Bachmann product images from the Model and Hobby Show

[StaffsOatcake]

Could you modern folk please say class(or cl)350 ? It is very confusing for us older railwaymen types for whom a '350' is a class 08(or its similar brethren) shunter.

 

did you not know them 08;s as gronks or jockos?

[Guest Max Stafford]

Never heard the term 'Jocko' before I came on here. I'd heard a few old boys refer to them as '350s' though.

 

Dave.

[Pennine MC]

I think Jocko was a generic term for any shunter, in some places; Gronk AFAIK is more an enthusiast term.

[Gwiwer]

OT but posted to clarify comments above. The diesel shunter fleets were generally referred by crews and shed staff according to their power when introduced hence the reference to a "350" being a 350hp shunter. They were not classified into a numeric scheme (where classes 08-10 cover the majority of 350s) until long after their initial introduction. MAny staff continued to refer to them by power and a few still do to this day. Terms such as "Gronk" are also much more recent and appear to have originated within the enthusiast movement.

 

Now back to Bachmann.

[Oakydoke]

....looking at a 450 at Waterloo earlier today and noting the obvious provision for the retro-fiting of a pantograph got me thinking, what are the differences between the 350s and 450s.

 

Looking at Andy's photos, (specifically the 350/1 with the third rail gear) and some images of a South West Trains 450, apart from the absence of a pantograph none are immediately apparent to me.

 

Presumably there's some difference in under-frame equipment with regards to the rectification of AC current, or is this all contained within the same equipment cupboards underneath?

I agree it should be easy to produce a Class 450 from the Class 350 tooling - if there are any differences in the underfames, they will be minor compared to the alternative tooling options Bachmann have produced for other models.

 

There may well be internal differences such as seat layout but looking at photos nothing that affects the windows.

Apart from the pantograph, there should be very little difference between the 350 and 450, as the 350/1's were originally ordered as SWT 450's.

 

The 350/1's were originally part of the SWT order for the second batch of 450's (450/2), which were intended to be 5-car units.

The order was re-configured to provide 10 additional 4-car units for SWT's (to add to the first batch) and the remaining 120 vehicles were completed as 30 x 4-car units for Silverlink/Central Trains (now with LM).

 

In addition to the pantograph equipment, the AC bits underneath are also modular and can be changed or used alongside the specific DC bits. If there are any visible differences to the underfloor equipment, I would have thought this would be easy to incorporate on the model.

 

The seating is different though.

SWT's 450's have 3+2 commuter/suburban seating, where as the LM 350/1's are 2+2.

However, the later LM 350/2's are fitted out in 3+2 commuter/suburban configuration.

[Oakydoke]

With thanks to Andy Y for the images the items which stand out to me are the servicing shed and the 350. I might find a longer-term use for the former but very unlikely to be interested in the latter as is but as the basis for a possible 377 in the future it looks superb.

Not really. The 377 is an entirely different class unit train from a different manufacturer.

The Class 350 is one of the Seimens Desiro family and the Class 377 is a member of the Bombardier Electrostar family.

[phil gollin]

 

................. The 350/1's were originally part of the SWT order for the second batch of 450's (450/2), which were intended to be 5-car units. .....................

 

 

I remember all the "10" 10-coach stop signs going up on SW Division stations, and yet no 10-car trains coming !

 

.

[Southernman46]

I remember all the "10" 10-coach stop signs going up on SW Division stations, and yet no 10-car trains coming !

 

.

 

 

Platform extension works on the Waterloo - Windsor route are just about to commence for the 10-car scheme and are due for completion by December 2011.

 

SM46

[Peter Bedding]

Thanks for the Wiki link, which does seem well-informed. I suppose that actually all Tite's other main works were by 1970 either no longer surviving operational stations, or, beyond Salisbury, were in the custody of those nice people at Paddington, and thus outside Nigel W's bailiwick. I am reminded that the foreword is by Lance Ibbotson - not generally regarded as Southern Region's most charismatic GM - but sure to have limited his architects' ability to refer to relics. When the stations beyond Salisbury were "returned" to Southern in the mid-80s there was a GM's tour of inspection to Exeter Central, the draft notes of which referred to stations at places called Wimpole and Pinhole!

 

Hello Ian

 

We seem to be in agreement again. For all that I value my copy of W&M's little treatise, and I have only had tax-payer observer status on these BR politics, I have always had the private opinion that W&M were serving a partisan management attitude that did not want good reasons to preserve older buildings. Around 1981 - give or take a year - I was doing my own survey of Axminster station, then sadly half-derelict, and there was in the station a BR train that included a senior manager's saloon coach. I beaked in the saloon window and saw that the select group of passengers had enjoyed a good lunch. Following that event, Axminster has slowly been recovered closer to what I think should be its historic value. So I think that particular lunch was well deserved. Listing of buildings must be a right pain-in-the-neck where the owner has to provide a public service that moves with the times, but, for example, the trashing of the Doric Arch was unforgiveable.

 

So all that said and done, more power to the 4mm architects at Barwell, Margate and elsewhere. I am grateful for what I hope to receive. Soon?

 

PB

[John M Upton]

Platform extension works on the Waterloo - Windsor route are just about to commence for the 10-car scheme and are due for completion by December 2011.

 

Of course bar the express Class 444's, SWT don't actually have any EMU's capable of numerically running as ten cars but that is just a minor thing to be overlooked up at DfT Towers... There is still the oft reheated rumour about using the ex Gat Ex 460's cars to bump up the 458's but I think at the rate things are moving (or not as the case maybe) hell will be needing to check their central heating boiler is working first before that happens.

 

(And no, they are not getting Southern's 456's!!)

[Julia]

I look at the photos and I am impressed, they all look very nice. But one thing I find myself thinking as I look at the single road shed: "I do hope those lights work and aren't just cosmetic" I know its a lot to ask for and not the simplest of tasks, but if those flood lights on the building were fitted with the tiny white LED's that you can get these days, it would be fantastic!

 

Just my 2p.

 

J