Wright writes.....

[raymw]

It's not the low light level, but the fact that the overcast sky has diffused the light, removing harsh shadows, glare, etc.

[Black Marlin]

How about modeling in black and white to make a model that feels right?

 

I think I've cracked it!

 

 

Some things worth noting, as I have been keen student of the Tony Wright School of Modelling (Correspondence Course): the locomotive heading towards the camera is a) Eastern, b) carrying the correct lamp headcode, c) crewed, d) loaded with real coal, e) set up with the closest possible tender-loco coupling, and f) at the head of an appropriate and scale-length rake of wagons.

 

I apologise for the quality of the picture - I was lent the camera because, like a clot, I managed to return to Northern Ireland (where my layout lives) having forgotten to bring my own, and so I wasn't familiar with the Nikon I was using or its settings. I plead ignorance, m'luds.

 

Oh, and on the other line, heading away from the camera, an O2 with a whitemetal crew provided by Pete Goss. It's hard for me to see that engine now without immediately thinking of the RMWeb community...!

 

Gavin

[Tony Wright]

Many, many thanks for all the recent comments with regard to goods trains, lamps and photography. The level of knowledge, experience and expertise is incredible, and everyone is so generous in their wish to share all of this. I'm also pleased how folk are comfortable at being 'constructively-critical'. Please, keep it up. 

 

With regard to photography, I've been conducting a couple of experiments. 

 

 

This picture was taken in August 1962, three years after the station at Little Bytham was closed and razed to the ground. Could I take an equivalent model picture? 

 

 

Some hopes! The impossibility of getting a camera the size of a large house into the same relative position was the first hurdle; at which I clearly fell. Though the positions of the structures are pretty near where they should be, my need to use a wide-angle lens and the previously-mentioned problem of positioning the camera has meant extreme parallax. The Up splitting starter had to be moved a little nearer to the station for its mechanism to miss a bearer but it looks a fair bit out of position in relation to the stationmaster's house.  The trees are also way too small, so bigger ones will have to be 'planted'. There are, obvious differences not caused by my inability to get a similar shot. Not only has the station itself gone but the Down home has been removed and the little stone barn has been demolished. At least the class of loco and the visible consist of its train are the same, admittedly representing a slightly earlier period. 

 

 

Another August 1962 picture, this time looking north. 

 

 

I think I've done better with this one, though the wide-angle lens has produced some peripheral distortion (I'm told clever people who can use Photoshop can get round this, but I'm dim!) If nothing else, I'm pleased with how the wide-open sweep of the main line appears; not too much selective compression needed at all. 

[mullie]

As far as I can trace prior to June 1962 maximum permitted speeds for the various classes of freight trains were included in Regional Instructions so could possibly vary between Regions particularly when something ' a bit special' was being done.  For example on the Western Class C freights were permitted by the 1960 WR Instruction to run at 55mph maximum but fully fitted ballast trains from quarries to stabling yards running as Class C were limited to a maximum of 50mph.  I don't know what the ER Instruction would have said (sorry) but the WR Instruction permitted Class F trains to run at a maximum of 30 mph while Class H were restricted to a maximum of 25 mph although both were allowed to run 125 miles between locations where they were to be examined - thus reclassifying to Class H would have extended journey times in one respect but might have reduced them by omitting intermediate traffic stops.

 

In the 1950 classification Class F were permitted to run without continuous brakes with lighter loads.

 

All of this is something of a jungle but the thought you need to start with is brake power and for many years it was a critical factor in freight train classification and timetabling.  Basically any engine - within reasonable limits - could start a freight train and keep it moving on all but steep rising gradients.  But stopping such a train was a different matter, especially stopping it from a higher speed - hence more continuously braked wagons = higher classification = better stopping power in most circumstances (= higher permissible speeds where/when such things were published).  Also it needs to be seen against a background of changing vehicle technology - for example as late as 1960 wagons with grease axleboxes were not permitted in Class C or D freights on the Western (and probably elsewhere) while more wagons fitted with continuous brakes meant that more freights could run to the higher classifications.

 

There were of course other ways of dealing with braking, or rather avoiding braking, and the GC route was well known for these with its 'hurry up' Distant Signals which were actually a sort of inner distant placed beneath the outermost Home Signal which meant that if a 'box's stop signals could be cleared after an approaching train passed its Distant as caution the 'hurry u' distant could be cleared and Drivers needn't slow right down once they saw it was 'off'.  This would undoubtedly have an influence on train handling, and probably timetabling, and might have been part of the 'Special F' formula although the added braking power of a 9F and its tender was probably far more important in allowing a bit of latitude with loads and speeds.  Sorry that I can't answer with original source material relevant to the route.

