Hornby corroded class 31 chassis

[mikesndbs]

oh UTTER terror, just got my 31 270 out to find this same issue it's literally falling apart, gutted as I love it.

Rails Sheffield Feb 2007 brand new.

 

The chassis is crumbling, unbelievable.

 

Are other loco types affected the same, this is a terrifying development

Edited January 18, 2015 by mikesndbs

[mossdp]

 

Are other loco types affected the same, this is a terrifying development

- Certain Hornby Bulleid Pacifics have suffered from crumbling front bogies. From the Hornby Thomas range, Toby and possibly Bill and Ben.

 

- Quite a variety of different Heljan 47s but not all those of any particular batch - it seems to be rather random. The very earliest and very latest Heljan 47s seem OK (so far). There is at least one thread about this on this forum I think.

 

- From Bachmann, the running plate of BR black N class 31813 and the bogies towers of BR blue Warship D804 "Avenger". I think there are threads on here about these as well. Possibly some of the earlier Junior series of models.

 

- Back in the mists of time in the 1950s when Graham Farish made 00 models, the streamlined Merchant Navy, King, Black 5, early production GWR Prairies, early Pullman cars with cast chassis, and some wagons were affected.

 

- Before the war, some of the earliest Hornby Dublo locos suffered from disintegrating wheels.

 

There are reports of other different models suffering as well, but they appear to be more isolated incidents.

[mikesndbs]

well, in pure panic I just dug out my Bachmann N and two Heljan 47s from 2005/7 and all are fine! thank the lord.

This has really shaken me however. I take the very best of care of my locos and to think that some may be sitting there rotting away makes my blood run cold

Will report back on Hornby's response.

[BR(S)]

Will report back on Hornby's response.

 

They are currently sending people £100 vouchers to be used on their website.

[mossdp]

well, in pure panic I just dug out my Bachmann N and two Heljan 47s from 2005/7 and all are fine! thank the lord.

This has really shaken me however. I take the very best of care of my locos and to think that some may be sitting there rotting away makes my blood run cold

Will report back on Hornby's response.

 

I suggest sending just the chassis block back to Hornby after removing absolutely everything from it. You may get a new block although I believe they are now out of stock. If you send the whole loco and you get a £100 voucher (only valid direct with Hornby), you do not get the loco back. The £100 will not buy a new super detail 31 from Hornby (they are more than £160) even if there were any for sale. Sending the block only, you may end up having to improvise a chassis for your 31 and have £100 to spend on the Hornby website. Not ideal, but unless they have the chassis blocks available, this will be the best outcome.

[mikesndbs]

Just gets worse! That's the issue I want the super detailed 31 not £100 or anything else.

Ok the loco has been here for 7 years but it is clear it was a fault at their end that caused the problem.

Will let you know what I hear back.

I'll take the suggestion of just sending the block.

[DropTheTap]

well, in pure panic I just dug out my Bachmann N and two Heljan 47s from 2005/7 and all are fine! thank the lord.

This has really shaken me however. I take the very best of care of my locos and to think that some may be sitting there rotting away makes my blood run cold

Will report back on Hornby's response.

 

Why wouldn't they be? This issue is solely confined to a small number of variants of Hornby's OO class 31 model.

 

Deep breaths there fella, it's not like you spilled coffee over your new cure for cancer or anything...

[mikesndbs]

Why wouldn't they be? This issue is solely confined to a small number of variants of Hornby's OO class 31 model.

 

Deep breaths there fella, it's not like you spilled coffee over your new cure for cancer or anything...

 

OK of course I am not comparing this to cancer cures or other world tragedies but we are on a model railway forum and this does affect that subject greatly.

If you read back through the thread you will note that this issues does indeed mention the other brands as being affected by this dreadful corrosion.

The idea of treasured models, (some given by loved ones who have passed etc) sitting rotting away in their safe storage boxes is for me highly alarming.

I do however appreciate you are trying to calm me which I am greatly thankful for  

[BR(S)]

It's always worth a reminder from time-to-time for people who haven't seen the relevant threads that the most affected models from recent times have been the Hornby 31s as noted on this thread and numerous Heljan Class 47s. 

 

The best advice if you are storing these locos in their boxes is to remove the body from the chassis; if the Mazak does expand, at least the body won't be ruined, some of which are now difficult to find.

[richierich]

There is a pic somewhere on here of a Heljan 47 145, where the chassis has grown in length by about 10mm and just smashed though the cab front!

