What slam door stock would I have taken >1990 from Lewisham?

[Lacathedrale]

On 06/03/2024 at 20:56, Peter Kazmierczak said:

All this talk of EPBs and Networkers reminded me of when I worked at a school near Hither Green, just off the South Circular road. One Monday morning when I pulled into the staff car, there was a Networker coach parked on a low-loader right outside.

I've no idea why it was there, and have never got to the bottom of it all; this was in the mid 90s. Maybe the low-loader had broken, had a flat tyre or taken a wrong turn?

However, I took the opportunity (as you would) to bring out my class of 7/8 year-olds to have a photo of them all alongside the coach.

Which school? I went to Ennersdale and lived just off the south circular, early memories of 33’s pulling freight trains at night outside my window on the embankment between HG and Grove Park.

 

[Peter Kazmierczak]

St Winifred's  (NOT the one that had a famous school choir though...)

[62613]

On 05/03/2024 at 23:51, Tom Burnham said:

In the 1960s and 1970s (so a bit earlier than the OP), EPBs were almost universal on the Dartford lines.  The main exception was the xx.36 from CX and the corresponding up train which were semi-fast to Ramsgate (from memory) and used 2-HAP units, often in 10-car formations. Non-stop from London Bridge to Woolwich Arsenal and I think usually ran via Greenwich, although Lewisham and Blackheath was a possibility.  There was an up train of HAP units that called at Sidcup in the mid afternoon which was a rare appearance of first class there.

I think I saw that service at Dartford one time in the 1970s, as, IIRC, a 6 - HAP. There was a 4.16 p.m. (at London Bridge) in the early 60s, which was LB - Woolwich Arsenal - Erith - Dartford, which was always EPB. Can't remember which way it ran between North Kent East and Charlton, though.

[Peterem]

By the late 90s I was doing a daily commute between Eltham and Victoria. A standard 6 car set of a 465 and a 466 was standard as the trains were very lightly loaded until Peckham Rye. Except for one 8 car service which left Eltham at the very end of the morning peak (around 09:20); I later found a matching return service from Victoria to Dartford around 16:15. This was definitely main line stock. I remember 4-CEPS at first, superceded by the short-lived (at least on Connex) Networker Express units. I recall not being impressed by the size or comfort of their small first class sections. I never knew what the main line sets were doing on this one service or what they did after Dartford, but I assumed they were a way to transfer surplus stock to and from Victoria in the peaks without disrupting more crowded routes. I moved offices around 2003 so don't know how long this lasted.

 

[brushman47544]

On 05/03/2024 at 16:02, Wickham Green too said:

With the doubling of the flyover ramp and changes closer to LB, the crossover isn't used as much as it was then - the Hayes train would now come over the flyover from Charing Cross rather than via St.Johns. 

 

Charing Cross trains yes, but presumably those from Cannon Street still call at St Johns and use the crossover at Lewisham. And in the peaks don't the Charing Cross trains go via Parks Bridge Jct.?

[Wickham Green too]

As things stand every second Hayes train does, indeed, run via Parks Bridge Jn. ............. Cannon Street has been excommunicated from Hayes - or vice-versa.

[John M Upton]

Have a watch of the old BBC documentary Old, Dirty and Late which is on YouTube I believe.

 

At least one part filmed peak time at Lewisham and its all NSE and blue/grey liveried EPB's.

[The Lurker]

(Some) Sidcup line Cannon Street trains still go via Lewisham so use the crossover. Some Sidcup line Charing Cross trains go that way too but use the Tanners Hill Flydown. There are also Victoria (or Blackfriars) trains from the Bexleyheath line that use the crossing in the other direction

[Dagworth]

Which services stop at St John’s now? It used to be the Hayes trains in the later 90s but before that it had been the Bexleyheaths. 
 

Andi

[RFS]

57 minutes ago, Dagworth said:

Which services stop at St John’s now? It used to be the Hayes trains in the later 90s but before that it had been the Bexleyheaths. 
 

Andi

 

The Real Times Trains website shows that the trains stopping there are to/from Orpington and Gravesend and all to/from Cannon Street. 

[Wickham Green too]

3 hours ago, RFS said:

... all to/from Cannon Street. 

I'm not sure it's possible to run St.Johns to Charing Cross since the last London Bridge revamp !!?! ( Thameslink rather gets in the way.)

[Oldddudders]

54 minutes ago, Wickham Green too said:

I'm not sure it's possible to run St.Johns to Charing Cross since the last London Bridge revamp !!?! ( Thameslink rather gets in the way.)

Does that apply to New Cross, too?

[Dagworth]

3 minutes ago, Oldddudders said:

Does that apply to New Cross, too?

Looking at Google maps satellite view there is a crossover from 3 to 4 (as we'd know them) and then from 4 to 5 and onwards around North Kent East Junction. the big crossover from 3 to 6 at Spa Road no longer exists.

 

https://www.google.com/maps/@51.4862825,-0.0459426,251m/data=!3m1!1e3?authuser=0&entry=ttu

 

Andi 

[RFS]

1 hour ago, Wickham Green too said:

I'm not sure it's possible to run St.Johns to Charing Cross since the last London Bridge revamp !!?! ( Thameslink rather gets in the way.)

 

1 hour ago, Oldddudders said:

Does that apply to New Cross, too?

 

Looking again at Real Time Trains, the answer appears to be no to both. So anyone going from St Johns or New Cross to Charing Cross will need to change at London Bridge. 

[Wickham Green too]

11 hours ago, RFS said:

... anyone going from St Johns or New Cross to Charing Cross will need to change at London Bridge. 

From St.Johns it might be better to backtrack to Lewisham ....... it's a darned sight easier to change platforms there !

[DY444]

On 13/03/2024 at 19:19, Wickham Green too said:

I'm not sure it's possible to run St.Johns to Charing Cross since the last London Bridge revamp !!?! ( Thameslink rather gets in the way.)

 

On 13/03/2024 at 20:14, Oldddudders said:

Does that apply to New Cross, too?

 

It is still possible to run St Johns/New Cross - Charing Cross in both directions but it's far easier from an operational perspective in the down direction than the up as going up requires just over a mile on the reversible line 7. 

Although it is reversible, Line 7 is heavily used by down trains so I suspect using it in the up direction would likely be something only done in extremis.