RMweb Premium PhilJ W Posted March 24 RMweb Premium Share Posted March 24 9 minutes ago, Mark Saunders said: I understand that there are documents relating to railway equipment lost on the continent after the fall of France! They have to find the number of the container first. Even then although records were kept by the Continental clearing houses of UK wagons used during the war the same may not have applied to containers. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium kevinlms Posted March 24 RMweb Premium Share Posted March 24 25 minutes ago, Mark Saunders said: I understand that there are documents relating to railway equipment lost on the continent after the fall of France! These are in the National Archives at Kew! But it could have been lost BEFORE the fall of France! 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium PhilJ W Posted March 24 RMweb Premium Share Posted March 24 2 minutes ago, kevinlms said: But it could have been lost BEFORE the fall of France! The railways were put on a war footing in September 1939 and returning a probably empty container would have been a low priority. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Hodgson Posted March 24 Share Posted March 24 46 minutes ago, ess1uk said: Judging by the “reporter’s” photo he has barely left school and is just rehashing something handed to him from some news agency More likely he's relying on Google translate to use a press release in Flemish, or if he's very lucky relying on his O-level in pidgin French. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
KeithHC Posted March 24 Share Posted March 24 Ah this reminds me of an incident that happened to me. I was working for a Belgian airline in there operations department. The airline was based on the north side of the airport and was considered to be a Flemish company. Sabena based on the south of the airport where a French company. So I was called in as there was problem with an aircraft gone tech in Malaga. The Ops officer on duty had only been in the job a few months and was running around a bit like a rabbit in the headlights. Also one of the joint MDs was in and he suffered no fools gladly. There was the boss barking out instructions in Flemish as I came in. Now he wanted a number for another charter airline to sub in for our tech aircraft. The ops officer was trying to find the number and was going through the local directory but could not find it. Now in most airline ops at the time there was always a black book that had all the handy numbers etc in it. So I walked over to the desk opened the book and pointed to the number needed. The MD then in perfect English said to the other guy „Keith found the number and he doesn’t even speak Flemish“. Huge brownie points to me……. Keith 3 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Hodgson Posted March 24 Share Posted March 24 22 minutes ago, KeithHC said: Ah this reminds me of an incident that happened to me. I was working for a Belgian airline in there operations department. The airline was based on the north side of the airport and was considered to be a Flemish company. Sabena based on the south of the airport where a French company. When I was working for a Brussels based international organisation whose working language was English, I spent a few months in Virginia, and a large group of us went to a local restaurant for lunch. The waitress (typical American student trying to pay her way through college) was suprised to hear French being spoken and remarked "Gee! Y'all from Canada?". When it was explained that he was from Holland, she was from Paris, I was British but most of the group were from Belgium, she asked what state that was in! So they told her Paris was the capital of France ... and the capital of Belgium was Sabena! But the Luxembourger didn't try Luxair. 1 8 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
stewartingram Posted March 24 Share Posted March 24 The photos that I have seen of the partially uncovered contain seem to me to show it sitting in what looks an open wagon, towards the lh end. Or is it me? 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wickham Green too Posted March 24 Share Posted March 24 All part of the container I think. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wheatley Posted March 24 Share Posted March 24 8 hours ago, 31A said: On the other hand!! https://www.yorkpress.co.uk/news/24203628.york-mystery-lner-train-found-antwerp-belgium/ I'm impressed by how quickly the comments section went completely to hell even by York Press commenters' usual standards. 3 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium spamcan61 Posted March 24 RMweb Premium Share Posted March 24 (edited) 8 minutes ago, Wheatley said: I'm impressed by how quickly the comments section went completely to hell even by York Press commenters' usual standards. This seems "normal" for all local rags I'm aware of (all owned by Newsquest I think), the Bournemouth echo is the same. I think the papers encourage the dribbly foamers to get the page hits up. Edited March 24 by spamcan61 2 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium 31A Posted March 24 RMweb Premium Share Posted March 24 3 hours ago, Wheatley said: I'm impressed by how quickly the comments section went completely to hell even by York Press commenters' usual standards. Oh I can't bring myself to read the comments section any more, it's too bad for my blood pressure! 1 1 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold adb968008 Posted March 25 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 25 On 24/03/2024 at 18:46, Wheatley said: I'm impressed by how quickly the comments section went completely to hell even by York Press commenters' usual standards. This one is particularly fascinating.. Quote Yes I know cheeky chunks but the general idea was new nipped across to jolly old Belgium to defend spiffingly miffed Poland but got stuffed so had to run away home and go crying to the Americans. Is this prose even English ? 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium 31A Posted April 10 RMweb Premium Share Posted April 10 Another picture has emerged, and some more mangled history with some basis in fact: https://www.yorkpress.co.uk/news/24243278.york-lner-reveal-details-wagon-found-belgium/?ref=ebbn&nid=1493&u=21888ae365be2b15639e90bf4330cddc&date=100424 2 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wheatley Posted April 10 Share Posted April 10 "We are fascinated by LNER's history..." but not very good at it. 1 3 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trestrol Posted April 10 Share Posted April 10 Basically they've trawlled various forums to pass off information as their own as I'm sure their archives don't contain anything on the original LNER. 2 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium kevinlms Posted April 11 RMweb Premium Share Posted April 11 12 hours ago, Trestrol said: Basically they've trawlled various forums to pass off information as their own as I'm sure their archives don't contain anything on the original LNER. 2 things 1/ Why would their archives on buying a franchise from the government, have anything from before 1/1/1948? Especially something written off (an obscure wagon at that) from pre-WW2. 