 

It's difficult problem because I have a despite receiving a voucher it has been at least since 2012 since Hornby has produced the super detailed class 31, and 2008 since a BR blue example in 31 165.

 

There is suppose to be the DCR green 31 453 due in February, but the price is £160!

 

I'm trying a novel approach in scratch building a replacement chassis block from plasticard. Although it won't have the weight of the metal chassis. If only Hornby would produce some spare chassis blocks and make these available, then could do a proper rebuild job.

 

Those who have used the chassis block off a model with metal pest for a Lima body have a ticking time bomb, because the entire chassis block eventually expands and crumbles, so may damage the Lima body!!!!! The better way forward is to transfer the running gear etc to the Lima underframe, as seen on the Brush Type 2 rebirth thread on here.

Edited January 20, 2015 by richierich

[45059]

I suggest sending just the chassis block back to Hornby after removing absolutely everything from it. You may get a new block although I believe they are now out of stock. If you send the whole loco and you get a £100 voucher (only valid direct with Hornby), you do not get the loco back. The £100 will not buy a new super detail 31 from Hornby (they are more than £160) even if there were any for sale. Sending the block only, you may end up having to improvise a chassis for your 31 and have £100 to spend on the Hornby website. Not ideal, but unless they have the chassis blocks available, this will be the best outcome.

You don't get the loco back you say? Well I did. Twice. 

 

My 31270 was replaced like for like a year or so back with the original returned to me. And my Dutch 31110 was replaced with a £100 voucher, which became a metals sector class 60.

 

The Dutch 31 was also returned- it was the exact same loco, as I had removed some of the grills as a precaution as these were needed for another project.

 

Just mention in your covering letter when you send the broken loco to Hornby that you'd like the loco back and it will be returned. HTH.

[mikesndbs]

You don't get the loco back you say? Well I did. Twice. 

 

My 31270 was replaced like for like a year or so back with the original returned to me. And my Dutch 31110 was replaced with a £100 voucher, which became a metals sector class 60.

 

The Dutch 31 was also returned- it was the exact same loco, as I had removed some of the grills as a precaution as these were needed for another project.

 

Just mention in your covering letter when you send the broken loco to Hornby that you'd like the loco back and it will be returned. HTH.

 

Let's hope so, still waiting the first reply from them yet. Will report back

[brittannia]

I asked for 31270 body back after reading above,  telephoned Hornby Monday to request it back and ask on progress of claim, told it was being assessed and a note of sending body back was put on my file, was not bothered about the chassis as it was absolutely shattered, plus had a real struggle to separate body and  the chassis bits to retrieve my sound decoder.

However received letter today with code for £100 to spend on Hornby website, no mention of the body though, I suspect things have crossed in processing, So I will wait and see if I do get the body back which had very little damage to it.

Whatever the result I feel Hornby have been admiral in their handling of the 31s, this was my second compensation plus I had earlier had a complete replacement for 31110 which then met the same failure fate.

[mikesndbs]

I sincerely hope they give me a new 270 and like above I have requested the old body back at least so I have something from my late wife's last train gift to me.

[45059]

I do seem to recall that my £100 voucher and the broken loco arrived a few days from each other, so fingers crossed a body may still arrive brittannia.

 

mikesndbs. My records show that I received my replacement 31270 on 14th March 2013 after having read in the model railway media that Hornby had replacements in stock.

 

Regrettably, I don't believe that they have had any replacement 270s for a while now, (though I'd be happy to be corrected) so you may have to settle for the voucher.

 

On the plus side, you should receive your old bodyshell with it's obvious sentimental value back.

[brittannia]

Thanks 45059 for your encouragement on the bodies, as for the £100, I am quite happy to purchase Class 60, 60099, for the £4.99 and free postage.

[jjb1970]

I do not think Hornby can be faulted on their handling of this issue. If a model is 6 or 7 years old then it is long out of guarantee, the purchaser has had a few years good use and enjoyment out of it and £100 is probably more than it cost in the first place. That is excellent customer service IMO.

[mikesndbs]

Well , my body only had one small split which could be repaired so if they have a new chassis for me I live in hopes 270 may be back on the rails.

I agree from the sound of it Hornby seem to be being good over the issue.

But to take up a point above, while it is 6 or 7 years old, many people buy to put away and collect (not me really) they are also entitled to expect that if properly cared for the locos should be in good order still.

The idea of these rotting away is a dreadful prospect, the fact that 270 was a super detail special model should in my opinion elicit far more customer care than a lower end of the market model.

