Hornby 2012 - Reasonable Speculation Thread!

[Bilbo]

Class 67 and Grey Tornado, Thats my final(and only) word.

[Oldddudders]

 

Now that's something that I don't recall having been done by a manufacturer for an RTR loco - outshopped in lined* works grey for the photo session. Another livery option, but would it sell by the bucket load ?... dilbert

* as appropriate

Did Bachmann not do an N in some sort of works grey, maybe as a limited edition?

[spamcan61]

Did Bachmann not do an N in some sort of works grey, maybe as a limited edition?

 

Yes, there was a twin pack with one in SECR Grey and one in Maunsell green:-

 

http://www.semgonlin.../bach-nvar.html

[WindyHale76]

Well just a curiousity but what if Hornby used their Airfix label to introduce some locomotive kits, upto 21st Century spec with Cartograph Decals for linings and numbering. This may not only cover famous locomotive such as the Flying Scotsman and the Duchess of Sutherland and maybe some small shunters too. With the refinements of injected plastics it can also be used to built variants of locomotives in these classes too such as the Gresley A1 and A10 and finally the A3 and with the duchess a sloped smokebox front and unsloped smokebox.

 

It may be going back tho the days of Kitmaster but Revell make models of steam locomtives and some diesel and they seem to sell. So it may be a new area for Hornby to enter.

 

If they did this how many people would be happy to make these and then place them in their display cabinets

[Ceptic]

 

Now that's something that I don't recall having been done by a manufacturer for an RTR loco - outshopped in lined* works grey for the photo session. Another livery option, but would it sell by the bucket load ?... dilbert

 

 

* as appropriate

 

Bit of of Grey area, this.

 

IIRC, the ad.for the commissioned, lined Photographic Grey BoB 'Fighter Command' seemed to appear in modelling mags for months on end, possibly years.

[frobisher]

Well just a curiousity but what if Hornby used their Airfix label to introduce some locomotive kits, upto 21st Century spec with Cartograph Decals for linings and numbering. This may not only cover famous locomotive such as the Flying Scotsman and the Duchess of Sutherland and maybe some small shunters too. With the refinements of injected plastics it can also be used to built variants of locomotives in these classes too such as the Gresley A1 and A10 and finally the A3 and with the duchess a sloped smokebox front and unsloped smokebox.

 

It may be going back tho the days of Kitmaster but Revell make models of steam locomtives and some diesel and they seem to sell. So it may be a new area for Hornby to enter.

 

If they did this how many people would be happy to make these and then place them in their display cabinets

 

Nice idea in theory, the big problem is tooling costs (again). Almost by definition, tooling up one of these kits would pretty much cost the same as tooling up a RTR loco, but you have the added problem in that your sale price can't be as high as said RTR loco (perhaps at best 25%) yet you still need to recoup the tooling cost in that, so you need to sell a higher volume. But a decent chassis under it would be a must, even if it then went on to be display only. You could get a long way by starting a range that has a high number of common components between locos - say a range of BR standards for instance, or perhaps the right subset of GWR ones.

 

If Hornby didn't produce RTR it would probably be more attractive to them, as it makes more economic sense for them to put the effort into producing a RTR loco than a kit.

[stevetreble]

 

As for only producing Great Western models not covered in kit/rtr form before, the list is fairly short and I cannot see either of the big two introducing broad gauge.

 

Regards

 

Mike Wiltshire

 

True, especially as they are likely to want prototypes that lasted into BR days. But, the 64xx and 42xx that are popular choices on the wish lists would fit the bill. I appreciate that the 42xx has been covered in kit form, and I believe there are 3 options available for it at the moment. But, the ones I am aware of all have their issues.

[WindyHale76]

 

Nice idea in theory, the big problem is tooling costs (again). Almost by definition, tooling up one of these kits would pretty much cost the same as tooling up a RTR loco, but you have the added problem in that your sale price can't be as high as said RTR loco (perhaps at best 25%) yet you still need to recoup the tooling cost in that, so you need to sell a higher volume. But a decent chassis under it would be a must, even if it then went on to be display only. You could get a long way by starting a range that has a high number of common components between locos - say a range of BR standards for instance, or perhaps the right subset of GWR ones.

