Great West Road - transfers & I’m not talking football!

[southern42]

' afternoon all.

 

Well, that was a surprise!

Yesterday, I got round to finishing the ICSR Headboard Test. I say, a surprise, because I certainly did not feel up to tackling it earlier in the day.    Stage freight fright?

 

Well, firstly, I reckoned the box was not tall enough and also felt it needed capping so it could sit on the staple (lamp iron). So, I found a way of doing it step by step using a 1cm offcut, superglue, and a scalpel. It also added that little bit of extra height.

 

On completion, and I am being picky, the slot box could really do with being narrower but it is well and truly stuck now so no getting it off safely to trim the left had end.

 

The slot box is also off centre - it obviously slid on the superglue while still in my hands without me noticing.

You may also see the remnants of a black mark below the 'S'.  The trials of the modeller, eh! 

BUT

The headboard will need re-doing, anyway, to fit the brass brackets when they come.

 

In the meantime, I shall paint up another headlamp for 9642 and a tail lamp for the rear of three brake vans used on the ICRS Special.

 

To complete the job, apart from acquiring some 81C shed plates, I will need some pobl bach, little people, in the form of Loco crew and a suggestion of 20 Imperial College students and their group leader(?) (the gentleman in hat and coat?).

There are 25 people in the photo (on Flickr), including loco crew (3 identified wearing BR grease tops).  The named photographer, Peter Brumby, is far left and nearest the camera suggesting a timer was used to take the photo.  

There is certainly a diversity of fashion wear to choose from including at least one anorak!  The several online colour photos will help with colours for the outfits.

 

 

That is enough excitement for one weekend.

Thanks for following my little journeys.

Keep safe.

_________

Best wishes

Polly

 

Edited April 13, 2020 by southern42

[southern42]

' morning all.

 

Another look at the photo in above post (zoomed in) and I am wondering if the young gentleman, left of the two wearing grease tops, is the fourth loco crew member (assuming there were four!) wearing a cap.  Comparing it with the colour photo, below, it seems he is wearing a navy blue cap (a pork pie cap?).

 

This is also a good image for showing off the two headlamps.  The one on the side I hope to tackle, today.  That means I get to display the back of one, although the Modelu ones do not have the horizontal bar across the back.  Do I dare try getting the tiniest of plasticard slivers glued in place?

 

I came across  a load of paintbrushes at an exhibition last year and could not resist buying some.  It is a good time to put them to use, I think!

 

Keep well, stay safe.

_________

Best wishes

Polly

Edited April 16, 2020 by southern42

[southern42]

2 hours ago, southern42 said:

snip

 

This is also a good image for showing off the two headlamps.  The one on the side I hope to tackle, today.  That means I get to display the back of one, although the Modelu ones do not have the horizontal bar across the back.  Do I dare try getting the tiniest of plasticard slivers glued in place?

 

snip

 

Well, he she who dares...

 

A sliver of plasticard

 

Not quite in the right position

 

That's better!

 

Back later with the painted goods, says she with a grin.

 

[southern42]

' afternoon all.

 

Well, that was frustrating!  Guess you can't win them all - or can you?

Short of a disaster, the paintwork on the rear of No. 2 headlamp is much to be desired.  I shall have to invest in a source of greater magnification than my x4 modelling specs if I want to get the paint where I want it!  In the end, so many coats of paint, albeit very thinly applied, so much build up, it looked a mess [zoomed in on the photos]...

 

Moon landing!  Actually a blob of Blutack on the end of a stirrer!

Great to hold while I paint the lamp and, with the underside blutacked as well, it stays in place on a mat.

 

However, on the side of the loco, at least in this photo, it looks fine - looking well used as it should do.  I was pleasantly greatly surprised as I was about to throw in the towel!

 

And paired up with the No. 1 headlamp.

Location is the kitchen worktop with microwave oven behind.

 

A few lessons learnt:

• Use tweezers to place lamps on the loco.  Even with my small fingers it was impossible to place them in such tight places!
• Handle with care.  The handles are fragile: lost one to the bin, already!
• It is good to have the option of moving the lamps around, but I would not want to risk it too often!  Not only because of the handles but, also, because the metal staple (and, presumably, brass brackets) with repeated use in the plastic could easily widen or break out of the slot.  It has been fine so far but I try to take care! 

Tail lamp next...

 

_________

Best wishes

Polly

Edited April 24, 2020 by southern42

[Adrian Stevenson]

Hi Polly, I work in 7mm and loco lamps in that scale are small enough for me.

 

GWR loco lamps have fittings to the sides which allow them to sit on the lamp irons. 

