Do you prefer to pay for Model Railway Exhibition admission using a card or cash?

[Dungrange]

As part of the committee organising a new Model Railway Exhibition (ie we have no previous year's data available), I'm wondering what proportion of show attendees are likely to want to pay by card.  Pre-COVID it seems like most local shows were cash only, but a growing proportion of shows are taking card payments at the door.

 

https://elmrc.org.uk/elmrc-exhibition/

 

https://www.ticketsource.co.uk/elmrc

[Wheatley]

I prefer card generally so that's what I've ticked. However, I tend to pay by cash at exhibitions because I've taken a wedge of cash for any traders who take cards or because it seems unfair to land them with bank charges for a £2 second hand wagon. 

 

I have no qualms buying something for pennies from Sainsburys on the card. 

[Clive Mortimore]

Hi David

 

As someone who has manned the ticket desk at shows where both forms of payment have been in operation, card payment is much easier. 

 

Two things to look out for

 

1. Cash payment, make sure you don't run of change 10 minutes after the nearest bank has closed.

2. Card payment, the limit set by the card reader provider is not lower than your expected takings. It will automatically stop working once you reach that limit and the punters will have to pay cash. This will occur 10 minutes after the nearest bank has closed and you are low on change.

 

 

[woodenhead]

I carry very limited cash these days, usually at most a tenner note, don't even carry a wallet anymore just a little folding card holder and the cards are only there in case Apple decides not to play nice.

[Dungrange]

1 hour ago, Clive Mortimore said:

As someone who has manned the ticket desk at shows where both forms of payment have been in operation, card payment is much easier. 

 

Okay, looks like we really need to make sure that all of the cash desk volunteers know how to use the card readers.  I'd expected a preference for card, but hadn't expected such a strong preference for card payments.

 

1 hour ago, Clive Mortimore said:

1. Cash payment, make sure you don't run of change 10 minutes after the nearest bank has closed.

 

Yes, that's a problem, because banks aren't open at the weekend and the nearest bank is a good 10 minutes away from the venue.  If everyone wants to pay by card, the amount of change we will need is reduced (since it's related to the number that want to pay in cash), but obviously we need to be prepared for all eventualities.

 

1 hour ago, Clive Mortimore said:

2. Card payment, the limit set by the card reader provider is not lower than your expected takings. It will automatically stop working once you reach that limit and the punters will have to pay cash. This will occur 10 minutes after the nearest bank has closed and you are low on change.

 

I wasn't aware that card readers had a limit - I'd just assumed that they could process unlimited transactions.  I'll need to check up on how much our card readers can handle.

Edited May 10 by Dungrange
corrected 'cash reader' to 'card reader'

[melmerby]

56 minutes ago, woodenhead said:

the cards are only there in case Apple decides not to play nice.

Usually seems to happen when there is a big queue behind whomever is trying to pay by phone and they don't have any alternative payment means.☹️

[Jeremy Cumberland]

42 minutes ago, Dungrange said:

Okay, looks like we really need to make sure that all of the cash desk volunteers know how to use the cash readers.  I'd expected a preference for card, but hadn't expected such a strong preference for card payments

I like the idea of cash readers. I present my £10 note. It gets scanned. I put the note back in my pocket.

 

I'm not sure what's in it for the club, though.

[melmerby]

Just now, Jeremy Cumberland said:

I like the idea of cash readers. I present my £10 note. It gets scanned. I put the note back in my pocket.

But doesn't the value printed on it go down?😁

[Jeremy Cumberland]

I'm still a regular cash user. Most of the takeaways where I live don't take cards amd some of the local shops have expressed a preference for cash, so I tend always to have some cash on me.

 

At a show, I'll happily pay by whichever method incurs the least cost to the club. I wouldn't dream of using a credit card, for example, which probably costs the club money, but I have no idea whether cash or debit card is the better option, and don't mind being advised that one method or other is better for the club.

[AY Mod]

3 minutes ago, melmerby said:

But doesn't the value printed on it go down?😁

 

Every blooming month. 🙂

[298]

4 minutes ago, melmerby said:

Usually seems to happen when there is a big queue behind whomever is trying to pay by phone and they don't have any alternative payment means.☹️

 

I male an effort to have the correct cash available, sometimes in pound coins which is appreciated. 

 

But if I can pay for a 25p coffee at work with contactless payment, why not place a vending machine outside the door, set it to the entrance fee, and then use the empty cup as a ticket? It'd save any bother faffing about on the pay desk...

[woodenhead]

7 minutes ago, 298 said:

 

I male an effort to have the correct cash available, sometimes in pound coins which is appreciated. 

 

But if I can pay for a 25p coffee at work with contactless payment, why not place a vending machine outside the door, set it to the entrance fee, and then use the empty cup as a ticket? It'd save any bother faffing about on the pay desk...

If I can buy a 25p cup of coffee and enter a model railway show, I'll take both thank you.

 

Double win for me, but I suspect not very good for the show's coffers.

[Dungrange]

2 minutes ago, Jeremy Cumberland said:

I'll happily pay by whichever method incurs the least cost to the club. I wouldn't dream of using a credit card, for example, which probably costs the club money, but I have no idea whether cash or debit card is the better option, and don't mind being advised that one method or other is better for the club.

