RMweb Premium uax6 Posted December 17, 2013 RMweb Premium Share Posted December 17, 2013 I'll hoak the road van out of the locker and take it home (where it should be anyway!) as I haven't brought my camera in today! I take it you will be using 20thou for the w-irons? Laminated or not? Should be as strong as the bought ones, even more so when the axle-boxes and springs are fitted... Ag Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
brossard Posted December 17, 2013 Share Posted December 17, 2013 Jason, if you look at post #10 in the thread link I posted you will see what Andy means about sliding tubes. Much neater than previous methods I have used. I didn't actually use it for the milk van. In fact if you're working in 00, you may get away with just the sliding axle, subject of course to layout curve radii. John Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold JCL Posted December 17, 2013 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted December 17, 2013 Ah, thanks John, it's all become clear now, - took a lot of staring though, I really must stop trying to learn new things at odd times of day. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium uax6 Posted December 17, 2013 RMweb Premium Share Posted December 17, 2013 Hopefully these photos show what I mean about the wire suspension Does it help? Andy g 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold JCL Posted December 17, 2013 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted December 17, 2013 Yep, thanks Andy. I'll make a start later. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium t-b-g Posted December 17, 2013 RMweb Premium Share Posted December 17, 2013 I can understand you wish to scratchbuild your underframes and I commend you greatly for wishing to do so. The last batch of 6 wheelers I did I chickened out and used the Cleminson type etched set from Brassmasters. It has pin point outside bearings on all 3 axles and is adjustable to many different wheelbases. The running of the carriages with those under them is far superior to a number of others I have with inside bearings and with the middle axle floating and the out pairs compensated (one fixed one pivotted - as per D & S kits) If you run into trouble with the scratchbuilds I can recommend them as an alternative. Tony Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold JCL Posted December 18, 2013 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted December 18, 2013 Thank you Tony, that's my fall back at the moment! I've just finished cutting the w-irons and the floors and sides of the three wheel positions. The one on the right is .020", the one on the left is two unglued layers of .010". I have my weld, and my TV remote control, so I'm going to get the layers glued together for at least one set of wheels before doing the other two sets. I'll post pictures later hopefully. It would be so much easier if that machine could cut .020" plastic. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Alister_G Posted December 18, 2013 RMweb Gold Share Posted December 18, 2013 They look great Jason. You may find that laminating two thinner pieces together actually ends up with a stronger completed item. This coach is going to be an absolute triumph, all the more so if you can build the underframes yourself, as apart from the wheels you won't have used anything that you haven't built yourself. Brilliant, Al. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium uax6 Posted December 18, 2013 RMweb Premium Share Posted December 18, 2013 Jason, If they are still a bit wibbley you can cut small strips and weld them at right-angles down the W. this will beef them up. Also where they secure to the top stretcher plate you can put gussets in to keep them at 90*. It is a pain that 20thou is just too thick. I would think 15thou should cut through, but I haven't any in stock to try. Andy G Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold JCL Posted December 18, 2013 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted December 18, 2013 (edited) Thanks Al and Andy. I tried the .020" first, but as it's a complicated shape, I spent as long with a scalpel as I would have if I'd cut it by hand in the first place, and I'd have still had to drill out the holes, so no real point using the cutter in this instance. I then tried again with .010" and found that to get the stiffness I need I needed to laminate 3 layers together. The concept looks like it's going to work though as it's pretty stiff, and doing the drop test it all stayed together. I'll definitely be using some bracing though as I can modify some [ channel for this. I'll use some strip for the open front and back to help the stiffness as well. The cradle is about 1mm too tall, and about 2 mm too narrow, so I'll redo it today. I'm also determined to do the springs and the axleboxes as well. I'm really enjoying this, but boy - Cleminson - nothing like a baptism of fire is there? You're right Al, I'll not be laminating styrene wheels or buffers. :-O Edited December 18, 2013 by JCL 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
