The next Accurascale steam loco in OO ???

[Mallard60022]

23 minutes ago, BMacdermott said:

 

Hello Phil

 

Agree there!

 

This is how the County 4-6-0 has fared recently in The 00 Wishlist Poll:

 

2018 - Entered The Top 50

2019 - Came in just outside The Top 50

2020/21 - Poll didn't run

2022 - Back in The Top 50, but higher up at overall position =17th.

 

I will have at least two and probably three.

 

Brian

Hoorah!

Phil

[The Johnster]

14 hours ago, Craigw said:

The obvious GWR loco missing in RTR form is this. I do believe this would be very popular too.

 

The photo is from a negative in my stash.

 

Craig W

They had them at Tondu as well, though before my period…

[Covkid]

16 hours ago, Accurascale Fran said:

Hi @50025

 

I threw it out there in a planning meeting this afternoon. I was asked “which version” and I could see a migraine developing. I’ll keep trying 🤣.

 

Cheers!

 

Fran

 

Another point about these - weren't the first couple of "Baby Scots" (Patriots)  built on Claughton chassis ?

 

wiki says this

 

The first two were rebuilt in 1930 from the 1912-built LNWR Large Claughton Class, retaining the original driving wheels with their large bosses, the "double radial" bogie truck and some other parts. Of the subsequent 50 locomotives of the class 40 were nominal rebuilds of Claughtons, being in fact new builds classified as rebuilt engines so that they could be charged to revenue accounts, rather than capital. The last ten were classified as new builds.

The two former Claughtons retained their original numbers until 1934, when they were renumbered 5500–1 The 40 built as replacements took the numbers of the Claughtons that they replaced; these were renumbered 5502–41 in 1934.The remainder of the class were allocated nos. 6030–9, but were numbered 5542–51 from new.The numbering of the similar LMS Jubilee Class continued on from where the Patriots left off. This was because 5552–5556 were ordered as Patriots (to be numbered 6040–4) but built with taper boilers as Jubilees on the orders of Sir William Stanier.

Naming of the class was somewhat erratic. Some retained old Claughton names, whilst others continued the military associations of the names Patriot and St Dunstans, and 13 carried names of holiday resorts served by the LMS. Seven remained unnamed, although they had been allocated names in 1943.

Many of the 52 members of the Patriot Class spent the bulk of their working careers in England, primarily on the West Coast Main Line. Most of them were stationed at the Crewe North and Carlisle Upperby, though a few were stationed at Edge Hill, Bushbury, Camden, Willesden, Carlisle Kingmoor and other locations in the area. They were primarily used as express engines, but were later tasked with occasional mixed traffic work once the diesel engines arrived on the network.

 

[Steamport Southport]

41 minutes ago, Covkid said:

 

Another point about these - weren't the first couple of "Baby Scots" (Patriots)  built on Claughton chassis ?

 

wiki says this

 

The first two were rebuilt in 1930 from the 1912-built LNWR Large Claughton Class, retaining the original driving wheels with their large bosses, the "double radial" bogie truck and some other parts. Of the subsequent 50 locomotives of the class 40 were nominal rebuilds of Claughtons, being in fact new builds classified as rebuilt engines so that they could be charged to revenue accounts, rather than capital. The last ten were classified as new builds.

The two former Claughtons retained their original numbers until 1934, when they were renumbered 5500–1 The 40 built as replacements took the numbers of the Claughtons that they replaced; these were renumbered 5502–41 in 1934.The remainder of the class were allocated nos. 6030–9, but were numbered 5542–51 from new.The numbering of the similar LMS Jubilee Class continued on from where the Patriots left off. This was because 5552–5556 were ordered as Patriots (to be numbered 6040–4) but built with taper boilers as Jubilees on the orders of Sir William Stanier.

Naming of the class was somewhat erratic. Some retained old Claughton names, whilst others continued the military associations of the names Patriot and St Dunstans, and 13 carried names of holiday resorts served by the LMS. Seven remained unnamed, although they had been allocated names in 1943.