 

Ever thought of adding the lamp irons to the loco? 

 

Cheers, Ade.

 

 

[southern42]

Hi Ade, the side fittings are modelled on the 3D printed lamps but you would not get a bracket up between them and the sides of the lamp.  There is a slot modelled, to the side of the lens, which takes a 26/6 staple and the Brassmasters (Martin Finney) GWR lamp brackets - on order (page 44).

 

 

_________

Best wishes

Polly

 

Edited April 18, 2020 by southern42

[Adrian Stevenson]

Hi Polly, that is great. These little details add so much to any model. 

 

I have some 7mm Modelu GWR tail lamps. I bought some loco lamps from Lee Marsh these even have functional side brackets. It appears he does not make these now, wish I had bought more at the time. I do need to buy some side lamps for my brake van next.

 

Good luck fitting all of these bits, I don't envy you working in 4mm.

 

Cheers, Ade.

[southern42]

Thanks Ade.  We are just starting out in 7mm but I find, with small hands, the rolling stock is a challenge to handle though I do look forward to painting and weathering the larger scale figures and accessories!  It will suit my eyesight better, too!

 

Talking tail lamps, I have not found a photo of the end brake van yet on the Engine drivers' special, so I am on the lookout for something else on 81C rails for reference.  Photographers seem to prefer the front end of the train!  Guilty your honour!

 

View of the bracket slot in the base.

_________

Best wishes

Polly

 

[southern42]

' morning all.

 

I started work on the tail lamp yesterday.

 

Metal handle (paint worn off): Citadel Base Leadbelcher

One coat mix of Winsor & Newton Titanium White and Model Colour Flat Yellow, thinned with water + Fairy liquid.

    

 

A little weathering to do next.

 

Keep safe

_________

Best wishes

Polly

Edited April 22, 2020 by southern42

[southern42]

' morning all.

 

 

I eventually got to do some weathering on the tail lamp, though I spent far more time looking at it beforehand than anything!  I got the urge to get on and do it after I had found a few photos googling "brake van" rather than "goods/freight train" which the latter tended to bring up the loco at the front end and not a tail lamp in sight!  Oh!  Apart from one on Disused Stations, Colnbrook - trains going in opposite directions.  http://www.disused-stations.org.uk/c/colnbrook/

 

If I had a magnifier to this size, I could have a go at doing the door clip - left of lens... 

Maybe next time...

 

I suspect the rear gets more scratched up than the front as it holds the slot for the bracket.

Another interesting observation I made was that the paint on the handle was worn away on the sides rather than the top.  These things can catch you out if you are not careful, can't they?  So, a little bit of ageing to do on the top of the handle - a bit too white...

...then I will put it aside until I find the brake vans!  They are here, somewhere!  Shunted out of the way by my GW Toads, no doubt!

 

 Take care, be safe and keep trucking.

_________

Best wishes

Polly 

Edited April 24, 2020 by southern42

[southern42]

' afternoon all.

 

On 24/04/2020 at 10:36, southern42 said:

snip...

 

Another interesting observation I made was that the paint on the handle was worn away on the sides rather than the top.  These things can catch you out if you are not careful, can't they?  So, a little bit of ageing to do on the top of the handle - a bit too white...

...then I will put it aside until I find the brake vans!  They are here, somewhere!  Shunted out of the way by my GW Toads, no doubt!

 

snip...

 

Thought you were going to get a rest for a bit from my ramblings, then? 

Afraid not!  You see I have been doing some more goooooooogling.

 

So, the lamp handle, above, is too white, is it?

Well, take a look at this, on Flickr.  The handle is definitely whiter (cleaner/different paint?) than the lamp housing, albeit a different style handle and in SR territory.  It is all in the detail... Oh! How did I get into all this?  I, surely, must be off the rails with LMS (Lockdown Modellers Syndrome)!   

 

SECR Brake Van 55458 at Hove, 21 Nov 1961 (Ian Nolan)

 

Anyway, I am glad I had something to ramble about.  Better than just waiting for the postman to arrive with some small brassy bits.  MAY, did he say?   [Careful!  Mustn't wish my life away.]

 

Thanks for Poop! Poop! Poop-ing in.  Your presence, comments and ratings are much appreciated.

_________

Best wishes

Polly

[ChrisN]

One, two, three, … must...   four, five, …  resist.... six, seven …  counting …. eight, nine, ten ….  the …..   eleven, twelve ….   rivets....

 

We all do it, we get sucked into pointless, I mean important details.  