brossard Posted December 18, 2013 Share Posted December 18, 2013 This is an interesting approach, watching with interest. Are you using pinpoint bearings? John Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium uax6 Posted December 18, 2013 RMweb Premium Share Posted December 18, 2013 Thats looking very nice. It might be a bit late now, but if you modify the floor of the coach, so that the floor is higher around the centre floating axle (or all three depending on which route you are going) then it will be easier to make the wheels fit, so they don't catch on the top bracing. BTW you ought to try casting the springs. Make one master and then get some RTV silicon to make the mould and them pour resin. I'm loving it! (If you need them I might have some MR springs and axleboxes combined that might be close enough for you....) Andy G Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold JCL Posted December 18, 2013 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted December 18, 2013 Hi John, That's a good point, I'll get some ordered. Looking at them I'll get shouldered and non-shouldered but will probably go for the latter as there's not going to be a lot of space under there on the sliding middle axle. On my first go, I'm going to make all three axles the same instead of using tabs to change the pivot point on the outer two. Also, I'm going to try anchoring the wire in the middle axle to see if that will work - I'll see if I can do a temporary fix with blutack, then I'll try anchoring two wires on the outside wheel sets to see which is better. Being terminally uncool, I also have a banjo and it needs restringing so there's every chance I'll have a number of gauges to try out. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium uax6 Posted December 18, 2013 RMweb Premium Share Posted December 18, 2013 Don't bother with the unshouldered ones, you need the shouldered ones! Hang on a minute, what method of bendiness are you going with here? I need to know so that i don't send you up the garden path! To anchor the wire, drill a hole in the two gusset plates which you haven't fitted yet, and then superglue it in place. Andy G Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
brossard Posted December 18, 2013 Share Posted December 18, 2013 Jason, you might find waisted bearings to be better (look like a wizard's hat). http://www.nairnshire-modelling-supplies.co.uk/50-x-waisted-rolling-stock-bearings-p-1510.html?zenid=9tbo3vsqbqberc9l775coqnmd1 John Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold JCL Posted December 18, 2013 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted December 18, 2013 Hi Andy, casting springs??? Sounds like a great idea, but my brain is in meltdown already. Everything I've done on this coach has been a new experience and casting may well take me over the edge. That said, I was looking at Atlantic3279's thread on lner.info, he's doing a lot of casting there. 209 pages but well worth a look. http://www.lner.info/forums/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=2443&sid=bce8a8e17d6f6911372fd975f6fb6087&start=3135 I'll have a look for the method I was going to try for springs and post it up here. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold JCL Posted December 18, 2013 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted December 18, 2013 They're interesting John, looks like they're worth a go. I'll have a look around for some in stock and make an order. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium uax6 Posted December 18, 2013 RMweb Premium Share Posted December 18, 2013 (edited) Casting is actually easier than it sounds.... The hardest part is making the master! So which method of flex are you using? Andy g Edited December 18, 2013 by uax6 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold JCL Posted December 18, 2013 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted December 18, 2013 Up and down or side to side? Side to side, the middle axle will slide between two rails, and hopefully banjo wire will allow the two outer axles to stay inline on a curve. Up and down, not so easy as the vehicle has a thick floor that I don't really want to cut out. I'm thinking of making the outer axle bases a bit thicker than the ones in the middle to give a bit of wiggle room. Or is there something I'm not grasping? :-/ Cheers Jason Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium uax6 Posted December 18, 2013 RMweb Premium Share Posted December 18, 2013 So you are going for the full clemmy then? Not the floating wire or tubed axle... Those w irons look usefull. I can see my LNWR 6-wheelers being built like this now. Coming back from the gates I had a thought... If you put the w irons where they should be (ie hard up against the inside of the solebars-which should be approx scale 7 -> 7.5 feet apart) then the axles will need to be longer, which would make the sliding tube centre one have more throw over. Or how about a fixed central axle and two pony trucks? Andy g Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Theakerr Posted December 18, 2013 Share Posted December 18, 2013 Jason, If you send me your mailing address i will send you some top hat pin point bearing cups. If I get them off tomorrow you should have them just after Christmas Jim Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold JCL Posted December 18, 2013 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted December 18, 2013 Cheers Jim Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaz Posted December 24, 2013 Share Posted December 24, 2013 JCL A Merry Xmas and a Happy New year to you and yours. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold JCL Posted December 24, 2013 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted December 24, 2013 Merry Christmas Jaz, and everyone else that reads this thread! Hope you all have a wonderful time. cheers Jason 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold JCL Posted December 24, 2013 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted December 24, 2013 This should make you feel Christmassy. My neighbor taking part in winter sports (snow blowing) right now. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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