 

In my experience marshalling yard staff hated dealing with fitted freight trains.  The reasons were various but centred around time ('bagging up' the vacuum pipes when trains were formed or shunted took extra time and could be dirty work;  breaking the pipes and pulling strings to release the vacuum took time when shunting vehicles off arriving trains; carrying out the continuity test also took time before departure) and the other big concern was personal safety as someone had to go in between (wagons) in order to bag up and that exposed them to risk if something moved or if other wagons were shunted against the wagons they were working under.  Hence whenever possible the number of wagons on which the continuous brake was connected up was kept to the necessary minimum and if a train could conceivably be run without continuous brakes then it would be.  

 

One of the thing which often makes me chuckle on model railways is reference or attempts to form brake fitted wagons at the head of local freight trips - very, very unlikely that anyone would go to that bother and f they did they'd probably get a rollicking from the Guard who had to shunt them out of his train at a wayside station.

 

Again using a Western source but this will give people an idea of how marshalling worked and what a freight marshalling book or circular would contain I'll use a nice easy example from late 1948 

 Train 10.55 pm Bristol West Depot - Tavistock Junction, Class C to Newton, thence Class E.  Calling at Exeter and Newton Abbot only; terminates Newton Abbot SX.  Engine power group DX  (i.e. Goup D with the additional 'X' painted above it on the cabside).  Load =67 wagons of Class 3 traffic to Newton Abbot;  =49 wagons of Class 3 from Newton Abbot

 

Formed (from engine) -

Plymouth & District Vacuum

Newton Abbot Vacuum

Exeter Vacuum

Exeter Non-Vac

Newton Abbot Non Vac

Plymouth & District Non Vac

Cornish Non Vac

 

It is easy to see what would happen at Exeter as dropping Exeter traffic would simply mean taking out a single shunt from the middle of the train.  However any traffic added would have to be segregated as per the original marshalling which would have taken time so the train was only booked to put-off traffic.

 

Equally detaching at Newton Abbot was relatively simple as it just meant a single shunt of wagons from within the train.  However on Saturday nights when it ran through to Tavistock Jcn the train also attached traffic at Newton Abbot - including anything from Exeter so that had to be shunted into the relevant segregation (although I doubt it was very much).

 

By the time the train left Newton it had lost two of its fitted portions so it was reduced to Class E for timetabling purposes as it was by that stage unlikely to have enough fitted wagons to remain as Class C.  The planned decision to reduce the class of the train would have been based on experience of normal traffic flows on the train and if, for whatever reason, it could still make Class C it would have been amended locally and advised as such by Control.

 

Incidentally it was running quite closely behind the 9.55 pm from West Depot to Penzance (which called at Newton and then Liskeard for traffic purposes) so Cornish traffic would probably have been quite light on the 10.55 pm and was most likely any surplus from this earlier train.

 

What all this doesn't do, alas, is answer Tony's original question of what type of wagons  would be found in any particular train but hopefully what it will do is give an idea of how freight train marshalling worked for traffic purposes and that in itself will give some clues as would the various connecting services into these trains which i haven't listed.  The nature of various publications and exactly what information was in them changed over the years - for example by the time I was in freight planning on the Western, from the late 1980s, we had far fewer instances of trains being marshalled according to destinations of the various wagons forming them as more and more were worked as block trains through from A t o B, or wherever, which made trailing loads for different types of loco a more prominent feature than had earlier been the case.  But by then we were facing very different complexities on the Western because we were running trains with trailing loads of up to 5,000 tonnes and one of our marshalling criteria was getting the right type of wagon couplings formed in the correct place in the train in order to avoid breakaways, and of course virtually all our trains ran fully fitted.

 

Incidentally answering Tony's point about lamping local practice varied but very often for local moves it was the case that an engine would come off shed lamped for the train it was going to work (assuming it wasn't going to reverse and a change of tail lamp wasn't involved).   In reality if the engine was going to run through a block section between signalboxes it would definitely have to carry a tail lamp but it might still carry the code for its job rather than light engine code if such was authorised or, in some cases. was the local equivalent of 'an old Spanish custom'.  Thus 'Manna' might have come off an arriving train or equally it had come round from York shed to the south end preparatory to reversing onto a train it would be working forward from York

I may have misread the above but it seems that typical modellers random shunting of wagons from all over the length of a train is not correct even if it can make things more interesting?