[southern42]

Ah! Don't we just...and I have 9773 and 6106 to follow...both needing...lamps and (shared) headboards - this time for the 1965 Thames Valley tour.  I thought I might as well while I am in the swing of things.

 

And that will mean acquiring two sets of number plates and transfers to renumber the locos.  That should be fun!

 

_________

Polly

[southern42]

' afternoon all.

 

Now, did I say fun?  Mention detail?  How about making suppositions...?  Like this is Western, right?

Well, think again.

 

I spent part of yesterday evening finding suppliers of detailing bits and pieces for 9773 and 6106.

 

For the occasion, the Thames Valley Rail Tour, 9773 was dressed in GWR, supposedly.  In other words, '9773' was on the bufferbeam rather than in BR fashion on the smokebox door BUT, look closely, the numbers are not in GWR lettering.    Oh!  No!  More like LMS serif lettering in plain straw yellow which was applied to their goods and shunting engines.  And to continue the LMS theme, the loco is sporting the Midland quadruple reporting number (1X06), unlike the Western triple reporting number (X06) carried by 6106!  How things got mixed up in those days!  No wonder BR rebranded itself!

 

So, Sankey Scenics for the Midland train reporting set which I hope will weather down nicely, and Fox-Transfers, which does an "ornate" triple panel, for the Western set, as well as cab plates and power classification discs.

 

 

 

Rail Tour 25/07/1965.  At the time 9773 was allocated to Oxford and 6106 to Southall.

9773:  81F  Oxford     08/11/1964   Withdrawn  12/1965

6106:  81C  Southall  10/01/1965   81F Oxford 19/09/1965. Withdrawn  12/1965  (Preserved 81E Didcot)

(brdatabase.info)

 

 

Interestingly, going by photos, neither loco appear to carry a shed plate and 6106 carried neither smokebox number nor bufferbeam number, just the route number. (A bit of cash saved there, then!)

In a later (November 65) Southall photo, 6106 is without them - common practice on shed at 81C at the end of steam with withdrawal imminent but preservation down the line for this one, at least.

 

Happy to have a bit of variety!  Keeps me on my toes!

_________

Best wishes

Polly

 

[southern42]

' morning all.

 

I am back from yesterday's RMweb's (Virtual) SWAG Members Day and what an excellent and inspiring Show it has been.  Indeed I got to bed quite late... and still have many exhibits (pages!) to view.

 

But back to the job in hand.  I had been wondering why the Midland train reporting number was over the smokebox door rather than on it.  On a quick search, I see that it hangs on a straight grab rail mounted on the LMS door as opposed to the curved rail round the door as on GWR which might explain why the number is mounted above, presumably, on the lamp bracket.  So, there we go, more LMS/Midland practice in place!

 

More interlopers coming up...

_________

Best wishes

Polly

 

[southern42]

Interlopers!

 

So, details for  the Thames Valley Rail Tour 1965 which ran along both Western AND Southern^ metals!

Ex-LMS 46509* (1A Willesden): London Waterloo^-Kensington Olympia

6106: Kensington Olympia-Southall Brentford bay

9773: Southall- Windsor & Eton Central

6106: Windsor & Eton Central-Reading General

BR Class 4 80154 (70A Nine Elms): Reading General-London Waterloo.

 

* That would explain the train reporting number and shows the importance of being in possession of ALL the details!  I should have known better!  

 

^This would explain the use of Southern coaching stock:

BSK, 2x SO, RB, SO, BSK (one BSK was 4302S)** including SR set 770.***

SR set 770 consists of Bulleid 64ft Semi open bk 3rd - Composite - Semi open bk 3rd****

 

**    4302 Semi-open Brake Third in Mike King, An Illustrated History of Southern Coaches 2003, 2nd Revised Ed, 2008, p.137

***.   https://www.sixbellsjunction.co.uk/60s/650725lc.html

**** bbishop @ https://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/126365-br-southern-region-coaches/&do=findComment&comment=2860274)

 

According to Bulleid & BR Mk 1 Coaches, Southern Region Allocations, p.6

'Sets 770-793 were to be used only on services Waterloo-West of England and Waterloo-Bournemouth-Weymouth, and remained on these services for many years. The corridor sides of the CK and second BSK faced the same way, usually to the S. Sets also appeared facing the opposite way. Set 770 was the only set of the early series to be re-formed, in 1963, to a 6 RS set for Bournemouth services.'

 

So, was the 6 car set of coaches on the Thames Valley Rail Tour the same 6 RS set from Bournemouth?  It seems likely.

 

Shall we add detective work to the list?  

 

As an appropriate RTR set (of 3 car, 6 car or otherwise) is not available, I have my eyes on these, on His shelf... but don't tell him!   