 

If Hornby didn't produce RTR it would probably be more attractive to them, as it makes more economic sense for them to put the effort into producing a RTR loco than a kit.

 

Well if not locomotives, perhaps they could do coaching stock too, they could try small with a small shunter perhaps a class 08 and see what the reception is like for this. If they wanted to branch out perhaps some industrial style buildings which due to the manufacturing limitations cannot be made in resin like the skaledale range. It could in this way introduce children into the hobby as Airfix is more readily available than Hornby. If any hobby is to survive it has to look to a younger generation of people and something like this might be the way. Besides if they made some industrial buildings if could be used by wargamers.

 

Hornby have several factors they could take advantage of:-

 

Airfix to make a range of building or lineside details

Hornby to make the rolling stock to run on this

Corgi to make road vehicles to this set

 

If they made a box set diorama of this say a Dockside boxset, it could get people interested in the hobby and with the have a nice diorama in a modest space.

 

 

[davidw]

I think we'll be shocked at the increased in price of items from China.

 

It's a difficult balancing between the cost to make and what price that you and I will be prepared to pay. I know this comment runs parallel with the "Hornby's future is cheap toys", thread.

 

Will there be a premium set of products yes - though I suspect not as many as we've been used to - Hornby are still playing catch up.

 

I see them broadening the Railroad/Tornado market.

 

In this we could perhaps see a Rail road Duchess/Princess. The later a long history with Hornby. I read that the DOG has been mentioned. But not got the qudos of Tornado thanks to the like of Top Gear featuring it.

 

A GWR tank is likely -premium range.

 

I'd like due to personal preference to see further ER subjects. As so many of what have been released are duplicates.

 

And of course the Class67 appeared and then disappeared this year I suspect that may be announced.

 

Coaching stock: thompson gangway stock I'd like to see but I suspect we see a range of LMS Subs. Possible further enhancements to the Gresley, Stanier, Mausell and Hawsworth gangwayed ranges. The basic tooling is there. Sides roof, interior and underframe details.

 

A Gresley Resturant 1st would be useful to me.

 

If Hornby folllow the trend of offering more iconic coaches - such as the observation saloon I wonder if we'll see twins and triplet sets.

 

Either way - I'm sure there'll nbe surprises

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Budgie]

Not agreed - I'd rather a 64XX/74XX and I think the flexibility they would offer, especially from a fresh start, plus the 'novelty' of a new type in the marketplace would be better than messing with the 14XX which needs a new chassis plus some work on the body. But no doubt we'll not see it for the Xth year running.

If they produce a 64xx, I'd also like to see them produce autocoaches as converted from Collett non-gangwayed stock. And while they're at it, I'd like to see them produce a range of the said Collett non-gangwayed stock, so I can run 5-car sets up the "valleys" of my garden layout.

[WindyHale76]

Well heard rumours a while ago that Hornby moved their production line for Airfix to India due to costing was better for money and also less chances of their molds being copied and sold at a knock down price. But I don't think they will do that for their Railway range as they are tied in with the same company which manufactures Bachmann being in the same factory. But there could be advantages to moving it such as costings maybe cheaper and India is an expanding manufacturing base and maybe quality control maybe better and the majority of Indians speak English to some degree (call centres excluded).

[John of Gaunt]

All I want is a J69, or maybe a J15.

[34theletterbetweenB&D]

...A lack of excitement (for GWR) in the range. Yes the Grange was new, but the new Castle and 28xx were retools of models that have been available for years. Compare that to what some of the other companies have received, and it has all been a bit ho-hum...

