Guest Tom F Posted July 30, 2012 Share Posted July 30, 2012 Big improvement Steve! I loathe the coal insert on these Bachmann tenders, the fact it is removable yet moulded to the coal plate seems very odd! Regarding the smokebox door handrail, I'd go the hole hog and get hold of a Hornby A3 door then you loose that awful bulbous look. It's great to see, that although the loco body has many imperfections as we have been discussing, it is making us all do some modelling! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluex5 Posted July 30, 2012 Share Posted July 30, 2012 Am i right in thinking that the coal insert is just attached to the divider plate then, rather than all the way around? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
micklner Posted July 30, 2012 Share Posted July 30, 2012 I wouldnt reuse the Coal Insert, much easier to make a new Coal shape layer from kitchen towe, glue it into the space. Paint it matt black then add real coal on top. The other main problem is the diabolical Boiler Dome is this replaceable without a lot of filing ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Tom F Posted July 30, 2012 Share Posted July 30, 2012 I wouldnt reuse the Coal Insert, much easier to make a new Coal shape layer from kitchen towe, glue it into the space. Paint it matt black then add real coal on top. The other main problem is the diabolical Boiler Dome is this replaceable without a lot of filing ? Totally agree about the dome. It's horrid in the fact there is hardly a lip and it's almost flush with the boiler. I think it will be a filing job When Tim arrives, it looks like tomorrow's attention will be fully on the V2. By tomorrow evening we should have a V2 which looks slightly more V2 like! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robmcg Posted July 30, 2012 Share Posted July 30, 2012 Totally agree about the dome. It's horrid in the fact there is hardly a lip and it's almost flush with the boiler. I think it will be a filing job When Tim arrives, it looks like tomorrow's attention will be fully on the V2. By tomorrow evening we should have a V2 which looks slightly more V2 like! I very much look forward to your experiments and modifications, Tom, and Tim. If ever there was a model which could use some detail improvements it's this one. I say this because I have just been photographing a Bachmann Standard 3MT 2-6-2T and it is very very impressive, and seems to fly somewhat under the radar. Still waiting for delivery of my 60860, though. All power to your minds and hands in improving the V2. Rob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium 31A Posted July 30, 2012 RMweb Premium Share Posted July 30, 2012 Big improvement Steve! I loathe the coal insert on these Bachmann tenders, the fact it is removable yet moulded to the coal plate seems very odd! Regarding the smokebox door handrail, I'd go the hole hog and get hold of a Hornby A3 door then you loose that awful bulbous look. It's great to see, that although the loco body has many imperfections as we have been discussing, it is making us all do some modelling! Thanks, Tom! I had a spare A3 single chimney; however I can't envisage a situation whereby I'd have a spare A3 smokebox door - maybe somebody does a casting? Am i right in thinking that the coal insert is just attached to the divider plate then, rather than all the way around? Correct - the coal and rear coal plate are in one piece; it isn't usually glued but just prises out. You can push it out if necessary by putting a screwdriver through the square hole behind the front plate, above where the fire iron tunnel should be. I wouldnt reuse the Coal Insert, much easier to make a new Coal shape layer from kitchen towe, glue it into the space. Paint it matt black then add real coal on top. The other main problem is the diabolical Boiler Dome is this replaceable without a lot of filing ? I might reduce the plastic coal even more by sanding, but it makes a lot of dust! Or sometimes I carve a block of balsa, paint it black and glue the coal to that - undecided so far, really. Unfortunately the dome (unlike the chimney) is moulded as part of the boiler; you could either remove it by filing off and replace it with a casting, or reshape it by laminating plasticard on top and then filing. I've never done either because the paintwork would be spoilt (on reflection, with 60821 in that state, perhaps I could get away with it!). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davidw Posted July 30, 2012 Share Posted July 30, 2012 Certainly Dave, here we go. Front view, showing the repositioned lower lamp irons made from staple wire, with lamps positioned to show the altered relationship of lamps to buffers. Also the AWS protection plate, from brass strip (etch scrap), the visible bit 5.5mm wide by 6mm deep with a 'double right angle' bend at the top to allow it to be glued beneath and behind the buffer beam. Note on the big Gresleys this plate isn't central but offset slightly to the driver's side, to clear the vac pipe upstand - correctly modelled on the Hornby A3. I've also fitted a screw coupling from an old PC Models etch (other makes are available). Tender top, with the plastic coal sawn off the rear coal plate (the whole thing's just a push fit), the plate then glued back onto the rear of the coal space. These pictures also show the Cartazzi truck, cab steps etc. And then with the plastic coal placed back loosely in position, having 'lowered' it by sanding and filing away the bottom of the moulding so that it sits lower in the tender, to allow some real coal to be glued over it later: By contrast, here's one I did earlier, New England's 