2/ They must of had a good reason for their choice of trading name. Somewhere inbetween, lies the truth! 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wickham Green too Posted April 11 Share Posted April 11 32 minutes ago, kevinlms said: ... Why would their archives on buying a franchise from the government, have anything from before 1/1/1948? ... In the context of rolling stock* there's no reason for a direct link but their archives SHOULD contain vast amounts if info on the fixed assets they're responsible for - such as York station ! * hmmmm .... if a container has no wheels is it rolling stock ? 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Mallard60022 Posted April 11 RMweb Premium Share Posted April 11 Donny Free Pres (FB Posts) has had it too, so its one of those 'Newsworld type stories. Most of the usual suspects and just locals, who are ignorant of anything beyond their Phones, on there are going on about how's an LNER (meaning the actual Newish Company on the ECML) 'Wagon' been buried in wherever? Oh dear! They really are beyond belief, as they are on something on there about Climate Modification; not for here. You can probably imagine what's on that thread, but even I in my usual mood just couldn't handle the utter b0ll0x being posted on there. I had to dump it before I passed out from disbelief at what these people actually think and believe. In reality a LNER Container in a Wagon, across the Channel, wouldn't have been that unusual back then surely? No idea what sort of Goods were being sent/received in those days. Thank Goodness RMW usually is never that bad...or maybe I've missed something? Phil 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trestrol Posted April 11 Share Posted April 11 (edited) 8 hours ago, kevinlms said: 2 things 1/ Why would their archives on buying a franchise from the government, have anything from before 1/1/1948? Especially something written off (an obscure wagon at that) from pre-WW2. 2/ They must of had a good reason for their choice of trading name. Somewhere inbetween, lies the truth! 7 hours ago, Wickham Green too said: In the context of rolling stock* there's no reason for a direct link but their archives SHOULD contain vast amounts if info on the fixed assets they're responsible for - such as York station ! * hmmmm .... if a container has no wheels is it rolling stock ? All the LNER archives are in Kew as far as I'm aware. I think the choice of trading name was decided by the DFT who will own the rights to it. It was only called LNER after it was taken in-house by the government after the failure of the franchise. They don't own York station it belongs to Network Rail. Edited April 11 by Trestrol 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pom-pom Posted April 11 Share Posted April 11 (edited) On 24/03/2024 at 10:15, kevinlms said: Serves them right for reusing a trading name - they should be more original! Agreed. And the modern-day "LNER" is a publicly owned DfT Operator of Last Resort. The adoption of the LNER title is simply brand-engineering. How the modern-day organisation can even be compared with the LNER of 1923 - 1948, let alone know anything about it or claim its history, beggars belief. Edited April 11 by pom-pom 2 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wheatley Posted April 11 Share Posted April 11 Presumably the IP rights of the Big Four passed to the Railway Executive on privatisation, thence to BTC/BRB/DfT. DfT owns DOHL and therefore already owned the rights to the LNER name. Certain information held by TOCs and required for a seamless change of ownership is defined as Franchise Information and must be handed over to the successor TOC on a change of franchisee. This generally includes personnel records, payroll records, station and other property repair and maintenance records, copies of the station and depot Global Lease agreements and the lease plans associated with those. Similarly the rolling stock repair and maintenance records will also transfer. Other than that I doubt the current LNER holds much from NXEC days never mind before, unless it's stuff they didn't chuck out when they moved out of York Main HQ. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wickham Green too Posted April 11 Share Posted April 11 2 hours ago, Trestrol said: ... They don't own York station ... ... they operate it. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wheatley Posted April 11 Share Posted April 11 (edited) 1 hour ago, Wickham Green too said: ... they operate it. Their records will include a copy of the global station lease setting out their repair and mantenance responsibilities (which is essentially cleaning, and fixing things they're directly responsible for like ticket machines, the CCTV system, PA, and anything plugged in in the staff accommodation), an asbestos register, various inspection records and a sheaf of risk assessments. It certainly won't include anything held by the previous operator unless it's Franchise Information as defined earlier. Everything else including the paperwork for most of the retail outlet leases, maintenance of the lifts, fire alarm system, fabric of the building and stopping the roof leaking is held by Network Rail as thats all their responsibility as landlord to repair. The fact that getting them to fix any of that is likely getting blood out of a stone has driven succeeding generations of TOC property managers grey over the years. Don't assume that a station lease is anything like a normal commercial FRI lease. Edited April 11 by Wheatley 1 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium PhilJ W Posted April 14 RMweb Premium Share Posted April 14 This is the latest information on the container. More crucially it has the number of the container, BK769 which if the clearing house records are available it might tell us when and why it ended up in Belgium. https://www.ianvisits.co.uk/articles/more-details-about-the-lner-wagon-buried-in-belgium-71549/?utm_source=newsletter&utm_medium=email 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wickham Green too Posted April 14 Share Posted April 14 "truck", "carriage", "storage wagon" ................... make up your minds ! 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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