Many of the 52 members of the Patriot Class spent the bulk of their working careers in England, primarily on the West Coast Main Line. Most of them were stationed at the Crewe North and Carlisle Upperby, though a few were stationed at Edge Hill, Bushbury, Camden, Willesden, Carlisle Kingmoor and other locations in the area. They were primarily used as express engines, but were later tasked with occasional mixed traffic work once the diesel engines arrived on the network.

 

 

Wheels and bogie only I'm afraid. Even had new frames.

 

The rest would have ended up in the spares pile or scrapped.

 

 

Jason

[Mad McCann]

There are two very nice main line locos at Bo'ness, generally active, that could do with a measure up... 😉

[The Black Hat]

18 hours ago, Accurascale Fran said:

Hi @50025

 

I threw it out there in a planning meeting this afternoon. I was asked “which version” and I could see a migraine developing. I’ll keep trying 🤣.

 

Cheers!

 

Fran

 

Allow me to help your planning meeting... 

 

[Ian Hargrave]

2 hours ago, Covkid said:

 

Another point about these - weren't the first couple of "Baby Scots" (Patriots)  built on Claughton chassis ?

 

wiki says this

 

The first two were rebuilt in 1930 from the 1912-built LNWR Large Claughton Class, retaining the original driving wheels with their large bosses, the "double radial" bogie truck and some other parts. Of the subsequent 50 locomotives of the class 40 were nominal rebuilds of Claughtons, being in fact new builds classified as rebuilt engines so that they could be charged to revenue accounts, rather than capital. The last ten were classified as new builds.

The two former Claughtons retained their original numbers until 1934, when they were renumbered 5500–1 The 40 built as replacements took the numbers of the Claughtons that they replaced; these were renumbered 5502–41 in 1934.The remainder of the class were allocated nos. 6030–9, but were numbered 5542–51 from new.The numbering of the similar LMS Jubilee Class continued on from where the Patriots left off. This was because 5552–5556 were ordered as Patriots (to be numbered 6040–4) but built with taper boilers as Jubilees on the orders of Sir William Stanier.

Naming of the class was somewhat erratic. Some retained old Claughton names, whilst others continued the military associations of the names Patriot and St Dunstans, and 13 carried names of holiday resorts served by the LMS. Seven remained unnamed, although they had been allocated names in 1943.

Many of the 52 members of the Patriot Class spent the bulk of their working careers in England, primarily on the West Coast Main Line. Most of them were stationed at the Crewe North and Carlisle Upperby, though a few were stationed at Edge Hill, Bushbury, Camden, Willesden, Carlisle Kingmoor and other locations in the area. They were primarily used as express engines, but were later tasked with occasional mixed traffic work once the diesel engines arrived on the network.

 

One….45509 in BR numbering The Derbyshire Yeomanry….spent most of it working life at,appropriately enough,Derby ( 17 A )  working the Midland Mainline and the inter regional cross country route. Later in their lives 3 further examples ended on ….nominally….WR books at Bristol Barrow Road ( 82E ) to add extra motive power to traffic on the route to New Street,Derby & the NE.

[MikeParkin65]

17 hours ago, Steamport Southport said:

 

Erm....

 

 

https://didcotrailwaycentre.org.uk/article.php/422/going-loco-september-2020

 

 

They can do that after the 8F as it's virtually got the same boiler.....

 

 

Jason

But dont go measuring up the Didcot example which is of course an unfinished replica using an 8F boiler. Or just give us the 8F instead :)

[Steamport Southport]

5 minutes ago, MikeParkin65 said:

But dont go measuring up the Didcot example which is of course an unfinished replica using an 8F boiler. Or just give us the 8F instead :)

 

Virtually finished. Due for steam testing I believe, if that hasn't already happened.

 

But it should be an 8F boiler anyway as that is what they used on the original ones. They were the boilers left over from a cancelled batch of thirty 8Fs due to be built at Swindon with slight GWR modifications.

 

That's why the old Dapol model is seriously wrong as it's got a Castle boiler as they copied the moulds from the old Airfix Castle.

 

 

Jason

[Strathwood]

14xx, 58xx, 57xx & 8750 Classes.

