RMweb Gold roundhouse Posted August 22, 2012 RMweb Gold Share Posted August 22, 2012 Organisers can be more forthcoming by delivering beverages to the layouts for the operators. Most operators would rather operate and drink tea rather than have to choose one or the other. Talking to the visitors does rather dry the throat. Some do this. However, more and more venues (normally sports halls) are restricting food and drink in the halls which does make it more difficult to crew the layout when operators get thirsty. Must be really hard on one man layout exhibitors who dont have the option of having relief helpers. Ian Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kenton Posted August 22, 2012 Share Posted August 22, 2012 It has to be said that Warners, who have a dedicated exhibitions section (and who have been slated on here in the past before the "merger" ) do steer a pretty good course between the general public and enthusiast market. Ed That sounds awfully like an opening for a job application or a collection of brownie points ;) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
PLD Posted August 22, 2012 Share Posted August 22, 2012 You forgot to add that the Man Utd and Arsenal teams would have to buy their own kit and footballs, and then spend a good while before the game ensuring the kit was neat and the football worked correctly, then on the match day they would have to take a days holiday from their normal job (being the subject of much press speculation) and travel long distances, at their own expense, just to play - after the game they would then have to pack the goals away, put the ball in the car and clear the litter from the stadium (which would be rented from the local authority of course), and wash their kits, late at night, before returning to work the next day. You forgot to add be put up three or four to a room in some grotty guest house occupied mon-thurs by the navvies building the new Premier league model railway show venue... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
10800 Posted August 22, 2012 Share Posted August 22, 2012 Horrible picture in my head now of Beast as Captain Peacock... Not to mention as a male model for Agent Provocateur ... ! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest 40-something Posted August 22, 2012 Share Posted August 22, 2012 Steven B, on 22 August 2012 - 12:53 , said: Why does a railway modeller attending an exhibition with a layout expect to have their expenses covered? Surely exhibiting is part of the hobby and can be a justifyable expense? Transporting a layout to another part of the country cannot be classed as a justifyable expense. The cost of van hire and fuel for even a small layout, and accomodation for a minimum of 2 operators can be quite eyewatering. If it was a local(ish) show and if a small layout plus stock could fit in a car plus another operator in another car, then expenses may be just fuel costs (for one car) or waived completely. But if it was a larger layout then the cost of the van hire & fuel would need to be reclaimed. I would never expect meals to be paid for however. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold beast66606 Posted August 22, 2012 RMweb Gold Share Posted August 22, 2012 Not to mention as a male model for Agent Provocateur ... ! Sadly Kylie agreed ... (YouTube if people haven't seen it!) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold beast66606 Posted August 22, 2012 RMweb Gold Share Posted August 22, 2012 I would never expect meals to be paid for however. A snack at lunch time is sufficient, we provide our own food the rest of the time, but lunch times we are captive so a snack / stodge is good ! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium newbryford Posted August 22, 2012 RMweb Premium Share Posted August 22, 2012 Or have them better distributed through the calendar. It is an annoying bugbear that there are often as many as 5 different shows to choose from on one weekend then many weeks when there isn't a single show to go to. Given that there are only a finite number of really good layouts to go round and good traders are being even more selective, there really should be some more coordination. Perhaps that is one, or the first thing, a national organisation should concentrate on - an evenish spread of shows across the country and across the year. Not easy to spread them across the calendar. We'll always have the "peak" exhibiting times of March-May and September-November. Winter shows are becoming less popular due to the possible damaging effect on attendance of bad weather - Preston, Wigan and Rochdale are three of my local shows that have moved dates away from December-February. Summer is also not a good time for most, as simple things like holidays get in the way for the clubs manning the show and the exhibitors attending. IMO, a majority of summer shows are at seaside resorts, or those with a reasonable tourist throughput. There's only so many seaside towns to go round during July-August. I'm off this Friday for 3 days to exhibit and then 3 days the following weekend as exhibitor and member of host club - so there goes another couple of half days putting road signs up and taking them down later. Cheers, Mick Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
37114 Posted August 22, 2012 Share Posted August 22, 2012 Some do this. However, more and more venues (normally sports halls) are restricting food and drink in the halls which does make it more difficult to crew the layout when operators get thirsty. Must be really hard on one man layout exhibitors who dont have the option of having relief helpers. Ian Sadly it works for the Tea and coffee going in but not for the by product going out!! We were discussing this thread at club last night and we (half) joked that as we have a club show coming up where some exhibits are far from finished we should make the show interactive by getting members of the public to join in and help finish the layout at the show. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kenton Posted August 22, 2012 Share Posted August 22, 2012 Not easy to spread them across the calendar. We'll always have the "peak" exhibiting times of March-May and September-November. Not easy I acknowledge but at least some token effort could be made in the name of progress. Even taking in only those 6 months it still seems to be the same problem year-on-year. With everything in one area then everything in a different area. Traveling is the biggest limitation not cost (for me) and I would visit a show most weekends given a chance yet whole months sometimes pass.... It is not that I want access to more shows just the ability to get to the ones that clash with others. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium newbryford Posted August 22, 2012 RMweb Premium Share Posted August 22, 2012 Not easy I acknowledge but at least some token effort could be made in the name of progress. Even taking in only those 6 months it still seems to be the same problem year-on-year. And the further varaible of Easter c*cks it up even more. York is "always" at Easter and the smaller shows don't want to clash with that, so they move around year on year, creating more headaches to those that want conveniently spaced dates. As a club, we mulled over a change of date for our show, which had been on a similar weekend for 44 years, but had to occur because of other shows moving theire dates around (probably traceable back to the monster that is NEC/Warley). No easy way out I'm afraid. Cheers, Mick Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red Devil Posted August 22, 2012 Share Posted August 22, 2012 Some interesting points throughout the tread, but if there are problems (I've no idea if this is the case as I have very little involvment with any clubs), I think the major one has got to be the sheer number of shows as per Andy Cs earlier posts. Living in the M62 corridor I could attend at least 1 show every weekend during the show season (or so it seems), bliss to some, personally it's overkill, I'll do a number either as a spectator or occasionally exhibiting, but every weekend, nah, divorce would beckon and Mrs Red Devil is pretty easy going on that front, seeing as she's my normal co exhibitor.....! So, ultimately market forces are going to decide the issue as who is going to tell so and so club that they can't have their exhibition 'then' because it clashes with x. Like anything else it'll probably be survival of the fitest. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium PhilJ W Posted August 22, 2012 RMweb Premium Share Posted August 22, 2012 Perhaps in areas where there are several clubs not to far apart that all run an exhibition could combine forces and have one much larger joint show instead of several small shows over a limited period of three or four months? This would depend of course on a suitable local venue being available and central to the clubs concerned. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Bigcheeseplant Posted August 22, 2012 Share Posted August 22, 2012 Maybe this goes against the grain but we should not go for promoting the hobby to children but rather the 30+ age group who have grown up done the women/drinking stuff and are now looking for a hobby and unlikely to be distracted a few years later. I have always been interested in model making and railways but the teen years there were more exciting things in life than playing trains, although even when I was young I prefered good models rather than anything that was aimed at children, I have always found that the best will inspire me more than an exibit dumbed down to apeal to everyone, I think the same goes for exhibition do the best and try to inspire. David Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
edcayton Posted August 22, 2012 Share Posted August 22, 2012 when I was young I prefered good models David Me too, but mine were in the pages of Mayfair and Men Only. Ed Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Joseph_Pestell Posted August 22, 2012 RMweb Gold Share Posted August 22, 2012 Me too, but mine were in the pages of Mayfair and Men Only. Ed Someone in the Club suggested that it would be a good idea to have a celebrity open the exhibition.Lynda Bellingham was suggested. I now realise that Linda Lusardi might have attracted a larger audience. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy C Posted August 22, 2012 Share Posted August 22, 2012 Maybe this goes against the grain but we should not go for promoting the hobby to children but rather the 30+ age group who have grown up done the women/drinking stuff and are now looking for a hobby and unlikely to be distracted a few years later. I have always been interested in model making and railways but the teen years there were more exciting things in life than playing trains, although even when I was young I prefered good models rather than anything that was aimed at children, I have always found that the best will inspire me more than an exibit dumbed down to apeal to everyone, I think the same goes for exhibition do the best and try to inspire. David It may go across the grain for a lot David but not me. I agree totally. Thomas layouts might amuse the under 8 group but thats about as far as it goes, by that time they have found X box et al. By the time they are 16 for the vast majority Thomas is but a vague memory but the latest Assasins Creed or whatever is the here and now, along with white Lightning or other cheap ciders and girls / boys (an equal opportunities posting) Theres a lot of froth about enticing kids into the hobby, but I honestly dont think thats the remit of the show. Lets be blunt does it really matter to me as an individual that kids get into the hobby? Not really. Both my lads helped me run the layouts at exhibitions and were well exposed to the hobby but neither showed any interest in taking it up. Does it worry me, not a bit, understand that like many people they are motivated by other things. But maybe in their 30s they come across railway modelling and it sparks a memory, maybe they see their dad having a good old time exhibiting his layouts and think thats not bad The only saving grace of enticing the "family" in is they pay money to get in and raise the coffers a bit, that I understand and especially so with the local show which often exists purely on the numbers of locals, be they enthusiasts or families, through the door. Big question - would you let your kid attend a model railway club after seeing some of the "characters" at model railway shows? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackRat Posted August 22, 2012 Share Posted August 22, 2012 To me a layout "under construction" is not a layout, it's a demo Some aren't even that, they are fillers! If you want too go for the under construction bit I always think a plank with bare boards at one end with the end result at the other is the answer. it needs only a couple of lines, up and down but be a 'sectionalised' step by step as you progress along the layout. Never seen one, but have seen lots of bare boards etc, if I want that I will go to Wickes and see sheets of ply for free They seem to go hand in hand with the 'club shop', often a trestle table full of often broken and over priced tat! I think presentation is all, and often think the layouts I best remember were those that gave a professional and polished display, no matter what the skill of modelling. Its surprising how many f/s layouts etc could actually do with a clean and dust (including the stock) b4 a trip out in the public gaze. Using the glam model as an analogy, its a bit like seeing Linda Lusardi and then when she smiles, she has teef like a burnt out fusebox! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest jim s-w Posted August 22, 2012 Share Posted August 22, 2012 Hi all I tend to agree with the thought that there are too many shows but (i hate to say this) there are also too many 'exhibition' layouts that are quite simply not good enough. I also dont know where the idea came from (earlier) in the thread that better layouts cost more? Its the size of a layout that affects its price not its quality. A 30ft layout will have the same costs regardless. Yes you might be able to put on a local show with local layouts and get the cost down but that tends to only work the first time unless you expect visitors to come to a virtually identical show year after year. The bigger a layout the more it costs but at he same time the cost per foot of exhibit gets lower the bigger the layout too. Cheers Jim Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackRat Posted August 22, 2012 Share Posted August 22, 2012 unless you expect visitors to come to a virtually identical show year after year. A common problem 'down West'! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kenton Posted August 22, 2012 Share Posted August 22, 2012 Big question - would you let your kid attend a model railway club after seeing some of the "characters" at model railway shows? Given that the hobby is predominantly all male "characters" I wouldn't have let my daughters anywhere near them. (and I've never been the lock up your daughter's type). I have always seen young children at shows to be more of a nuisance than of great importance to the continuation of the hobby. But I suppose if the Dad can use young Jimmy as an excuse to build a layout then all well and good. Otherwise the Thomas Tank layout serves as some sort of creche, somewhere to dump the kid while some serious layout at a sensible viewing height is examined. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
edcayton Posted August 22, 2012 Share Posted August 22, 2012 If you want too go for the under construction bit I always think a plank with bare boards at one end with the end result at the other is the answer. it needs only a couple of lines, up and down but be a 'sectionalised' step by step as you progress along the layout. Never seen one, but have seen lots of bare boards etc, if I want that I will go to Wickes and see sheets of ply for free Agree absolutely. The BCB layout at RMWeb day was a superb example, as was (? it might be finished now) the BRM layout in a shed. Ed Seems I'm not the only one who lusted after Linda Lusardi as a spotty teenager! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Cram Posted August 22, 2012 Share Posted August 22, 2012 I would agree with Jim that there are too many shows and too many poor exhibits. Fo rme a good show has a good selection of differnt layouts. At specialist shows this means different regions and periods. At general shows a variety including different guages is also part of the attreaction. Thjere also needs to be a variety of trade selling items that are attractibe to me as a modeller that I cannot get in my local model shop. This tends to be kits and specialist items like wheels to P4 and motors and gearboxes. Catering is another bug bear. I undersatnd that often this is not directly the fault of the exhibition when it is part of the hall but all too often the queues are too long, the staff badly prepared and food run out by 12:00. I didn't go to railex this year because of the parking and lack of catering last year. Expo Em is better now at Bracknell so I went there instead. Entry price is not a major factor but seeing quality layouts is. Far to many layouts are badly modelled and bear no relation to the real railway. I have no interest in seeing them. When deciding to go to an exhibition I look and see what layouts are there and then see what trade is in suppport. Providing the mix appeals I will then go. If not I won't. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Bigcheeseplant Posted August 22, 2012 Share Posted August 22, 2012 I remember as a junior member in our club I was taught to build copperclad pointwork rather than build a typical junior type layout, this inspired me more. Do children look at their fellow age group as role models or inspiration no they look at adults such as sports personalies as an example, therefore why do we dumb down exibits at an exhibition as an excuse to apeal to kids. I have always aimed Railex as a serious show for adults, although I see no reason why children who attend would not find something that they would enjoy. if we really want to improve our image start with making putting the hobby as a a serious adult past time. David Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
iL Dottore Posted August 22, 2012 Share Posted August 22, 2012 But that comes down to what an individual perceives as the "extra" - to the public it might be running a Virgin train (one of our most frequent requests) to a modeller it might be running a nicely detailed train, for a professional railman it might be stopping the train at the right place at a red signal or working the signals correctly or giving time for couplings to be joined etc. I would argue, Beast66606, that having a "professional" approach means having a good presentation, good lighting and engagement with the audience. What I have quoted from your post is part of both good presentation and engaging the audience, but is still only a part. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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