Wright writes.....

[davidw]

A 2 2 13.jpg

 

My last point on soldering (for the time being?).

 

Apart from the dome and smokebox door, everything on this DJH A2/2 has been soldered together thus far. Why wouldn't you? 

Hi Tony,

 

How did you plot/position the wing deflectors on the loco?

 

Thanks 

 

David 

[micklner]

I'd forgotten the balance weights - of course they're glued in place. 

 

The slight gap at the rear of the tender occurred when soldering in the tender top, and it drew the solder back out (wouldn't have happened with glue!). I'll run a bit more solder into the gap. In fairness, all my models at stages such as this are 'work in progress'. When it's complete, I'll take another picture, scrutinise it, then rectify any areas which need attention. 

 

I don't know which 'lovely' model you're referring to, Mick. The model shown will be 60505, the only A2/2 with a Thompson boiler. 

 

All Thommo's are lovely !!

[ROY@34F]

! have used a lot of Romford wheels  in the past mostly without any problems but one 0-6-0 chassis defeated all my efforts to get a free running chassis  without any binding. In these circumstances the first place I look is at the coupling rods but I could find no fault there, After puzzling long and hard I eventually found the problem. On one axle one wheel was out of sync with its mate by about 10+ degrees and no it wasn't a wheel problem. the squares on the axle ends were misaligned. Replacing the axle solved the problem. I made d*****d sure I could never pick up that axle again by mistake.

 

I have (thankfully) not had that happen again.

 

Arthurk

 

I've had that very same fault Arthur many years ago, and it was by more than 10 degrees as I remember.

 

Roy.

[Tony Wright]

Hi Tony,

 

How did you plot/position the wing deflectors on the loco?

 

Thanks 

 

David 

From the Isinglass drawing, David, and from prototype pictures. 

 

If you're building a DJH A2/2, whatever you do, do not use the witness marks on the smokebox to fix them (and the tabs on the deflectors). These are at far too steep an angle, and will look all wrong. Though I did the test build for these kits and wrote the instructions, I certainly didn't recommend the fixing position which DJH seems to have adopted. And, that's not passing the buck. 

 

They are really rather tricky to get right, and require a fair bit of trial and error. From looking at pictures (though some angles are confusing), it's my impression that the (useless) fins are a twitch further forward on those locos latterly fitted with a Thompson or Peppercorn boiler (those with a shorter smokebox). If you have a copy of The Power of the A2s by Gavin Morrison, there are two similar views of MONS MEG at Kings Cross and THANE OF FIFE at Gainsborough. The former has the original, longer smokebox. I know the perspective is tricky, but 60504's front edge of the fin is a bit behind the leading handrail pillar on the smokebox, and 60505 is not quite so far back, almost level with the pillar. If you look at the picture in the book of EARL MARISCHAL, taken at Grantham, there's a dribble down the side of the smokebox from the front of the deflector, and that bisects the front pillar. That's what I've used as my guide. The top edge of the fins should not be horizontal, but prototype pictures can be ambiguous. If you look at the last picture of 60506 in the book, you'd swear the top of the fin was parallel with the chimney.  

 

They're attached on the model (naturally) with solder. The dodge is to tin the rear of the fins with 145 degree solder, then fix them in place with low-melt, running the iron along the base of the fin, only touching the smokebox with the solder bead. Start with a tiny tack at one end, and adjust as necessary, then follow the seam. The real things were welded on, so we're 'replicating' this. I can't believe any adhesive would hold these items in place successfully. 

 

This class of six Pacifics had as many differences among them as their progenitors. These include different boilers (60503 and 60504 retained their original-style cut-down P2 boilers to withdrawal), full 'V'-fronted cab (originals) or cut-off 'V'-front (those with Thompson/Peppercorn boilers), cranked vacuum ejector pipes (60501 and 60504, at different times and in opposite ways), chimneys (only 60506 never got the lipped chimney), front numberplate positions (60505 and 60506, for a time, had their 'plates and front cross rail transposed), side handrails clipped short of the smokebox front rim (60501 and 60505), curved-in cab rears and curved in tender fronts, and beading (60501 and 60502), plus the positions of the nameplates on the smokebox sides. I've never seen this last feature written down, but those with the shorter names - LORD PRESIDENT, MONS MEG and THANE OF FIFE, had their 'plates moved further forwards towards the ends of their lives. All received AWS, despite the RCTS and Isinglass informing us that 60501 never did. 