 

Would the typical modellers 'branch line' goods have been assembled as cuts of wagons that could be shunted easily regardless of whether fitted or not?

 

Martyn

[Tony Wright]

The only snip of info. I could possibly supply Tony, would be about the strict adherance of use of discs and their position with SR loco's coming from 72A, down the BRSR to Exeter Central (discs on the leading end and lamp on the trailing end) and for those LE movements from Central to 72A (discs on the leading end and lamp on the trailing end). Without actually having confirmed why at this time of writing, I suspect it was because all other mainline movements, including LE to the east out of that particular area (e.g. to Sidmouth Junction) had the same headcode of two discs, central smokebox top + center buffer bracket. Trains going west of Exeter Central had different headcodes (almost always discs unless it was a train for the WR route witrh a WR loco). The SR always had to be 'different' after 1948, but I am aware discs were used on 'other railways' pre 1948. Were there any post 1948? SR Discs, as you know, showed route not class of train. Presumably the Bobby knew what was heading towards them in the dark from the box bell codes and the WTT and adjusted his signal and line position accordingly where ever possible.   Bulleid Pacifics had electric lamps fore and aft as well but as far as I'm aware they were lit as per the Disc position when running on the Southern routes. I shall have to have a look at the situation (from pics) of SR loco's running off Region (e.g. to Oxford or on the WR on the crew familiarisation Exeter Plymouth turns)

This is probably of no use as I doubt your Irwell stuff includes any BRSR?

Also if this is completely unconnecetd with the previous posts then I'll delete it.

Sincerely

Phil 

Phil,

 

You need never delete anything as far as I'm concerned. 

 

Believe it or not, I'll be scribbling some of my memories of the SR with regard to further Cestrian Urchin tales for BRILL, taking me much further away than my native haunts. Right now, I'm writing about my experiences at Reford, Doncaster, Selby, York, Thirsk and Darlington, and places in between and east/west of the ECML. Apparently my inane and puerile ramblings over the last three years have proved of some interest, generating a fair bit of correspondence; not all of it hostile!  

[31A]

Do not forget that disc indicators were used extensively on the GE and ex GE lines with lamps only being substituted when trains ran after dark. However they were not route indicators such as the Southern used.

I often wonder why the LM region used black headcode lamps as opposed to white painted ones. They must have been so difficult to see when running at speed past a signal box. Any ex railway type able to comment on this please?

 

Martin Long

 

 

In the Liverpool Street suburban area, as far out as Southend at least, the discs WERE used as route indicators in a similar way to the Southern system; some of the GE headcodes even called for discs with coloured centres (blue / purple?) - from photographs this system seems to have been in place until the end of steam.  For example North Woolwich line trains had a blue disc below the chimney and a white one above the coupling.  Discs were also used in a 'route indicating' manner in the Norwich area; pictures taken in early BR days show this but I'm not sure when it ceased.

[Clearwater]

Tony

 

On the subject on getting the right angle and the comparative size of cameras, have you tried using a modern camera phone? Whilst they, I assume, are not as sopshisticated as dslr cameras, they tend to be 7+mega pixels in terms of Images and often the camera lens is right at the top of the phone and hence can be placed pretty much flush to the baseboard

 

David

[The Johnster]

I may have misread the above but it seems that typical modellers random shunting of wagons from all over the length of a train is not correct even if it can make things more interesting?

 

Would the typical modellers 'branch line' goods have been assembled as cuts of wagons that could be shunted easily regardless of whether fitted or not?

 

Martyn

 

A branch line goods would be marshalled at the junction, or the yard forwarding the traffic, according to the needs of the particular branch.  The normal method of working was to run as an unfitted goods, class K, irrespective of wether the stock was continuously braked.  So, the train would be marshalled according to where each vehicle was destined, simple at, for example, Wallingford, but a bit more to it at Fairford, where some sidings were facing in the outward bound direction and traffic for them had to be carried to the terminus and run around before the shunt could take place.  

 

On my blt I use this as an excuse to bring freight in, drop some off and pick some up, but leave with some of the vehicles I came in with, which provides for instance an open or two with plank loads from a sawmill further down the branch.

Edited January 7, 2017 by The Johnster

[gwrrob]

http://www.staffordrailwaycircle.org.uk/exhibition/

 

I see our esteemed leader is down for being in the demo area here.I wonder if he can fix my poor running ,noisy pannier.