This is a classic double edged sword situation. The main reason the GWR was 'pushed' so strongly for modelling purposes in the 1960s and 70s was because of its 'ho-hum'-ness. People generally had relatively little money for their modelling, the RTR ranges were limited in scope, and the GWR's standardisation by the 1930s offered a solution as compared to all the other railway systems. With a GWR based model railway a few well chosen items could make a decently representative model in a way that was largely impossible elsewhere. No one then was thinking about the longer term problem of 'seen one GWR 4-6-0, seen them all!' once people had a bit more money to throw at their hobby.

 

When the manufacturer's present requirements of model subject include 'survived in service into late BR steam, (because that's where the majority of sales are made)', there isn't much left in the way of numerous classes of GWR origin without RTR models. I seriously suggested to Hornby back in 2004 that they should consider the sadly abandoned 'last look forward' in GWR steam power, as a model to go on sale for the centenary of its introduction in 2008. But they didn't feel at the time that it would get the sales. Perhaps in the present environment it stands a better chance, and it should be proposed again perhaps for the centenary if its destruction? Was there anything else exciting on the steam front out of Swindon after Churchward stepped down, that hasn't already got a RTR model? That barrel has been near scraped out I reckon, just...

 

 

...If I worked at Hornby and was contemplating a new GWR model and wanted it to be successful, then I would look at something that has never been done before, isn't available as a quality kit, covered as many modelling periods as possible, wasn't too rare, and release it in several liveries all at once. I really don't think retooling another exisiting model like the 48xx would have the same sales impact...

For example??

The wishlist based proposal of the heavy freight tanks seem to me to fit the bill (leaving out of consideration the quality kit availability) of which the 42xx is the obvious one with the longest service life

[Ed-farms]

Here is my predictions:-

 

A class 67 is the only certainty. Hattons put it up on their list but then took it down and I am sure I read that it was planned for this year but dropped as it would not be ready in time so it should make this years list.

 

An A4 as Dominion of New Zealand with 2 tenders is surely a logical choice given the popularity of the real thing.

 

More B1's including an LNER Green version.

 

I think a long shot may be the GWR railmotor recently returned to traffic at Didcot, it has proved popular with the public, would only need one tooling which would give you a loco and train.

[coachmann]

As I recall, the GWR was popular because it was popular. But daftness was around in those days too. I remember a Hawksworth red-dot taper boiler Pannier and a bodyline kit for a condencing pannier tank as well. Both found their way onto quaint branchlines because there was little else. 50 years on and the locos have been done but where are the branchline coaches produced to 21st Century standards?

[Ozexpatriate]

There may be other reasons why for Hornby the GWR hasn't sold as well as the other companies ...

I don't think it's true that GWR doesn't sell, nor SR or LNER, though the relative popularity of the grouping period has unquestionably declined.

 

Even saying that, you could still apply very simple maths. Hypothetically, if you evenly split fans down the middle into pre and post nationalization, GWR fans would represent 12.5% of the steam enthusiast market. (One eighth being a quarter of a half.) There's an outside chance they might represent more than that, because so many GWR models have been available over the years but with a decline in grouping models this might be the upper limit. Hornby still usually offers at least one "newish" item for GWR fans each year. In recent years: Tintagel Castle, 28xx and this year the Churchward County.

 

The main reason the GWR was 'pushed' so strongly for modelling purposes in the 1960s and 70s was because of its 'ho-hum'-ness. People generally had relatively little money for their modelling, the RTR ranges were limited in scope, and the GWR's standardisation by the 1930s offered a solution as compared to all the other railway systems. With a GWR based model railway a few well chosen items could make a decently representative model in a way that was largely impossible elsewhere.

 

Was there anything else exciting on the steam front out of Swindon after Churchward stepped down, that hasn't already got a RTR model? That barrel has been near scraped out I reckon, just...

What about before Churchward stepped down - like a Star and top-light coaches?

 

As I recall, the GWR was popular because it was popular.

I like that comment - indeed it was, and as a result, for a passionate minority of us, still is.

[D605Eagle]

 

Now that's something that I don't recall having been done by a manufacturer for an RTR loco - outshopped in lined* works grey for the photo session. Another livery option, but would it sell by the bucket load ?... dilbert

 

 

* as appropriate

There was a Hornby spam can in lined works grey some years ago, it might have been a shop special edition mind you. I forget!