 

Ah, as my mates at Irwell say, those 'joys of loco-picking'. 

 

Finally, and this is where I've deviated from the prototype. In 1958, 60505's vacuum ejector pipe was anything but straight on the nearside of the boiler (see the last picture in the book mentioned) It was droopy, and was not parallel to the handrails, being quite a bit lower at the front than where it entered the spectacle plate. I actually fixed it like this, but it just looked all wrong - just grotty building. It's straight on the model, but wrong!

Edited December 6, 2017 by Tony Wright

[jwealleans]

Is it me, Tony, or is there something odd about the shape of the brake shoes?

[96701]

 

You should always use a Romford Screwdriver for this job. I assume you have one.

 

Sir, sir, I have one!

[KalKat]

Is it me, Tony, or is there something odd about the shape of the brake shoes?

Indeed, are they upside down?

 

 

Emma

[Arthur]

 

Looks to me like they’re just the hangers and the shoes have yet to be fitted.

 

.

[davidw]

From the Isinglass drawing, David, and from prototype pictures.

 

If you're building a DJH A2/2, whatever you do, do not use the witness marks on the smokebox to fix them (and the tabs on the deflectors). These are at far too steep an angle, and will look all wrong. Though I did the test build for these kits and wrote the instructions, I certainly didn't recommend the fixing position which DJH seems to have adopted. And, that's not passing the buck.

 

They are really rather tricky to get right, and require a fair bit of trial and error. From looking at pictures (though some angles are confusing), it's my impression that the (useless) fins are a twitch further forward on those locos latterly fitted with a Thompson or Peppercorn boiler (those with a shorter smokebox). If you have a copy of The Power of the A2s by Gavin Morrison, there are two similar views of MONS MEG at Kings Cross and THANE OF FIFE at Gainsborough. The former has the original, longer smokebox. I know the perspective is tricky, but 60504's front edge of the fin is a bit behind the leading handrail pillar on the smokebox, and 60505 is not quite so far back, almost level with the pillar. If you look at the picture in the book of EARL MARISCHAL, taken at Grantham, there's a dribble down the side of the smokebox from the front of the deflector, and that bisects the front pillar. That's what I've used as my guide. The top edge of the fins should not be horizontal, but prototype pictures can be ambiguous. If you look at the last picture of 60506 in the book, you'd swear the top of the fin was parallel with the chimney.

 

They're attached on the model (naturally) with solder. The dodge is to tin the rear of the fins with 145 degree solder, then fix them in place with low-melt, running the iron along the base of the fin, only touching the smokebox with the solder bead. Start with a tiny tack at one end, and adjust as necessary, then follow the seam. The real things were welded on, so we're 'replicating' this. I can't believe any adhesive would hold these items in place successfully.

 

This class of six Pacifics had as many differences among them as their progenitors. These include different boilers (60503 and 60504 retained their original-style cut-down P2 boilers to withdrawal), full 'V'-fronted cab (originals) or cut-off 'V'-front (those with Thompson/Peppercorn boilers), cranked vacuum ejector pipes (60501 and 60504, at different times and in opposite ways), chimneys (only 60506 never got the lipped chimney), front numberplate positions (60505 and 60506, for a time, had their 'plates and front cross rail transposed), side handrails clipped short of the smokebox front rim (60501 and 60505), curved-in cab rears and curved in tender fronts, and beading (60501 and 60502), plus the positions of the nameplates on the smokebox sides. I've never seen this last feature written down, but those with the shorter names - LORD PRESIDENT, MONS MEG and THANE OF FIFE, had their 'plates moved further forwards towards the ends of their lives. All received AWS, despite the RCTS and Isinglass informing us that 60501 never did.

 

Ah, as my mates at Irwell say, those 'joys of loco-picking'.

