The human side of the railway...

[Rugd1022]

Euston, 1935...

 

 

Posed but rather nice shot outside Euston...

 

 

Towyn, photo c/o Rod Mackay...

 

 

 

[Southernman46]

Wonder how many of those young LMS men survived the war ?

[The Johnster]

Not enough, whatever the actual figure is.  But British losses, expressed as percentage of the population, were light compared to those of Germany, Russia, and particularly Poland, which suffered terribly.  Estimates vary between 60 and 100 million deaths in WW2, a combination of deaths in action, bombing raids, the 'final solution', disease and starvation.  20 million of those were Russians.

[Andy Louch]

Are SVR footplate crews tough or what?!! Blizzard at Bewdley this afternoon!!

[petethemole]

In the latter days of the Somerset & Dorset, a young lad fetches the token from 80043 at Sturminster Newton, 19/08/65.

 

[TEDDYBEAR D9521]

Are SVR footplate crews tough or what?!! Blizzard at Bewdley this afternoon!!

Right then boys who moved the cabin when we were out?

Edited March 18, 2018 by TEDDYBEAR D9521

[The Johnster]

Are SVR footplate crews tough or what?!! Blizzard at Bewdley this afternoon!!

 

Whaddaya mean, tough.  That bunch of sissies have lit a fire to keep warm...

 

Kids today, don't know they're born.

[lanchester]

C/o Frank Cheevers...

 

FB Frank Cheevers.jpg

Forgive my ignorance - '5P' on the cabside I get, but what was '5FA'? I refuse to believe it was the obvious derogatory comment on the capabilities of early diesels!

[eastwestdivide]

Forgive my ignorance - '5P' on the cabside I get, but what was '5FA'? I refuse to believe it was the obvious derogatory comment on the capabilities of early diesels!

 

I was intrigued too, and eventually found it at https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LMS_locomotive_numbering_and_classification (towards the bottom)

 

Where a mixed traffic locomotive fell into different power ranges, dual classification was used, e.g. 5P4F. In the 1950s the suffixes 'FA' and 'FB' were used to distinguish between freight locos at the lower and higher ends of the power range."

Edited to fix the link

Edited March 20, 2018 by eastwestdivide

[The Johnster]

The load tables would have different loadings for FA and FB classified locos, to reflect the small differences.

 

Load tables were (probably still are in some form but I've been out of the loop for a good long time now) available for each route, which would have a 'ruling gradient', the steepest and most difficult on the route, that determined the maximum load that a locomotive of a given power classification could haul over it within the timings allowed for each class of train.  A ruling gradient applies downhill as well, as braking power is taken into account.  They are in the Working Timetable, and make fascinating reading.  If you want to lose a week of your life, get hold of a WTT; they are a black hole for your life...

 

Part of the guard's job is to determine the load of the train and ensure that it's length does not exceed that allowed for the route it is to travel over, which is imposed by the length of passing loops and refuge sidings on the route.  He also has to determine the maximum speed the train is allowed to run at, that of the slowest wagon of course, and how much brake force, measured in tons, is available to the driver.  The guard presents this information to the driver in the form of a load slip, which he signs; if the information on it is incorrect and an incident results, the guard is in trouble (if he survives).

[Engineer_London]

Today, Tywyn Wharf station:

[Engineer_London]

A couple more views from Saturday 24 March, each with a small but vital human presence in shot that I didn't spot first time.

 

Tallylyn train en route from Wharf terminus, approaching Tywyn Pendre, and the photographer being observed from the footplate:

 

Tywyn Pendre station with a member of the line team standing ready on the platform, awaiting the next trains to pass:

Edited March 25, 2018 by Engineer_London

[phil_sutters]

Not enough, whatever the actual figure is.  But British losses, expressed as percentage of the population, were light compared to those of Germany, Russia, and particularly Poland, which suffered terribly.  Estimates vary between 60 and 100 million deaths in WW2, a combination of deaths in action, bombing raids, the 'final solution', disease and starvation.  20 million of those were Russians.

These two war memorials are in the Steam museum, along with several more. It is interesting and heart warming that they all seem to have been erected by their fellow workmates, rather than by the company.

 

Although not a railway memorial, but as the subject has been mentioned, the huge Russian losses - 27 million - are remembered in this memorial in the grounds of the Imperial War Museum. 

[The Johnster]

Reading the names on war memorials has a terrible poignancy; it is suddenly brought brutally home that these are real people, not statistics, who died in sometimes horrible and agonising ways, leaving families, lovers, friends who missed and mourned them, and who had lives that they never got to live.  It becomes personal.  And the great war cemeteries of Southern Belgium and Northern France bring home the sheer scale of the waste.

 

War is dreadful and has no winners, only slightly different levels of losers.  The 'Glorious Dead' mean nothing to me, there being little glory in wasting lives in this way, but I believe very strongly that we should never forget these people and their sacrifice, friend or enemy.  None of them wanted to be there; all of them wanted to go home and live their lives, something we get to do every day.  I for one am grateful to them, and that I was born accidentally in a place and at a time when I was never given the call to answer!