[jwealleans]

Way back on page 509 I mentioned some etches Tony was kind enough to give me and asked about their origin. I'm no closer to knowing any more about the kit or its originator, but it is now in a condition to run.

 

 

Externally complete, once the interiors and couplings are added it will be ready for trials on Grantham. The twin carriages in the etch were not themselves a genuine artic set, so a Lavatory Composite from J & M Models, a contemporary manufacturer, has been added to make up a GN Diagram 218K triplet.

 

The etches are of their time, I have no doubt we'd do better now (the windows on the CL are far too narrow, for example) but I'm pleased with it and it's made into a characterful little set of layout vehicles.

Edited July 11, 2018 by jwealleans

[ROY@34F]

As always, thanks Mike.

 

What I tend to do more these days is find prototype pictures of a variety of goods trains, taken around about the time I'm modelling, replicate those as well as I can and attempt to lamp the locos up accordingly.

 

Speaking of lamps on model locos (which has been discussed before), little destroys the illusion of reality to me as a model loco heading a train, and the loco carries no lamps. I agree, if any lamps displayed are misshapen, blobby and way over-scale, then what is worse? I've seen some recently which are just that, and they look awful. Worse than no lamps at all? Perhaps.

 

I presume no signalman would allow a train to proceed unless it were carrying the correct lamp code (and a tail lamp as well).

 

219.3 - 60085 3.5.58.jpg

 

There is, of course, the exception to every rule. Clearly MANNA is light engine in this shot at York, taken in May 1958. Yet, it's carrying an 'ordinary' passenger lamp code. It's not going to York shed right at this point because it's in forward gear. Has it just come off a local passenger train, is now running forward to clear a road and then will reverse back to 50A? Or, has it left the shed, run through the station and is about to cross over to the Up side in readiness to take out a southbound 'ord' to Selby/Doncaster or Leeds? 

 

Selecting pictures for captioning for forthcoming books, I've just been going through loads taken at Grantham. In almost every case, where a loco change is taking place or has taken place, the locos are displaying Class 1 (A) lamps, whether going forward or in reverse. I've found only two examples where the correct light-engine code (one in the middle above the coupling) is carried in the direction the loco's going and a correct tail lamp (one above either buffer) is carried in the direction the loco's going. Was this sort of thing common practice where locos didn't have to travel a great distance between the shed and their duties? 

 

 

You've said it there Tony in your last sentence. As long as there's a lamp on each end, it didn't matter where it was, unless you were going a fair way. e.g. light engine from Grantham loco to Highdyke, a frequent move of course, we didn't bother about correct light engine head code. The same applied light engine from Top shed KingsCross to KX station or vice versa. In each case quoted, three signal boxes were involved, so it wasn't just "in station limits".

Rules were made to be bent ! very much so up the Standby branch.

 

Kind Regards, Roy. 

[Tony Wright]

http://www.staffordrailwaycircle.org.uk/exhibition/

 

I see our esteemed leader is down for being in the demo area here.I wonder if he can fix my poor running ,noisy pannier.

Robin,

 

I'll do my best. Please, bring it along and I'll take a look at it. 

 

I man a demonstration stand and a loco clinic. If I'm able to fix a dud loco, a small donation to charity is requested. 

[Tony Wright]

Tony

 

On the subject on getting the right angle and the comparative size of cameras, have you tried using a modern camera phone? Whilst they, I assume, are not as sopshisticated as dslr cameras, they tend to be 7+mega pixels in terms of Images and often the camera lens is right at the top of the phone and hence can be placed pretty much flush to the baseboard

 

David

Good idea David,

 

It's just that I don't really have a mobile phone, let alone one with a camera in it. 

 

I'll borrow one and give it a go. 

[mullie]

Robin,, an exhibition I hope to get to for the firdt time 

 

I'll do my best. Please, bring it along and I'll take a look at it. 

 

I man a demonstration stand and a loco clinic. If I'm able to fix a dud loco, a small donation to charity is requested. 

I've also seen Sirs name down for Southampton later this month so he is well travelled and hopefully knows about it. 

 

Martyn

[St Enodoc]

Basically any engine - within reasonable limits - could start a freight train and keep it moving on all but steep rising gradients.  But stopping such a train was a different matter, especially stopping it from a higher speed - hence more continuously braked wagons = higher classification = better stopping power in most circumstances (= higher permissible speeds where/when such things were published).

Hence the comment many years ago by an Inspecting Officer of Railways to the railway companies that "your right to speed is governed by your power to stop".