 

Finally, and this is where I've deviated from the prototype. In 1958, 60505's vacuum ejector pipe was anything but straight on the nearside of the boiler (see the last picture in the book mentioned) It was droopy, and was not parallel to the handrails, being quite a bit lower at the front than where it entered the spectacle plate. I actually fixed it like this, but it just looked all wrong - just grotty building. It's straight on the model, but wrong!

Thanks Tony. I am building one. Those deflectors are a pig to get right. The info you provide is most useful.

[EHertsGER]

Somewhere back in the mists of time and in the course of discussing PDK kits I alluded to my being in the process of building a SR Class V ‘Schools’ class locomotive, specifically 920 ‘Rugby’ (as it is where a number of rather optimistic individuals felt I might learn a thing or two - which I did, but not necessarily from school books...).

 

Anyway, for the curious I felt I might document my observations in my own ‘blog’ part of this site rather than obfuscate the content Tony so graciously sponsors here.

 

In summary, it is to be a P4 model combining the PDK kit with the Finecast chassis on Ultrascale wheels and presented in early 1930s condition. Anybody with any guidance is welcome to add to my experience...

Edited December 7, 2017 by EHertsGER

[Mallard60022]

Sir, sir, I have one!

I have two....................................................... and I can't find either of them. 

Something else that is really useful in my limted experience is a set of nut (or cheese-head bolt) turners (no sniggering those boys at the back). I can't find those either; hopeless I know!

Phil

[Clive Mortimore]

I have two....................................................... and I can't find either of them. 

Something else that is really useful in my limted experience is a set of nut (or cheese-head bolt) turners (no sniggering those boys at the back). I can't find those either; hopeless I know!

Phil

I have two as well, trouble is one of them is for left handed threads.

[Killybegs]

I have two....................................................... and I can't find either of them. 

Something else that is really useful in my limted experience is a set of nut (or cheese-head bolt) turners (no sniggering those boys at the back). I can't find those either; hopeless I know!

Phil

Eileen's Emporium?

[Tony Wright]

Is it me, Tony, or is there something odd about the shape of the brake shoes?

The brake blocks have yet to be added, Jonathan.

 

Someone commented that the hangers are upside down.

 

Since it's impossible to fit them upside down, I'm puzzled at this observation. 

[KalKat]

Well, that will be me told then Mr. Wright  

 

I wasn't aware that the blocks weren't yet present  and thought the shape presented itself to suit the wheel radius the other way up. Mea Culpa.

 

 

Emma

[Tony Wright]

 

Just the motion and valve gear to erect now on the A2/2. Since a lot of this is already assembled, it shouldn't take long. 

 

The backing plate behind the sandbox fillers and the dome further forward confirm it to be 60505, not to mention the rimmed chimney (which was changed in 1959 to a lipped one), the cut-back side handrails and the transposed front numberplate and cross rail on the smokebox door. 

 

Keen observers will note the now-present brake blocks (soldered in place, of course). They're far too far off the treads, but that means no chance of short circuits nor mechanical interference. When painted and weathered, the discrepancy will not be too noticeable. 

 

I've estimated that is must be at least the 15th A2/2 I've made, and the third model of 60505. It's strange that I've never been asked to build 60502 or 60503 (are their names less exciting?). Since I never saw either of them, I've never built a model of EARL MARISCHAL (apart from two as a P2, one in original guise, the other with big deflectors) or LORD PRESIDENT for myself. 

 

As for the DJH kit; entirely suitable for OO and EM, though the chassis would be no good at source for P4. Will something like this ever be available RTR? With this and the PDK kit, and Graeme King's amazingly inventive resin/etched bits and pieces to convert a Bachmann A2, I rather hope not. No doubt, that last sentiment will outrage those who feel they're being denied their rights! 

Edited December 7, 2017 by Tony Wright

[Tony Wright]

Well, that will be me told then Mr. Wright

 

I wasn't aware that the blocks weren't yet present  and thought the shape presented itself to suit the wheel radius the other way up. Mea Culpa.

 

 

Emma

A reasonable deduction, Emma. 