 

I am Dunin, now.  Back again soon.

Keep well. Stay safe. 

_________

Best wishes

Polly

 

Edited April 28, 2020 by southern42

[southern42]

And these arrived, today.

[tender]

5 hours ago, southern42 said:

 

 

As an appropriate RTR set (of 3 car, 6 car or otherwise) is not available, I have my eyes on these, on His shelf... but don't tell him!   

 

I am Dunin, now.  Back again soon.

Keep well. Stay safe. 

_________

Best wishes

Polly

 

 

I saw that, If you look in the display cabinet you'll also find the new Hornby release Bulleid 3 Set 968 in BR(SR) Green.

 

[southern42]

' morning all.

 

Hornby Bulleid 3 Set 968*

Livery: Malachite to Crimson Lake and Cream December 1953 then to BR(S) Green July 1957

R4886 – BR(s) Bulleid 59′ Diagram 2316 corridor composite No. S5714S from Set 968 in BR(s) green livery

R4888 – BR(s) Bulleid 59′ Diagram 2121 corridor brake 3rd  No. S2851S from Set 968 in BR(s) green livery 

R4888A – BR(s) Bulleid 59′ Diagram 2121 corridor brake 3rd  No. S2852S from Set 968 in BR(s) green livery

 

1963 Set 968 Bournemouth West – Bath**

BSK 2851

SK 51

SK 52

CK 5714
CK 5885
SK 53
SK 55
BSK 2852

Strengthened Mar-63  disbanded c.1965

 

*   This and other sets: https://grahammuz.com/tag/bulleid-59ft-coaches/

** https://www.bloodandcustard.net/Bulleid59ft01.html

 

Off to think about those lamp irons, now!

Take care, be safe.

_________

Best wishes

Polly

 

 

Edited April 28, 2020 by southern42

[southern42]

' evening all.

 

Interlopers

A bit more digging as I noticed that Ex-LMS 46509 (1A Willesden) was photographed not with the Midland four figure train reporting number, as I had assumed, but with SR Steam Locomotive Headsignals 1944 - white discs - for Route 21 'Waterloo to Clapham Junction' (among other routes),* the first two names listed on the Itinerary of the Thames Valley Rail Tour as listed at https://www.sixbellsjunction.co.uk/60s/650725lc.html.   The discs carry the duty number '1' preceded by two small letters or letter and number which are too blurred to be certain.

 

*   http://www.semgonline.com/headcodes/sheadcodes/04.html

 

So, since ex-LMS 46509 is not carrying a Midland route number, why was the pannier tank 9773 doing so?  Because that was all that was available?

 

I have not come across a photo of BR 80154 on the Southern return section of the tour so I can only assume it carried Southern route discs though it is only of interest as it will not be portrayed,  but a photo of 80154 for the record would be good.

 

Hopefully, there will be some progress on the brassy bits tomorrow.

 

Take care, be safe.

_______

Best wishes

Polly

 

[southern42]

' afternoon all.

 

Good news from yesterday.  I managed to order some bufferbeam numbers for the Thames Valley Rail Tour pannier tank 9773: Modelmaster Decals OO LMS Locomotive Lettering and Numbers 1928-1947 Serif Style Straw Colour LM004 from AnticsOnline.  Few and far between it seems at the moment, but I found one - the last in stock, at that!  Expensive for just four characters but if I had it done professionally it would cost me even more so this lady has decided to take the plunge and have a go herself: no brainer, really, on this occasion!  

 

Now, for some photos of a very possible set of coaches for the Thames Valley Rail Tour.  A set of three coaches, namely Bulleid Set 968, being from the same era, area and still in service in 1965, is a realistic proposition for GWRd in the absence of a RTR Set from series 770-793, and an acceptable visual substitute for the actual set, Bulleid Set 770.

 

Set 968 coaches, below, being shorter at 59ft, as against 64ft of Set 770, would be better for a small layout.  It is just a pity it was only made up of Brake coaches so no Opens (SO) to be more representative of Set 770.  But they look Southern, don't they?  And we have them so no extra cost here!  Of course, we will have to have them full of passengers rail enthusiasts with their heads sticking out of the windows.

 

 

BSK

 

CK

 

BSK

 

When it is finished, I shall have to add GWR 9773 to the rake to complete the train in the Southern cabinet or get my own cabinet (GWR!) and put the train in that!  Do I see a hands off sign      across the room?! 

Friends really.  

Er...hum...social distancing please!

Keep safe.