 

Still comes back to looking at the numbers commercially with influences being just how many GWR/BR Western Region branch line, mainline engine shed layouts are out there already to welcome these new models if announced say at the NEC Warley Show with highly secretive advanced cads etc on show to tempt potential buyers and ward off competitors. Not forgetting those GWR/WR layouts still being planned that could easily absorb and justify even more of these classes to the desired modern standards of detail and running.

 

A flood of Dapol, Hornby, Bachmann and Hattons/DJ Models examples would quickly hit the markets as modellers rushed to the new offerings. Thereby subsidising their new model purchases of these new more desirable versions. Add to this the variety of liveries to run with for the manufacturer, which must be easier to tool up for in batch production than perhaps 14xx top feed and toolbox styles, which could also still be accommodated.

 

Add to this the longevity and actual spread of these classes in their working days with justification if it's needed to possess and run them on layouts, how often do we see "modeller's licence" being deployed.

 

Further still as layouts tend to be smaller in modern homes, we are seeing more and more branch line termini etc actually being built.

 

The potential sales numbers must be more convincing than say both Hornby and Bachmann could have imagined by retooling their 9Fs several times, which must have far more parts to design, and manufacture, although this might influence the end RRP with companies also trying to increase their turnover by producing ever more expensive models?

 

The possible attraction of existing RTR rolling stock to assist additional sales must be considered too, whilst the Highland 4-6-0 is an innovative proposition certainly to this RM Webber, the lack of suitable additional rolling stock, buildings, signals etc, might hold back some sales potential. Likewise, the fact that just how many people still alive could feel an allegiance to say certain limited designs and types that maybe didn't even survive postwar. The same limitations cannot be said of GWR/Western Region modelling accessories, can it?

 

Just some thoughts, by no means conclusive of course, but perhaps deliberately adding fuel to this debate...

 

Kevin

Edited September 6, 2023 by Strathwood

[A Murphy]

Please don't shout. I have a new hearing aid. 

 

Alastair M

[Captain Kernow]

3 hours ago, Mad McCann said:

There are two very nice main line locos at Bo'ness, generally active, that could do with a measure up... 😉

So which panniers are those?

 

[Mr chapman]

I would love to see a LBSCR Baltic tank.

 

Pre grouping to southern liveries.

 

A never before rtr wheel arrangement.

 

A reusable chassis for a rebuilt tender engine.

 

Plenty of other rtr LBSCR models to compliment and encourage sales.

 

Different enough for some Rule 1 purchases.

[MikeParkin65]

2 hours ago, Steamport Southport said:

 

Virtually finished. Due for steam testing I believe, if that hasn't already happened.

 

But it should be an 8F boiler anyway as that is what they used on the original ones. They were the boilers left over from a cancelled batch of thirty 8Fs due to be built at Swindon with slight GWR modifications.

 

That's why the old Dapol model is seriously wrong as it's got a Castle boiler as they copied the moulds from the old Airfix Castle.

 

 

Jason

According to the Brian Haresnape book 'Collett & Hawksworth Locomotives' Hawksworth designed the new No 15 standard boiler using the existing flanging blocks for the 8F for the firebox throat and backplates with modified stays for the original 280psi boiler pressure. So not actual 8F boilers. 

 

My point is dont measure up a replica because there will inevitably be detail differences to the original.

[Mallard60022]

45 minutes ago, MikeParkin65 said:

According to the Brian Haresnape book 'Collett & Hawksworth Locomotives' Hawksworth designed the new No 15 standard boiler using the existing flanging blocks for the 8F for the firebox throat and backplates with modified stays for the original 280psi boiler pressure. So not actual 8F boilers. 

 

My point is don't measure up a replica because there will inevitably be detail differences to the original.

I think these chaps from this AS place are very open to advice such as this, about their builds.

A guided tour of Didcot to get the feel of the Engine's 'face' and then plenty of Sarnies and Tea, along with a small team of well known 'Advisors' that lurk on here, should start the Mouse rolling. 

Comet provide a perfectly decent modification pack for a basic Hornby 8F, so don't be greedy guts fellow modellers.

If there were a great Mod KIt for the Railroad Hornby County, I wouldn't be saying that. 