 

The men who planned the D day landings were prepared to accept a 60% casualty rate, almost achieved at Omaha.  I have known this fact for many years, but it still shocks me.  As does Attaturk's order at Gallipoli, a battle his side won; 'I do not order you to fight.  I order you to die'.  I would be much happier to accept the outcome of a war fought exclusively between the politicians that started it even if my side lost (Hitler excepted!).  When mass mathematics get involved, humanities worst excesses occur; one of the justifications for the atom bomb attacks on Hiroshima and Nagasaki was that it would save Japanese civilian lives.  Which it did, in the hundreds of thousands that would otherwise have perished in the conventional carpet bombing that would have ensued until Japan was ultimately overwhelmed or forced to sue for peace; another year, perhaps.

 

Never forget, and never forget what our leaders did.

Edited March 26, 2018 by The Johnster

[Steadfast]

Reading the names makes you realise what a part of local history memorials and the like provide. Many of the surnames are familiar to me in Chippenham from neighbours, friends and people I went to school with

 

Jo

[The Johnster]

Sorry, that got a bit heavy for a model railway website.

[Classsix T]

Not at all J, this is after all the part of the site that celebrates the "human" aspect of our favoured transport method. And how can we be human without recognising inhumanity?

 

Make models, not war dude. C6T.

[101]

A few years back we visited the D day beaches and most of the cemeteries (there are a lot) including the German one.

Walking through the rows of graves looking at all the names and in particular the ages really makes you think about the stupidity of war. Everyone, and especially politicians, should be made to go and look at them.

[lmsforever]

Memorials are an important part of our life and  if seen in a railway museum or station show how many who  gave their lives,  especially poignant are the men who lost their lives actually doing their job.on the railway.

[phil_sutters]

This is group of memorials is closer to home for many enthusiasts. It recalls some of those who gave their time and efforts to the Kent and East Sussex Railway. It is between the platform and the level crossing at Northiam. Click on the images to see the inscriptions enlarged.

Edited March 26, 2018 by phil_sutters

[Classsix T]

Talk of conflict memorials prompts me to ask the assembled, are there such erected or placed at locations unfortunate enough to suffer peace time civilian railway casualties? (I'm rather ashamed to ask such a question actually, priding myself with [a modicum of] knowledge on many matters railway).

 

I'm more than familiar with named locomotives such as Benjamin Gimbert, James Nightall (in WW2 yes) and Barry Needham, but wondered if there was any reminders at Potters Bar, Southall etc?

 

Genuine question, though I could see why the public relations people at various organisations would baulk at reminders to passengers of lapsed railway safety (by whatever means).

 

C6T.

[phil_sutters]

Talk of conflict memorials prompts me to ask the assembled, are there such erected or placed at locations unfortunate enough to suffer peace time civilian railway casualties? (I'm rather ashamed to ask such a question actually, priding myself with [a modicum of] knowledge on many matters railway).

 

I'm more than familiar with named locomotives such as Benjamin Gimbert, James Nightall (in WW2 yes) and Barry Needham, but wondered if there was any reminders at Potters Bar, Southall etc?

 

Genuine question, though I could see why the public relations people at various organisations would baulk at reminders to passengers of lapsed railway safety (by whatever means).

 

C6T.

I am sure that there are a number of memorials around the country. My father, who was a great railway enthusiast was born on the day of the Quintinshill troop-train disaster, in 1915. The huge number of troops and railway crew are remembered on the memorial shown in this online page.   https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quintinshill_rail_disaster

Edited March 27, 2018 by phil_sutters

[martin_wynne]

Colwich (1986) remembered: https://web.archive.org/web/20110719230906/http://icstafford.icnetwork.co.uk/news/localnews/tm_objectid=17745200&method=full&siteid=87875&headline=village-remembers-horrific-train-crash--name_page.html

 

from which:

 

As a mark of respect to train driver, Eric Goode, the only person to die in the accident, one Colwich man created a garden of remembrance near the spot where he was killed. Alf Taylor, who worked on the railways for 33 years, planted a selection of beautiful 'Remember Me' roses and tended to the area until his death in 1997. But after that the patch fell into disrepair. But in 2006 a team of around eight railway enthusiasts from the Haywoods Permanent Way got to work restoring the garden to its former glory and planting more 'Remember Me' roses at the site. There is also a bench dedicated to Alf, and his widow has been given a key to the garden so she can go there to reflect. Hugh West, an HPW member who helped do the groundwork on the rail-side garden, said: "It was originally planted by Alf, one of our members, who was a keen gardener - his father taught him. He felt it was only right to do something to remember that railway driver. The garden is as near to the spot where the engine stopped as possible."

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Colwich_rail_crash

[Classsix T]

Thanks Phil, and an excellent further example Martin, exactly what I meant.

 

I hope this is still in keeping with the theme of the thread itself that people don't necessarily have to be pictured, as long as they're not forgotten?

 

C6T.

[martin_wynne]

Google streetview of Eric Goode Memorial Garden, Colwich:

 

 https://goo.gl/maps/4imhsALRVm42

 

 https://www.flickr.com/photos/joe_bloggs_railway_photos/sets/72157627379229922/

Edited March 27, 2018 by martin_wynne