 

Many thanks for your comments.

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

[Tony Wright]

I have a question, if you wouldn't mind helping me with it, Tony;

 

Someone at my local club gave me a white metal kit body and tender, which I duly stripped from its paint and discovered it had been glued together. Unfortunately, when it was stripped back, the footplate on one side snapped in three along the length.

 

It has been recommended that I make a balsa jig to make sure when these pieces are resoldered they're in a straight line, however I'm just worried that the pieces could easily snap again, the white metal feels very soft whenever it's handled. Do you think this would work, or should I write to the manufacturer (SE Finecast) to see if I can't obtain a replacement part?

 

If all else fails (the body is for a GW Castle) I may see if I can do a mix-and-match of an RTR body and this kit.

 

Many thanks,

 

Alexandra

Alexandra,

 

If you have a hardwood mitre block (which also gives you a true right angle), use that to make sure all the pieces are in line, then solder them together. 

 

If it doesn't work, contact Dave Ellis of SE Finecast. He's most-helpful and will supply any part from any of his kits for a most reasonable price. 

 

Please, let us know how you get on. 

[Headstock]

A 2 2 14.jpg

 

Just the motion and valve gear to erect now on the A2/2. Since a lot of this is already assembled, it shouldn't take long. 

 

The backing plate behind the sandbox fillers and the dome further forward confirm it to be 60505, not to mention the rimmed chimney (which was changed in 1959 to a lipped one), the cut-back side handrails and the transposed front numberplate and cross rail on the smokebox door. 

 

Keen observers will note the now-present brake blocks (soldered in place, of course). They're far too far off the treads, but that means no chance of short circuits nor mechanical interference. When painted and weathered, the discrepancy will not be too noticeable. 

 

I've estimated that is must be at least the 15th A2/2 I've made, and the third model of 60505. It's strange that I've never been asked to build 60502 or 60503 (are their names less exciting?). Since I never saw either of them, I've never built a model of EARL MARISCHAL (apart from two as a P2, one in original guise, the other with big deflectors) or LORD PRESIDENT for myself. 

 

As for the DJH kit; entirely suitable for OO and EM, though the chassis would be no good at source for P4. Will something like this ever be available RTR? With this and the PDK kit, and Graeme King's amazingly inventive resin/etched bits and pieces to convert a Bachmann A2, I rather hope not. No doubt, that last sentiment will outrage those who feel they're being denied their rights! 

 

Afternoon Tony,

 

the grab handles are a nice little touch on the front platform, not a lot of people notice that they angle out towards the valance. A couple of questions if I may, what's the deal with the 'deluxe' crankpins, are they most peoples default product these days? I got a pack of them many years ago but thought they were vastly over scale, imparting a toy like appearance to the coupling rods, they were put away never to be seen again. A second question please, I never had a reply to my query with regard to the destination board brackets (or lack off) on your recent triplet Restaurant car set.

[Manxcat]

Tony,

 

Could I ask please, how do you attach etched nameplates to your loco kits? Do you solder them in place or are they too fragile to make that a viable option? If glued, what kind of adhesive do you use? Thanks.

 

Archie

[gr.king]

On clean, thoroughly hardened paint, properly adherent to the base material, some of my nameplates have been perfectly happy to stay in place for quite some time now attached by no more than a narrow strip of double-sided clear tape, folded double to give it a bit more resilience and gap-filling ability. It's nicely free of risk at the time of application - no chance of getting glue where it shouldn't be on the model - and bar the tackiness of one side of the plate the whole thing is clean and dry as you are trying to position it correctly. The "tack" is just enough to hold it in place if you position it lightly at the first attempt, leaving open the possibility of lifting it off harmlessly and re-positioning the thing if you're not quite satisfied. Once you are happy, press more firmly in place. I've also found that a couple of years after application, the plates can be eased off with a thin blade and the tape will still come away from sound paint leaving it undamaged. Any "goo" left behind soon cleans off with a little suitable spirit.

[landscapes]

A 2 2 14.jpg

 

Just the motion and valve gear to erect now on the A2/2. Since a lot of this is already assembled, it shouldn't take long. 

