RMweb Premium M.I.B Posted June 27, 2012 RMweb Premium Share Posted June 27, 2012 Sorry to be cheeky asking about a goods engine in the brown stock forum, but I'd appreciate the thoughts of GWR modellers as opposed to starting an "I hate Hornby" discussion elsewhere. I am considering a Dean Goods - RTR then detailed. Although I have enjoyed wagon and coach kits, I hated building my Star despite the pleasing results. So do I go for the Mainline or the Hornby Dean? Thanks Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
brossard Posted June 27, 2012 Share Posted June 27, 2012 I had the Mainline model years ago. I was always dissatisfied with the coarse speed control (DC) and lack of daylight under the tender. I proceeded to build Perserverance chassis for the loco and tender and after that it was a sweet runner and looked the part too. I recall that the worm gear protruded into the cab but the crew disguised that. It didn't have a lot of weight but could manage 5 Ratio 4 wheelers on the flat. It's about time Hornby did a loco drive version - the only thing is, they will probably use traction tyres - yeccch! The 4F, despite having traction tyres is a very good runner, compared to the original Airfix model. John Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adrian Wintle Posted June 27, 2012 Share Posted June 27, 2012 Comet Models do a very nice etched chassis for the Dean Goods. The Hornby and Mainline versions are very similar except for the motor, and either will work with the Comet chassis. If you want to stick with RTR, then the Hornby motor is typically better than the Mainline one - otherwise there is nothing in it, pick the model with the livery you want. Adrian Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
34theletterbetweenB&D Posted June 27, 2012 Share Posted June 27, 2012 If I needed one the low cost game plan would be to buy the cheapest decent external conditon (ideally Mainline, moulding likely to be crisper) non-runner available, and fit a can motor and fold up two stage gearbox on the loco chassis. Alter tender to relieve it of the drive excresences, and there's a good looking and sweet running model. Course, the moment you get this conversion complete Hornby will announce their loco drive update, and Bachmann will chip in with an all-new model covering all the variants. In compensation, everyone who buys one of these will think well of you... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
brossard Posted June 27, 2012 Share Posted June 27, 2012 Alas, Perseverance kits are no longer available (AFAIK). I can heartily recommend Comet Models. I quite like the High Level Gearboxes. John Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coach bogie Posted June 27, 2012 Share Posted June 27, 2012 Personally I chose neither as I detest that huge unimpressive lump of coal to hide the tender drive. The three on my line are all K's as they are loco drive and have outstanding haulage ability. It may not have the detail of modern rtr (though the Hornby one dates back to the late 70's), but with additional work they look the part. If you are up to the challenge there is an old K's that needs some work on eBay at the moment http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Well-Made-GWR-Dean-Goods-0-6-0-From-Ks-Kit-Working-Order-Missing-One-Footstep-/251093911740?pt=UK_Trains_Railway_Models&hash=item3a765d08bc Or as Adrian says above, ditch the tender drive and use a Comet chassis. Alternatively, Chris Gibbon at High Level produces an outstanding chassis for the Hornby/Airfis/Dapol body. http://www.highlevelkits.co.uk/ Mike Wiltshire Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lonesome_whistle Posted June 27, 2012 Share Posted June 27, 2012 Alternatively, Chris Gibbon at High Level produces an outstanding chassis for the Hornby/Airfis/Dapol body. http://www.highlevelkits.co.uk/ Mike Wiltshire And he does one for the tender too. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium M.I.B Posted June 27, 2012 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted June 27, 2012 Sirs Many thanks. I have a Ks that M.I.B Snr built - I will investigate why it's haulage power isn't what it should be. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium M.I.B Posted July 3, 2012 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted July 3, 2012 Thanks for the advice. I am now a long way from my models and the hankering for a Dean will probably recede soon - I will try and revive the Ks one first I think. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium M.I.B Posted July 4, 2012 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted July 4, 2012 TY. Will add that to the back-burner list for when I get home. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
brian777999 Posted October 28, 2017 Share Posted October 28, 2017 Hornby, Mainline and Dapol Dean Goods locos : do all their tender drives use traction tyres ? NOTE : Traction tyres tend not to last very long in the tropical weather so I try to avoid them. I was waiting for the Oxford Rail version but unless they correct the oversized steam dome (unlikely) then I don't think I will be buying one. It is such an important UK locomotive and nobody seems able to get it right ! I wonder if Bachmann are planning their own version ? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Siberian Snooper Posted October 28, 2017 RMweb Premium Share Posted October 28, 2017 Hornby, Mainline and Dapol Dean Goods locos : do all their tender drives use traction tyres ? NOTE : Traction tyres tend not to last very long in the tropical weather so I try to avoid them. I was waiting for the Oxford Rail version but unless they correct the oversized steam dome (unlikely) then I don't think I will be buying one. It is such an important UK locomotive and nobody seems able to get it right ! I wonder if Bachmann are planning their own version ? Nobody has mentioned an oversize dome on the BR black one and everything else appears to be better. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Dunsignalling Posted October 28, 2017 RMweb Gold Share Posted October 28, 2017 Hornby, Mainline and Dapol Dean Goods locos : do all their tender drives use traction tyres ? NOTE : Traction tyres tend not to last very long in the tropical weather so I try to avoid them. I was waiting for the Oxford Rail version but unless they correct the oversized steam dome (unlikely) then I don't think I will be buying one. It is such an important UK locomotive and nobody seems able to get it right ! I wonder if Bachmann are planning their own version ? The Mainline, Dapol and Hornby Dean goods are all from the same Airfix tooling which, for whatever reason didn't pass from Mainline to Bachmann. The Hornby one has a different (better) motor than the original Airfix/Mainline models, but I don't know what the Dapol ones had. They all have traction tyres. John Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
woodenhead Posted October 28, 2017 Share Posted October 28, 2017 Hornby, Mainline and Dapol Dean Goods locos : do all their tender drives use traction tyres ? NOTE : Traction tyres tend not to last very long in the tropical weather so I try to avoid them. I was waiting for the Oxford Rail version but unless they correct the oversized steam dome (unlikely) then I don't think I will be buying one. It is such an important UK locomotive and nobody seems able to get it right ! I wonder if Bachmann are planning their own version ? You'll have a long wait for Bachmannn to do one of these, the Oxford offering whilst not perfect is the best we will see this decade I reckon Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Butler Henderson Posted October 28, 2017 Share Posted October 28, 2017 The Mainline, Dapol and Hornby Dean goods are all from the same Airfix tooling which, for whatever reason didn't pass from Mainline to Bachmann. The original Mainine toolings were owned by Kader hence why Bachmann have access to them. The toolings acquired from Airfix (plus the 56 and 2P) were not owned by Kader and hence were bought by Dapol then sold on to Hornby Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Dunsignalling Posted October 28, 2017 RMweb Gold Share Posted October 28, 2017 The original Mainine toolings were owned by Kader hence why Bachmann have access to them. The toolings acquired from Airfix (plus the 56 and 2P) were not owned by Kader and hence were bought by Dapol then sold on to Hornby Were there were ever two sets of tooling? I always thought the Mainline branded Deans were just a way of clearing the unsold stocks of the Airfix ones, which had been produced but not distributed by the time the company got into difficulties. I'm also pretty sure I once had a Mainline branded/boxed 2P. (EDIT; Catalogue No. 37-515) John Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steamport Southport Posted October 28, 2017 Share Posted October 28, 2017 It was never released by Airfix. Airfix had gone before it was released. Around about November 1983 if memory serves me right. Got mine for Christmas that year. http://www.mainlinerailways.org.uk/Print.htm I think the 2P was also only released by Mainline. Then Dapol obviously. Not on here though... http://www.mainlinerailways.org.uk/Locomotives.htm Jason Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Butler Henderson Posted October 28, 2017 Share Posted October 28, 2017 Were there were ever two sets of tooling?No just one set in terms of Airfix toolings passing to Mainline then Dapol then Hornby. Their is some potential confusion on a number of wagons thanks to Dapol who having found they did not access to the Kader toolings promptly made copies so its possible to find the what appears to be the dsame model in Mainline, Replica (who used Kader tools between the use of them by Mainline and Bachmann), Dapol, Bachmann and Hornby boxes. More confusingly Dapol bought up warehouse stocks of Mainline models and its possible some may have got reboxed by Dapol despite them being produced by Kader. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Butler Henderson Posted October 28, 2017 Share Posted October 28, 2017 It was never released by Airfix. Airfix had gone before it was released. Around about November 1983 if memory serves me right. Got mine for Christmas that year. http://www.mainlinerailways.org.uk/Print.htm I think the 2P was also only released by Mainline. Then Dapol obviously. Not on here though... http://www.mainlinerailways.org.uk/Locomotives.htm Jason The plastic tooling for the Dean Goods was done by Heller for Airfix who were going to make it in their Charlton factory which did not happen. Palitoy (Mainline) having acquired the tooling shipped it to Hong Kong with Sanda Kan undertaking the production. Source - Ramsays British Model Trains by Pat Hammond. The 2P is a bit of a mystery as I have never seen it being described as being scheduled by Airfix and it was a very late Mainline release, Pat Hammond notes that some were supplied only in their polystyrene trays. I presume it was made to use up stocks of the 4F tender drive. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Dunsignalling Posted October 28, 2017 RMweb Gold Share Posted October 28, 2017 The original Mainine toolings were owned by Kader hence why Bachmann have access to them. The toolings acquired from Airfix (plus the 56 and 2P) were not owned by Kader and hence were bought by Dapol then sold on to Hornby Had rather than have? Bachmann presumably ceased to have access to the Dean Goods tools as soon as ownership passed to Dapol, which it must have done in order for the onward sale to Hornby to happen. John Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Butler Henderson Posted October 28, 2017 Share Posted October 28, 2017 Had rather than have ? Bachmann presumably ceased to have access to the Dean Goods tools as soon as ownership passed to Dapol, which it must have done in order for the onward sale to Hornby to happen. Bachmann never had access to the Dean Goods toolings Tooling made circa 1980/1 by Heller for Airix Acquired by Palitoy and released / catalogued by Mainline 1982-1984 Sold to Dapol c 1985 Sold to Hornby c 1996 {edit and for clarity at no point have the toolings been owned by Kader) Bachmann Europe was formed in 1989. Not sure what you are getting at in your question - Bachmann Europe is owned by Kader so any tooling Kader own is accessible to Bachmann Europe. The Mainline tooling that Kader owned have formed the backbone of the UK range - it may be that today only a few are still in use. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RosiesBoss Posted October 28, 2017 Share Posted October 28, 2017 Hornby, Mainline and Dapol Dean Goods locos : do all their tender drives use traction tyres ? NOTE : Traction tyres tend not to last very long in the tropical weather so I try to avoid them. I was waiting for the Oxford Rail version but unless they correct the oversized steam dome (unlikely) then I don't think I will be buying one. It is such an important UK locomotive and nobody seems able to get it right ! I wonder if Bachmann are planning their own version ? G'day brian777999, I have several Dean Goods (or their mechanisms) in my collection - a mix of Mainline and Hornby models. One of them came 2nd-hand (and free) from a local model shop that was closing and disposing of incomplete or non-working models. In this case, this Mainline model lacked gears and its motor wires had been cut. The motor worked, so I bought a set of Hornby gears, which fitted perfectly. I noted that the driven tender wheels had been removed from their axles, ground back until only the gears remained, then refitted to their axles, together with new Hornby (eg Grange) wheels. The "Mainline" branded plastic part that keeps the wheels in place on the tender had also been replaced by a suitable block of steel. This model worked much more smoothly than those as manufactured by Hornby or Mainline, although it didn't pull quite as well. I have improved traction by applying a small amount of "Bullfrog Snot" to wheels on one side of the tender. This is now a very reliable model, which does not waddle or shed tyres as the standard models do over time. I have since modified both a Hornby and another Mainline tender in the same way to improve the running of those models. Sydney's weather is not quite as tropical as yours (temperature range 2-40 Deg C), but I have found that I now have a strategy that works for me to restore tender-drive models with dodgy tyres. I hope this is of some help. Regards, Rob Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium NCB Posted October 28, 2017 RMweb Premium Share Posted October 28, 2017 Reminds me I have a Mainline Dean sitting unused somwhere. Unimpressed with its running. As it happens I'm fully commited to another scale at the moment, otherwise I'd be tempted to sling a High Level chassis underneath it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
brian777999 Posted October 29, 2017 Share Posted October 29, 2017 Nobody has mentioned an oversize dome on the BR black one and everything else appears to be better. I was not sure if that was an optical illusion produced by the black colour or an actual reduction in size. Has anybody measured it ? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
brian777999 Posted October 29, 2017 Share Posted October 29, 2017 G'day brian777999, I have several Dean Goods (or their mechanisms) in my collection - a mix of Mainline and Hornby models. One of them came 2nd-hand (and free) from a local model shop that was closing and disposing of incomplete or non-working models. In this case, this Mainline model lacked gears and its motor wires had been cut. The motor worked, so I bought a set of Hornby gears, which fitted perfectly. I noted that the driven tender wheels had been removed from their axles, ground back until only the gears remained, then refitted to their axles, together with new Hornby (eg Grange) wheels. The "Mainline" branded plastic part that keeps the wheels in place on the tender had also been replaced by a suitable block of steel. This model worked much more smoothly than those as manufactured by Hornby or Mainline, although it didn't pull quite as well. I have improved traction by applying a small amount of "Bullfrog Snot" to wheels on one side of the tender. This is now a very reliable model, which does not waddle or shed tyres as the standard models do over time. I have since modified both a Hornby and another Mainline tender in the same way to improve the running of those models. Sydney's weather is not quite as tropical as yours (temperature range 2-40 Deg C), but I have found that I now have a strategy that works for me to restore tender-drive models with dodgy tyres. I hope this is of some help. Regards, Rob So the gears are actually joined to the inside of the wheels on the original...is that how it works ? I cannot just replace the wheels ? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.