of applying a small degree of academic rigour:

 

If the majority of steam locomotives produced are of the larger prototypes, it stands to reason that larger locomotives are likely to be found in the heavily reduced/bargain basement sales in relatively large numbers.

 

Further if manufacturers believe that big engines sell (and one certainly seems to do exactly that) then they may well have longer runs of big engines than small ones - if 95% or more sell at the "Normal" prices, then 5% may well be discounted.  But 5% of say 5000 big engine items produced is 250 left for price reductions, whereas 5% of say 2500 small engine items is 125 items for price reduction.

 

I accept the observation but not necessarily the conclusion.  There are far too many unknowns.

 

 

[BMacdermott]

Hello everyone

 

We are starting to drift off topic - can we please return to the subject matter? Results - The 00 Wishlist Poll 2022.

 

Many thanks

 

Brian (on behalf of The 00 Poll Team)

[BMacdermott]

Hello everyone

 

Wagon Help Needed!

 

As some of you will be aware, we tried this year to list more individual Pre-Grouping items as opposed to generic company listings in Category 15 Freight Stock: Pre-1923 (excluding Scottish Companies).

 

For 2024, we want to move into individual listings for those which were generic this year.

 

GER is already 'in hand', but we are looking for one or two people who have an 'expert knowledge' of freight vehicles of some or all of the following companies: GCR; GNR; LNWR; LYR; and MR.

 

Ideally, the person(s) might be such as the wagon representative for the relevant company society or club. If the person is not actually you, but you know someone with such knowledge, then we'd be grateful for you to forward this note or put us in touch via the email below.

 

We will be looking for just two - maybe three - vehicles from each of those companies. We do not have room to list more, so it might come down to a 'typical open' or a 'typical van'. We are not seeking 'esoterics'! What we are looking for is: vehicles that no GCR/GNR/LNWR/LYR/MR layout can live without.

 

Please do not 'apply' or reply on this thread or via a PM to me.

 

Rather, email The Poll Team direct at the address below. You can expect at least an acknowledgement within 24 hours but we may need to 'sort' any replies over a few days before finally coming back to firm up any plans.

 

Please note: we will be looking for people who can give an unbiased view of example freight stock for those companies and not to use this offer as a way of trying to get 'a favourite' listed! You will need to be able to 'take no' for an answer without getting upset as we as The Team have to do our best to present a 'balanced list' to the voters.

 

Many thanks

 

Brian (on behalf of The 00 Poll Team: thepollteam@gmail.com)

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited January 4, 2023 by BMacdermott

[ndg910]

Interesting stuff and a big thank you to Brian and the team. A quick scan suggests very little demand for diesels or electrics introduced post Grouping - 14 out of 50 top polling items by my count with only one - class 120 DMU, in the top 10. I read that two ways and neither is a criticism or dampener for the modern era market as it has its place in the market but either the market is flooded with reruns of the modern classes and there are few rich pickings or there is no demand. Either way, I can well see the manufacturers taking note and scaling back on yet another retool. There are some really good low hanging fruit in the top 50 covering classes in all the Big 4 companies, many of which had examples survive in to BR days and whilst quite a few will need careful consideration to account for variations, I'll be looking forward to see how this affects manufacturer's plans.

 

The downside for me is a fair few of the top 50 I have kits in the pile to complete. Cue a rummage, completion of said kit and the inevitable announcement......

[BMacdermott]

Hello everyone

 

Some results from the Hornby announcements. We wish Hornby all the best for them.

 

B17/5

This was High Polling. It was also the most-wanted item in The Quirky Poll 2021 but we moved it into 'the main Poll' for 2022.

 

GWR Bogie Bolster Macaw B

This was Middle Polling but missed being High by just four votes.

 

Tank Wagon 2-axle TTA

This was Middle Polling (no 'modern era' freight item polled High). It was the second most-wanted item within the category coming in just behind the UKF Pallet Van at the top.

 

We are looking at whether we need to delete the Tyne Dock version of the 9F - I'll report back on that one.

 

Brian (on behalf of The 00 Poll Team)

 

[BMacdermott]

Hello again everyone

 

I'm pleased to say that we have been able to look into what was announced for Tyne Dock 9F.

 

It was Middle Polling.

 

We wish Hornby all the best with the loco.

 

Brian (on behalf of The 00 Poll Team)

[Compound2632]

Good to see some bread-and-butter 0-6-0s making the cut.

[rogerzilla]

I wonder if the absence of a U class stems from the relative lack of success of the Bachmann N class, which is about £40-50 in mint or unused condition?  I like my N class, which has none of the supposed running problems,but it has a "reputation" and a U class doesn't look very different.