[D605Eagle]

Because it was a list of Post-Group classes I would think (the 'Directors' being a Pre-Group class).

An excelent suggestion, but the 42xx kind of blows that out of the water.....

[Roy P]

Regarding GW models and thinking of the ongoing discussion about the Hornby and Bachmann B1, I wonder if a “re-chassis” of Bachmann’s existing Manor and 43xx would satisfy as much as new equivalents from Hornby all things (£) considered.

RP

[coachmann]

Because it was a list of Post-Group classes I would think (the 'Directors' being a Pre-Group class).

An excelent suggestion, but the 42xx kind of blows that out of the water.....

You can't kid a kidder... 4201 introduced December 1910. 4200 etc introduced June 1923.

[Ceptic]

Silver surfing through this thread, with it's many speculations, predictions, guesses, wishes, etc., the thought / question remains.............

Are Hornby presently feeling, or going to feel, the financial / commercial pinch, or not ?, and are Hornby preparing us for 'Things to Come' *?.

 

This thought / question is based on Hornby's latest RRP's being above this year's UK annual inflation figures.

 

A few posts have speculated upon forhcoming Pre-grouping releases, more on Post-grouping, most of all, (lf i'm reading this right, it's the sign of the times) Post-nationalisation era, including the steam / diesel transition years, and to a lesser extent, the present Privatisation period, that is mostly of interest,.

 

From, purely, a 'Southern' point of view l'm left (wing / field) thinking, that Hornby could fall back on their old reliable,... 'Nellie'.

With a few tweaks, here and there, it could be made into something, seriously, representing the LSWR, SR, BR(S) 0-4-0t, Class C.14.

 

If they really went to town, by converting / back dating it, into a LSWR railmotor (A couple of livery options there), and thereby using the passenger section to contain the DCC chip + Sound speakers, whilst the loco had fire-box glow, smoke and opening smoke-box door.(And, possibly ? Magnadhesion)

 

Something, l'm sure, that would replace the demise of Hornby's 'Live Steam' range.

 

There, again, purely thoughts, bouncing around.

 

* Someone, earlier, (maybe on another thread) had mentioned the Mayan calendar ?. lt's just possible that this is what Hornby are working to. ln doing so they'd certainly clear up any outstanding releases by next year's end.

[Bernard Lamb]

 

Are Hornby presently feeling, or going to feel, the financial / commercial pinch, or not ?, and are Hornby preparing us for 'Things to Come' *?.

 

This thought / question is based on Hornby's latest RRP's being above this year's UK annual inflation figures.

 

 

They are certainly going to feel it. Everybody is.

The UK rate of inflation has very little to do with the cost of Chinese imports.

See various other threads where this subject has been done to the point of death.

Bernard

[Ceptic]

 

They are certainly going to feel it. Everybody is.

The UK rate of inflation has very little to do with the cost of Chinese imports.

See various other threads where this subject has been done to the point of death.

Bernard

 

Just recently, l've been given the impression that is precisely the reason for the UK's rise in the RPI inflation figures. ??

[Ozexpatriate]

If they really went to town, by converting / back dating it, into a LSWR railmotor (A couple of livery options there), and thereby using the passenger section to contain the DCC chip + Sound speakers, whilst the loco had fire-box glow, smoke and opening smoke-box door.(And, possibly ? Magnadhesion)

I ask, purely as a clarifying question, are you suggesting that Hornby might announce the Triang "Nellie" 0-4-0T as the basis for a LSWR railmotor with DCC, sound, a firebox glow and magnahesion? Did I get that correct or did I misread your intent?

[spamcan61]

 

Just recently, l've been given the impression that is precisely the reason for the UK's rise in the RPI inflation figures. ??

 

Yes, as some of us pointed out a year or so back it's all very well holding the bank rate at 0.5% but the effect on the exchange rate would lead to price inflation.