[brittannia]

Regarding the sending back of damaged 31s, Hornby told me they would send in two boxes, as the replacement model is sent from the holding warehouse and the bodies from where it was sent to.

[jjb1970]

Whilst I agree mazak rot should not happen and it is clearly a failure of product quality it is not really Hornby's faults if a customer leaves it in a box for six or seven years and thus has had no enjoyment from the model. As a supplier they are offering a £100 voucher to customers who bought a defective product six or seven years ago who have had the opportunity to have a lot of pleasure and enjoment out of that model. That is way outside the warranty period and Hornby are not obligated to do this and having suffered this issue with some diecast models it is very unusual in my experience for a model manufacturer to do this. True, £100 will not pay for a replacement super detailed Hornby diesel unless it is in their last chance bargain section but you can't expect them to give you a voucher for say £150 when the SRP of these models six or seven years ago was nothing like what it is now and when in those days discounts of 20-30% were quite normal in many suppliers. I know it is popular to see Hornby customer care negatively but in this case I really think they are acting in an exemplary manner.

[mikesndbs]

Whilst I agree mazak rot should not happen and it is clearly a failure of product quality it is not really Hornby's faults if a customer leaves it in a box for six or seven years and thus has had no enjoyment from the model. As a supplier they are offering a £100 voucher to customers who bought a defective product six or seven years ago who have had the opportunity to have a lot of pleasure and enjoment out of that model. That is way outside the warranty period and Hornby are not obligated to do this and having suffered this issue with some diecast models it is very unusual in my experience for a model manufacturer to do this. True, £100 will not pay for a replacement super detailed Hornby diesel unless it is in their last chance bargain section but you can't expect them to give you a voucher for say £150 when the SRP of these models six or seven years ago was nothing like what it is now and when in those days discounts of 20-30% were quite normal in many suppliers. I know it is popular to see Hornby customer care negatively but in this case I really think they are acting in an exemplary manner.

 

 

I don't see them negatively at all, in fact they have been great to me! But the reason why they are sorting this matter out is probably because they encourage collectors to buy their products. Collectors usually just display things, in this case even this fails as the model explodes! For me I am really praying they can put a new chassis under my old body at least! I wanted 270 like she is and am not at all interested in money, I'd even pay something towards getting back what i had.

[david12345]

My understanding of consumer law us that you are entitled to a repair or replacement for a period of 5 years if the item was to be expected to last for at least that amount of time. If a repair or replacement is not available a partial refund should be offered. I would hope a model train would fall into that category.

As most of these models are 6 or 7 years old I would say Hornby are acting fairly.

[Derekstuart]

Mike

 

I am sorry to read of your (and others) problems. You are quite right to try and sort it amicably and that is commendable.

 

However, to correct a couple of errors that people have made:

WARRANTY: This is not a statury fixed time. It is whatever is considered 'reasonable'. Can you convince someone that a model should last more than 6 or 7 years? Given that I have a pile of 20-30 year old models here in perfect working order, I would say "yes". So for those saying Hornby don't need to do this, I beg to differ.

£100 compensation: If a manufacturer is liable (technically it is actually the retailer, but let's not split hairs) is responsible (see above) then it would be reasonable for you to have a like-for-like exchange, LESS any material depreciation. Ie if we were talking about a car, and it was a makers recall and you bought it for £10,000 but used it 2 years, you couldn't expect £10K back. If this was in a Court, then a Judge would seek to put you back into the position you were before the incident occurred. Which would entail a replacement unit or a CASH refund.

I applaud your approach, but be advised of that IF you do need to put any pressure on.

Edited January 22, 2015 by Derekstuart

[Derekstuart]

David

 

Sorry, our posts came at the same time and we've answered very similar points.

 

You are nearly right on that, but not exactly. The regulations are as clear as mud inasmuch as it is "what is reasonable." What is the reasonable lifespan of a model? Is it reasonably expected to replace a motor/gearing after 5 years. Perhaps. Is it reasonably expected for the user to replace a cast chassis after 5 years, I would suggest that it is not.

 

 

Derek

My understanding of consumer law us that you are entitled to a repair or replacement for a period of 5 years if the item was to be expected to last for at least that amount of time. If a repair or replacement is not available a partial refund should be offered. I would hope a model train would fall into that category.
As most of these models are 6 or 7 years old I would say Hornby are acting fairly.

Edited January 22, 2015 by Derekstuart

[brittannia]

Regarding my earlier posts , my replacement class 60 and the damaged class 31 body both arrived today,  the body via royal mail and the class 60 via UK Mail .I was also told by Hornby there were no spare chassis