60821 (was 60856) in typical condition on which I rebuilt the rear frames from Plasticard and ABS axlebox / spring castings, and cobbled together an inside-framed pony truck from bits of the original one and an old V1 pony truck. The steps are also from Plasticard, and the ashpan operating linkage (I think it is) is made up from bits of brass strip. I also filled in the bottom front corners of the firebox (behind the triangular protrusions beneath the running plate), and added the big curved brackets which support the running plate just ahead of the firebox. The chimney on this one's from a Hornby single-chimneyed A3. Just looking at these pictures again, it's occurred to me another quick win would be to replace the moulded smokebox door handles with brass ones. Interesting re. the brass driving axle bearings; I've got an O4 but never needed to examine it closely as it's always been such a good runner! The other locos mentioned aren't in my collection (have to draw the line somewhere!), but it certainly seems to be a step forwards. 60821 looks reasonable Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silverlink Posted July 31, 2012 Share Posted July 31, 2012 Ref coal in tender, the coal molding is as previously said a removable item however, once removed you still have a flat piece of plastic which sits quite high in the tender. Laying coal on this in my view will not make that much difference as it will still look like a very full tender! In thread 124 you will see that by cutting out the plastic top you can make a more passable coal area where a much lower coal load can be fitted. Once I have weathered my V2 I will post a picture complete with coal for you to see. Ian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
S.A.C Martin Posted July 31, 2012 Share Posted July 31, 2012 My V2 has arrived today, along with a few Hornby single chimneys. First impressions are good, the loco is a bit noisier than I expected but it is much, much smoother than any of my previous V2s, possibly on a par with my Bachmann A2 actually! The paint finish is superb and I was surprised to find sprung buffers on my example, but I'm reliably informed this was a modification made well before this release. The dome has to go, as will the chimney and smokebox door, but I'm leaning towards it being a bit more than passable when you take into account the supremely good paint finish. I wondered if it was looking better than previous editions, and the reason for that is that they've included the grey lining with the cream this time around, which improves the overall look no end. I'm a lot happier at forking out for this model than I was a week ago when I considered the modifications it would need, but since it's this at box shifter prices or no V2 at all, I will be adding to my stud most assuredly by the end of this year, intending to standardize on the black V2 with a good few examples. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluex5 Posted July 31, 2012 Share Posted July 31, 2012 Simon, if your V2 is especially noisy I'd send it back. My "Durham School" is virtually silent yet my green one sounded like a coffee grinder (although the drunken waddling was the final straw in sending it back). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
S.A.C Martin Posted July 31, 2012 Share Posted July 31, 2012 Simon, if your V2 is especially noisy I'd send it back. My "Durham School" is virtually silent yet my green one sounded like a coffee grinder (although the drunken waddling was the final straw in sending it back). It's no noisier than many of my older models. I suspect with running in it will be a lot better sounding, but it definitely does not waddle! Just been comparing the smokebox doors for the replacement to fit. I do think this is a model which can be improved beyond its inadequacies to present a decent representation of the V2 class, but obviously I shall have to grin and bear the mishapen boiler (more or less). And now that I've committed to all of that, we will get a new V2 from Hornby next year. Guaranteed. It happened with the Clan, it happened with the A2, it happened with the L1 and I'm more or less prepared for someone to do it with the V2 as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamie Posted July 31, 2012 Share Posted July 31, 2012 Re. brass driving axle bearings - these made their debut on the NRM 4P or Midland 3F IIRC. While very welcome, this could mean that the V2 shares the unusual axle diameter of aforesaid LMS types, a potential complication for EM conversions. Don't know for sure: I don't have one, but something to watch out for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
micklner Posted July 31, 2012 Share Posted July 31, 2012 And now that I've committed to all of that, we will get a new V2 from Hornby next year. Guaranteed. It happened with the Clan, it happened with the A2, it happened with the L1 and I'm more or less prepared for someone to do it with the V2 as well. They will be daft if they dont. GS Tender done. Simples Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium 31A Posted July 31, 2012 RMweb Premium Share Posted July 31, 2012 Ref coal in tender, the coal molding is as previously said a removable item however, once removed you still have a flat piece of plastic which sits quite high in the tender. Laying coal on this in my view will not make that much difference as it will still look like a very full tender! In thread 124 you will see that by cutting out the plastic top you can make a more passable coal area where a much lower coal load can be fitted. Once I have weathered my V2 I will post a picture complete with coal for you to see. Ian I read your post, and you have made a very neat job of constructing the coal space. However having done similar myself in the past a couple of times with these tenders, I've found removing the 'false top' leaves a horizontal ridge along the inside of the tender, as the sides are moulded thicker from this point down. I've always found it very difficult to completely eradicate this by filing / sanding and decided it was easiest to disguise it by covering it with the coal - in which case, back to square one (or almost)! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timara Posted July 31, 2012 Share Posted July 31, 2012 So, here's what the new V2 (Tom F's) can look like with a new door, dome and chimney.... I've also had a go at the cab glazing and made it flush to the cabsides, instead of how it comes. I'd certainly go so far as to say it looks so much more like a V2 than it did before. Just cab doors, tender alterations, final detailing and weathering to go and it's done Cheers, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium 31A Posted July 31, 2012 RMweb Premium Share Posted July 31, 2012 I must say, the new dome is a big improvement - how did you do that then? How do you plan to do the cab doors - will it still go round curves? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timara Posted July 31, 2012 Share Posted July 31, 2012 I must say, the new dome is a big improvement - how did you do that then? How do you plan to do the cab doors - will it still go round curves? Thanks Steve. I've used one of Graeme King's new resin domes (meant for an A3) and also a Margate A3 chimney. The cab doors will be those available from Peasholm Models (our very own silverlink) and there is still plenty of gap between loco and tender at its closest setting. HTH Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
S.A.C Martin Posted July 31, 2012 Share Posted July 31, 2012 Big, big difference that. Good work lads. Something to aim for with everyone else's V2s. Curious about the smokebox door - it looks like a seamless addition there. That dome really does hide a multitude of sins too... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timara Posted July 31, 2012 Share Posted July 31, 2012 Big, big difference that. Good work lads. Something to aim for with everyone else's V2s. Curious about the smokebox door - it looks like a seamless addition there. That dome really does hide a multitude of sins too... It's this one here. I've retained the outer smokebox ring, after both razor-sawing and filing the original abomination off and then carefully cut the outer surround off the Hornby door. It makes a massive difference and you really do not see the diameter discrepancy at all. Also, the new dome does indeed do as you say it does. I was rather amazed at the transformation to be honest! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
S.A.C Martin Posted July 31, 2012 Share Posted July 31, 2012 Thanks Tim RE the smokebox door. Food for thought that indeed, and it does make the overall model much more V2 like. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timara Posted July 31, 2012 Share Posted July 31, 2012 That's OK Simon . I have to admit that a lot of the faults with the model just seem to vanish with the new parts. The dome fools the eye that the taper isn't there and the door has so much more of a Gresley face to it, so you don't notice that it's 1mm greater in diameter than it should be. Perhaps the fact that it's black helps it to hide things better? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Tom F Posted July 31, 2012 Share Posted July 31, 2012 I must say, after watching Tim do the work, I'm astounded at the difference it has made. The smokebox door just looks perfect. I have the horrid Bachmann one here and it will be duly heading for the fireplace! Just shows that with a bit of time and thought, Bachmann could have gone some way to improving the V2 even without doing a new body! Although this way, it does mean we can enjoy some modelling! Tim is currently adding Klear, and then we will move on to adding the cab doors and sorting that coal space out! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium 31A Posted July 31, 2012 RMweb Premium Share Posted July 31, 2012 I must say, the new dome is a big improvement - how did you do that then? How do you plan to do the cab doors - will it still go round curves? Thanks Tim, must admit I hadn't thought about cab doors - food for thought there. I am however still thinking about a fall plate to cover the gap between engine and tender; however neither my Isinglass drawing nor the picture of an 'uncoupled' V2 in the Green Book show one. I may have to track down Green Arrow and have a look for myself... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Tom F Posted July 31, 2012 Share Posted July 31, 2012 Thanks Tim, must admit I hadn't thought about cab doors - food for thought there. I am however still thinking about a fall plate to cover the gap between engine and tender; however neither my Isinglass drawing nor the picture of an 'uncoupled' V2 in the Green Book show one. I may have to track down Green Arrow and have a look for myself... Fully recommend Ian Harper's (silverlink) cab doors. Sold under Peasholm Models. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robmcg Posted July 31, 2012 Share Posted July 31, 2012 Brilliant stuff, Tom and Tim, inspirational. Still waiting for my 60860 'Durham School' here in NZ. May I ask if you blacked the rods and valve gear, or was that the vagaries of light? Rob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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