 

We've incurred an up front cost on the purchase of two card readers.  On top of that there will be a charge for processing each card transaction, which I understand is around 1% of the ticket cost, so in our case that's about 8p per adult ticket.  I don't think it matters whether it's a credit or debit card that's used, although I know that the charges for accepting Amex cards is higher.  Therefore, on pure cost grounds, cash is best for the club, but it's not a huge difference.  Furthermore, I don't fancy leaving the venue with a few thousand pounds in cash in my pocket and our insurance policy won't cover an eventuality where I'm mugged on the way to the bank with that much money.  Therefore, although we're aware that accepting cards means we'll have to pay some money to a card processing company, it reduces the need for us to handle too much cash.  That's also why we've offered an advanced purchase option.  Again, we'll get slightly less money than cash at the door, but it reduces the headache of handling too much cash.  Therefore, go with what is convenient for you.

[newbryford]

1 hour ago, Dungrange said:

 

I wasn't aware that card readers had a limit - I'd just assumed that they could process unlimited transactions.  I'll need to check up on how much our card readers can handle.

 

Sumup readers certainly have a limit.

Once you get to that number that's it until they are unlocked by filling in paperwork/jumping through hoops by providing more details about the account.

You can pre-empt it by sorting out the details beforehand.

 

ISTR it's to limit money-laundering.

 

 

 

[kipford]

We introduced card readers three years ago and also use them on our club bring and buy stand. The cash/card split is currently about 50/50, but I expect it to swing further towards cards. In terms of demographic it covers all the spectrum, but has proved very popular with families who do not normally carry cash at all and often have not come into the show because of the lack of cash. One unexpected advantage was making it easy to go down the queue before doors open selling tickets in advance which significantly reduced the time for the initial rush to enter the show. As others have said ensure ALL your door staff are familiar with the operation of the card reader and you have sufficient change for cash  customers. Most cash customers will come with £10 or £20 notes having just visited the cash point.

[Dungrange]

2 minutes ago, newbryford said:

ISTR it's to limit money-laundering.

 

That may well be the reason.

 

Our exhibition manager has got back to me to confirm that we don't have a limit on the number of transactions that we can process with Lopay, but we do have a limit on the amount of money that we can withdraw from the account in a single day, so if we have a very good show, it might take us several days to be able to access the income from ticket sales.  However, that shouldn't be a problem.

[melmerby]

26 minutes ago, Jeremy Cumberland said:

Most of the takeaways where I live don't take cards

There's only one around here that only takes cash (used to take cheques as well a while back), my favourite Chinese takeaway.

 

The barber's only takes cash, although perversely, you can only book up on an app!

Haven't been there for a while now.

[woodenhead]

Where I live - chippies take cards, Indian takeaways take cards but Chinese generally don't unless attached to a restaurant.

 

But as I typically do not frequent takeaways anymore it's rather moot.

[melmerby]

8 minutes ago, newbryford said:

ISTR it's to limit money-laundering.

A lot of extra laws were brought in.

e.g. I paid for a new car in 2007 with a card. (approx £17000)

Fast Forward to 2017 and cards weren't accepted due to money laundering.

[88D]

I take cash for second hand stalls, club stalls, smaller suppliers, etc. so, I tend to pay card so that I can have those shekels burning a hole in my pocket.

[jjb1970]

Whether right or wrong an increasing number of people use cards or Google/Apple pay (or similar) for everything. Once such payments pass a tipping point there's basically an expectation that everywhere will take them and people move on if it is cash only. Even cards are now in decline as more people use phones or smart watches to pay using things like Apple pay 

[Gilbert]

This really needs the third option of paying in advance to be comprehensive?

Chris

[Dungrange]

5 minutes ago, Gilbert said:

This really needs the third option of paying in advance to be comprehensive?

Chris

There is a separate poll for paying in advance.

 

 

[Gilbert]

9 minutes ago, Dungrange said:

There is a separate poll for paying in advance.

 

 

Different question - not a choice of the 3 payment options

[Dungrange]

27 minutes ago, 88D said:

I take cash for second hand stalls, club stalls, smaller suppliers, etc. so, I tend to pay card so that I can have those shekels burning a hole in my pocket.

 

I've been told that apparently traders like when clubs accept cards at the door for that very reason.

 

13 minutes ago, jjb1970 said:

Once such payments pass a tipping point there's basically an expectation that everywhere will take them and people move on if it is cash only.

 

I'm not sure whether we've reached that tipping point, but it certainly seems from the relatively small sample that have responded to this poll that most people want to pay by card where possible.

 

41 minutes ago, kipford said:

The cash/card split is currently about 50/50, but I expect it to swing further towards cards.

 

Interesting that you've noted a greater balance between cash and card than this poll suggests.  I wonder how much of that is due to a lack of awareness that you accept cards.  If an attendee paid in cash four years ago when you didn't accept cards, how long it takes them to realise that they can pay by card and switch.

 

46 minutes ago, kipford said:

One unexpected advantage was making it easy to go down the queue before doors open selling tickets in advance which significantly reduced the time for the initial rush to enter the show.

 

I'm hoping that we have a big queue at opening (in which case selling tickets in advance will be good - it was the reason we went for two card readers), but worrying that no-one turn up.  I don't really think that will be the case, but it's difficult to tell.  I'm just grateful to the traders who have placed their trust in us getting them some customers.