_________

Best wishes

Polly

 

Edited April 30, 2020 by southern42

[southern42]

Identifying 

On 27/04/2020 at 18:02, southern42 said:

Interlopers!

 

So, details for  the Thames Valley Rail Tour 1965 which ran along both Western AND Southern^ metals!

Ex-LMS 46509* (1A Willesden): London Waterloo^-Kensington Olympia

6106: Kensington Olympia-Southall Brentford bay

9773: Southall- Windsor & Eton Central

6106: Windsor & Eton Central-Reading General

BR Class 4 80154 (70A Nine Elms): Reading General-London Waterloo.

 

* That would explain the train reporting number and shows the importance of being in possession of ALL the details!  I should have known better!  

 

^This would explain the use of Southern coaching stock:

BSK, 2x SO, RB, SO, BSK (one BSK was 4302S)** including SR set 770.***

SR set 770 consists of Bulleid 64ft Semi open bk 3rd - Composite - Semi open bk 3rd****

 

**    4302 Semi-open Brake Third in Mike King, An Illustrated History of Southern Coaches 2003, 2nd Revised Ed, 2008, p.137

***.   https://www.sixbellsjunction.co.uk/60s/650725lc.html

**** bbishop @ https://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/126365-br-southern-region-coaches/&do=findComment&comment=2860274)

 

According to Bulleid & BR Mk 1 Coaches, Southern Region Allocations, p.6

'Sets 770-793 were to be used only on services Waterloo-West of England and Waterloo-Bournemouth-Weymouth, and remained on these services for many years. The corridor sides of the CK and second BSK faced the same way, usually to the S. Sets also appeared facing the opposite way. Set 770 was the only set of the early series to be re-formed, in 1963, to a 6 RS set for Bournemouth services.'

 

So, was the 6 car set of coaches on the Thames Valley Rail Tour the same 6 RS set from Bournemouth?  It seems likely.

 

Shall we add detective work to the list?  

 

As an appropriate RTR set (of 3 car, 6 car or otherwise) is not available, I have my eyes on these, on His shelf... but don't tell him!   

 

I am Dunin, now.  Back again soon.

Keep well. Stay safe. 

_________

Best wishes

Polly

 

 

I have been doing a bit of behind the scenes investigation of the above Bulleid set.

Composition:

34-577B  SO

34-554    CK

34-504A  BSo

 

Length: 63ft more in keeping with Set 770 at 64ft so it would give a feel of a longer train in the absence of a rake of six coaches.  However, only one brake.

 

Next - Western evidence for the use of a four figure train reporting number, coming up.

_________

Best wishes

Polly

 

[southern42]

' afternoon all.

 

Four figure train reporting number in the 1960s.

As I said, some evidence has appeared in my lap of a Western engine carrying a four figure train reporting number.

Churchward Mogul 7320, on a summer Saturday through train in 1963, is captured storming to the summit of the rock cutting at Talerddig, between Carno and Llanbrynmair on the Cambrian line. (R C Riley, Great Western Album No.2, p.97).

 

Also (p.70), 7029 Clun Castle on a down special past Foxhall Jcn, 3 April 1965, on the Warwickshire Railway Society Great Western Steam Tour to Swindon (https://www.sixbellsjunction.co.uk), 1X12 throughout, from Birmingham Snow Hill, retuning to Birmingham New Street.

 

So fairly common practice at that time, then, for Western rail tours and summer specials to carry the Midland style number.  Compare this with 11 June 1965, a few months later 7029 heading the last steam hauled train out of Paddington with GWR style triple reporting number M48, Twin Cities crest above and GWR bufferbeam numbers below emphasising its historic role and the significance of the occasion.

 

Tomorrow, I shall have a look at those little brassy bits for the pannier tanks.

_________

Best wishes

Polly

Edited May 3, 2020 by southern42
Typo, nothing exciting!

[Northroader]

Remember that by the sixties, the ex GWR lines and trains you quote had been transferred to the LM Region (boo, chizz) so would be using LM style reporting numbers.

[southern42]

33 minutes ago, Northroader said:

Remember that by the sixties, the ex GWR lines and trains you quote had been transferred to the LM Region (boo, chizz) so would be using LM style reporting numbers.

 

Thanks Northroader, I did not think about that!  Vaguely remember reading about it somewhere, but obviously not of sufficient significance to keep a mental record of it, at the time.  I know BR changed its boundaries on the DN&SR from Newbury to Winchester in 1950 with the GWR falling into Southern hands, but that is another story/layout...

Boo, chizz sounds about right!

 

All set for numbering now, with Western and Midland train reporting numbers arriving last week.

_________

Best wishes

Polly