IIRC apart from Chimney shapes, the County Class were pretty damn plain and without frills. There must be decent plans as they were 'recent' builds and there are plenty of Phots as with other Engines. 

I'm almost tempted to offer to help fund the design work.

For the average modeller, of an age to enjoy a simpler modelling of the later days of BRWR Steam and probably with the dosh to buy a few, the County is the missing link in the WR fleet.

Tiis is a plea form a SR Modeller too!

Phil

 

[Steamport Southport]

20 minutes ago, Mallard60022 said:

I think these chaps from this AS place are very open to advice such as this, about their builds.

A guided tour of Didcot to get the feel of the Engine's 'face' and then plenty of Sarnies and Tea, along with a small team of well known 'Advisors' that lurk on here, should start the Mouse rolling. 

Comet provide a perfectly decent modification pack for a basic Hornby 8F, so don't be greedy guts fellow modellers.

If there were a great Mod KIt for the Railroad Hornby County, I wouldn't be saying that. 

IIRC apart from Chimney shapes, the County Class were pretty damn plain and without frills. There must be decent plans as they were 'recent' builds and there are plenty of Phots as with other Engines. 

I'm almost tempted to offer to help fund the design work.

For the average modeller, of an age to enjoy a simpler modelling of the later days of BRWR Steam and probably with the dosh to buy a few, the County is the missing link in the WR fleet.

Tiis is a plea form a SR Modeller too!

Phil

 

 

But there is a detailing kit for the County!

 

It's GWR modellers being greedy. They've already had a 4-6-0 from Accurascale and asking for more.....

 

 

Jason

[Invicta]

8 hours ago, Mad McCann said:

There are two very nice main line locos at Bo'ness, generally active, that could do with a measure up... 😉

 

 

[Covkid]

2 hours ago, Steamport Southport said:

 

But there is a detailing kit for the County!

 

It's GWR modellers being greedy. They've already had a 4-6-0 from Accurascale and asking for more.....

 

 

Jason

Oooh  Harsh !!!! I think modellers of all persuasions are seeking a piece of Accurascale - me for starting this thread off !!!

 

 

[James Grundy]

On 05/09/2023 at 18:45, Accurascale Fran said:

Hi @50025

 

I threw it out there in a planning meeting this afternoon. I was asked “which version” and I could see a migraine developing. I’ll keep trying 🤣.

 

Cheers!

 

Fran

Surely the answer to that question is simply

"All of them!"

 

For me I'd prefer something more Horwich flavoured than Crewe, but honestly I'd even take something from Brighton to not see another reveal with a copper cap. Still, it's only logical to let Accurascale cut their steam loco teeth on a couple of locos from the southern end of the country before moving on to proper railways.

 

By the time they fill the long neglected Aspinall 0-6-0 shaped gap in the history of British RTR, they'll be dab hands. (Can you blame me for dreaming?)

[The Johnster]

7 hours ago, MikeParkin65 said:

According to the Brian Haresnape book 'Collett & Hawksworth Locomotives' Hawksworth designed the new No 15 standard boiler using the existing flanging blocks for the 8F for the firebox throat and backplates with modified stays for the original 280psi boiler pressure. So not actual 8F boilers. 

 

My point is dont measure up a replica because there will inevitably be detail differences to the original.

 

 

ISTR that the material for the 30 cancelled 8Fs was used for the Counties, as it was pre-cut to the correct component sizes and shapes.  Not actual 8F boilers on several counts, including those that Mike mentions, and not least that they were of course domeless.  OTOH one could regard them as domeless versions of the 8F boiler with minor modifications to cope with the higher pressure.  The ultimate test would have been to replace a standard no.15 with an 8F boiler on a loco in service, or put a no.15 on an 8F.  They should fit as a more or less straight swap, but there may be all sorts of reasons that they wouldn't have!

 

The new build County of Glamorgan of course uses an 8F boiler with the dome stuff taken out and replaced with GW injection equipment, but that's not quite the same thing as it has been built specifically to use this particular boiler, and thus may not be exactly the same as a 'production' Hawksworth County.