 

The backing plate behind the sandbox fillers and the dome further forward confirm it to be 60505, not to mention the rimmed chimney (which was changed in 1959 to a lipped one), the cut-back side handrails and the transposed front numberplate and cross rail on the smokebox door. 

 

Keen observers will note the now-present brake blocks (soldered in place, of course). They're far too far off the treads, but that means no chance of short circuits nor mechanical interference. When painted and weathered, the discrepancy will not be too noticeable. 

 

I've estimated that is must be at least the 15th A2/2 I've made, and the third model of 60505. It's strange that I've never been asked to build 60502 or 60503 (are their names less exciting?). Since I never saw either of them, I've never built a model of EARL MARISCHAL (apart from two as a P2, one in original guise, the other with big deflectors) or LORD PRESIDENT for myself. 

 

As for the DJH kit; entirely suitable for OO and EM, though the chassis would be no good at source for P4. Will something like this ever be available RTR? With this and the PDK kit, and Graeme King's amazingly inventive resin/etched bits and pieces to convert a Bachmann A2, I rather hope not. No doubt, that last sentiment will outrage those who feel they're being denied their rights! 

 

Hi Tony

 

Super model, if you don't mind me asking is it for yourself to run on Little Bytham, if so I look forward to seeing it running in its finished paintwork.

 

Regards

 

David

[Enterprisingwestern]

The brake blocks have yet to be added, Jonathan.

 

Someone commented that the hangers are upside down.

 

Since it's impossible to fit them upside down, I'm puzzled at this observation. 

 

, but not impossible to etch them upside down.

 

Mike.

Edited December 7, 2017 by Enterprisingwestern

[Tony Wright]

Afternoon Tony,

 

the grab handles are a nice little touch on the front platform, not a lot of people notice that they angle out towards the valance. A couple of questions if I may, what's the deal with the 'deluxe' crankpins, are they most peoples default product these days? I got a pack of them many years ago but thought they were vastly over scale, imparting a toy like appearance to the coupling rods, they were put away never to be seen again. A second question please, I never had a reply to my query with regard to the destination board brackets (or lack off) on your recent triplet Restaurant car set.

Good evening Andrew,

 

My apologies for not replying to your question about the roof brackets on the triplet. I forgot!

 

I've now fitted the 'Kings Cross-Newcastle' destination boards. Since these more or less cover the brackets, my 'sketch-book' approach assumes there are brackets underneath. 

 

I have to say I'm not a great user of the Markits deluxe crankpins. I much prefer the old style, where (yet again!) soldering is needed to secure the crankpin washers. I used the deluxe type on this A2/2 because the holes in the rods are rather large (DJH used to provide special drivers for screw-in crankpins). They don't supply wheels any more with their kits, but the rods still have big holes, which the deluxe crankpins fit perfectly. 

 

 

At close-range, the crankpins are a bit obese, though they're easy to fit - and easy to shear off if too much pressure is applied with the Romford screwdriver!

 

 

 

Now complete and ready for painting, with just a few detail bits and pieces to add. As for the 'pins at this range? It's a layout loco, and it's just taken 15 bogies around LB with no effort. With the motion eventually weathered down, the 'pins won't be too obtrusive. 

[Tony Wright]

Tony,

 

Could I ask please, how do you attach etched nameplates to your loco kits? Do you solder them in place or are they too fragile to make that a viable option? If glued, what kind of adhesive do you use? Thanks.

 

Archie

Archie,

 

I only ever use Evo-Stik for sticking 'plates to finished locos, in impact mode. That is, smear a tiny amount on the back of the plate and on where it's to go on the model. Let the adhesive dry (five minutes), then bring the two together. A little adjustment is possible, and, if a tiny bit oozes out, it can be easily picked away with a cocktail stick. 

 

Though superglue will hold 'plates in place, such is its instant grip that, if the 'plate is slightly out of place, that's it - no adjustment. Take it off, and it'll remove the paint!

 

Epoxy takes too long to set and is a bit viscous. 

 

Solder can be used, but not on painted plates - which means they'll have to be painted with the loco.