 

So, while it is not entirely correct to state that the Hawksworth County boiler is a Stanier 8F boiler without a dome and pressed higher, it is equally not entirely incorrect to state that the two boilers are very closely related to each other.  ISTR that the 8F boilers for 8Fs built at Swindon were given the standard no.15 for the convenience of the boiler shop, and the County boilers were included in that category.  There were minor differences between boilers for different classes within the boiler classification, for instance the inclusion or omission of top-feeds on some parallel boilers, so there was precedent for this. 

[DougN]

I have said it before else where a D49 smaller tender loco, they have 2 major differences in the Hunt or Shire, they have a variety of LNER tenders being, Group standard Flaired and GS flat sided, then there is options to pick and choose from of GCR, NER standards which were swapped around. This would produce the information for all the rest of the LNER tender locos as the work for the tender has previously been done (nudge nudge wink!).The locos can also be done in a number of liveries, LNER lined green, Lined black, Basic black, leading to BR early and late logo in mixed traffic lined livery. They also were widely spread as "first round standard loco" Though I think Darlington did a lot of the initial design work so had a NER feel!   As Brian would mention in the "wishlists" this does rate highly. 

Being a 4-4-0 loco it does lend its self to branchline and mixed traffic work. 

 

From my point of view it is really the last loco I really would like to see released in a new highly detailed version compared to the Railroad range from some one else! 

 

[Neal Ball]

12 hours ago, Mallard60022 said:

A guided tour of Didcot…

…..the County is the missing link in the WR fleet.

Tiis is a plea form a SR Modeller too!

Phil

 

You can’t beat a guided tour of Didcot…..

 

However, without wishing to be picky, the gap in GWR locos is in fact the Saint, rather than the County.

 

The Saint was the forerunner of all the 4-6-0 locos that followed it - its continued omission is a huge gap in the availability of RTR locos. Added to which there was a huge variety and longevity, right through to BR days.

 

Everything (4-6-0 wise) that followed owed it’s heritage to the Saint.

 

(Whilst a County 4-6-0 would be good - it’s outside my timeline 😎)

[Mad McCann]

On 16/08/2023 at 15:15, atom3624 said:

I understand the 'logic' of 'filling in the holes', but selecting a next marketable product doesn't normally fit that ethos.

Model popularity plays a big part in selection as well I can imagine.

I maintain DoG 71k and / or Jubilees ...

Add parallel boilered Scots.

 

Al.

I certainly concur where the Jubilee is concerned as Bachmann have failed to exploit the field of variations  which limits the geographic spread of their version.

 

DoG is certainly one of the last 'Big' locos awaiting a quality release, as are Thompson's 'Great Northern ' and A2/1.

 

After that, we are into the realms of the Pre-Group 'big' engines and more humble types.

Edited September 7, 2023 by Mad McCann

[Mad McCann]

15 hours ago, Mallard60022 said:

I think these chaps from this AS place are very open to advice such as this, about their builds.

A guided tour of Didcot to get the feel of the Engine's 'face' and then plenty of Sarnies and Tea, along with a small team of well known 'Advisors' that lurk on here, should start the Mouse rolling. 

Comet provide a perfectly decent modification pack for a basic Hornby 8F, so don't be greedy guts fellow modellers.

If there were a great Mod KIt for the Railroad Hornby County, I wouldn't be saying that. 

IIRC apart from Chimney shapes, the County Class were pretty damn plain and without frills. There must be decent plans as they were 'recent' builds and there are plenty of Phots as with other Engines. 

I'm almost tempted to offer to help fund the design work.

For the average modeller, of an age to enjoy a simpler modelling of the later days of BRWR Steam and probably with the dosh to buy a few, the County is the missing link in the WR fleet.

Tiis is a plea form a SR Modeller too!

Phil

 

 

 

As a Scottish modeller I'd honestly be happy with a few more kits of our older staple locos.

I remember the last time I tried to help do something about that though... 💩💩💩

[Captain Kernow]

15 hours ago, Steamport Southport said:

It's GWR modellers being greedy. They've already had a 4-6-0 from Accurascale and asking for more.....

So...?

 

You point is...?  😉😉😛😁