[St Enodoc]

Re light engine lamps, I think we have a classic case of what the book says versus what happens in practice. In my formative years on the railway I lost count of the number of times I was told: 'Look lad - if we tried to work exactly as per the Rule Book we'd never run any trains'. That was the polite version!

Which is why "working to rule" can cause such disruption.

[Clive Mortimore]

A question to Tony and other model photographers, how do I stop losing the detail off the model. The roof hatches have lost their detail, all the white has blurred into one entity, there are hinges etc on the hatches. The loco is a Hornby class 47 converted to a class 48.

 

 

You can just about see them in this photo.

 

If I was going to make a mistake a tenner for a Hornby engine that can be made to look semi-good would not be a problem. No way would I try a conversion on a Bachy or Heljan loco at today's prices.

[The Stationmaster]

I may have misread the above but it seems that typical modellers random shunting of wagons from all over the length of a train is not correct even if it can make things more interesting?

 

Would the typical modellers 'branch line' goods have been assembled as cuts of wagons that could be shunted easily regardless of whether fitted or not?

 

Martyn

 

Going beyond the 'Johnster's' the simple answer is formed in station order for ease of detaching - and usually 'easy' detaching was of the front but it could be off the rear and inevitably don't forget most freight trips shunted into trailing sidings or shunted the trailing connections which matched their direction of travel at a station with sidings which trailed in both directions.  Very often study of a signalling diagram will be helpful in explaining how particular places and layouts were designed to be shunted although through stations which tended to 'make' important traffic such as perishables could often also be shunted by through trains as well as their trip working.

 

So for through stations one important feature of freight working was that traffic to them had to be routed through a particular yard in order to get int on a trip which shunted a particular way round.  On the GWR routes and the final marshalling point was nominated for all stations served by a local trip and sometimes it could seem a bit illogical as it wasn't necessarily the nearest yard -no doubt the same applied on all the other companies/BR Regions.

 

An example I always quote is my local branchline - the trip, usually worked by a 2251 0-6-0 came from the nearest mainline yard (for once) and had to reverse at the branch junction where it usually shunted inwards traffic into the goods yard before it set off down the branch - so traffic for that place would be formed front leaving the yard.  On its way down the branch it assed the first intermediate station as its siding trailed in the opposite direction but stopped to put off loads and collect empties at the second intermediate station (coal class traffic only in later years) so the traffic for that station needed to be front for ease of shunting which meant it was formed rear leaving the original yard to take account of the reversal.  Traffic for our terminus, which was always quite busy with freight would now be formed front on arrival because once the engine had run round it would be at the right end to shunt into the various sidings.  Traffic for the other intermediate station was formed front on leaving the terminus so would have been rear on arrival, i..e. immediately next to traffic for the junction station.

 

Now an easy way to do things.  In the early 1970s after most local freight sidings had shut the siding at Pontlottyn station in the Rhymney Valley was used to load small coal being recovered from a tip.  The siding trailed in into the Down direction so it was shunted by a a train coming down the valley, in fact the night time freight trip to Rhymney.  The siding at Pontlottyn was a filthy mess and poorly lit and the subject of complaints so one night I accompanied the trip to have a look for myself - and made the job worse than ever for the staff doing the work because their usual method of working couldn't be applied.  the train ran as Class 9, unfitted, and the wagons being used were also unfitted so there had to be a brakevan on the rear.  But to simplify the shunting and save a  bit of time the unofficial method of working was to come down from Rhymney with the empties behind the brake, stop short and go in to pick up the loads then draw forward and set the whole train back into the siding and cut off the empties - and away.  Alas  suffered a temporary case of deafness and amnesia so never did anything about the alleged normal method of doing the job and of course I hadn't seen it anyway so didn't have any proof that it was going on - and in any case it was a falling gradient all the way from Rhymney and i'm sure they (probably) counted the wagons.

[chris p bacon]

I've also seen Sirs name down for Southampton later this month so he is well travelled and hopefully knows about it. 

 

Martyn

And at Biggleswade for the EBMRS show on February 18th.

 

 

A shameless plug I realise.....

[TrevorP1]

Going beyond the 'Johnster's' the simple answer is formed in station order for ease of detaching - and usually 'easy' detaching was of the front but it could be off the rear and inevitably don't forget most freight trips shunted into trailing sidings or shunted the trailing connections which matched their direction of travel at a station with sidings which trailed in both directions.  Very often study of a signalling diagram will be helpful in explaining how particular places and layouts were designed to be shunted although through stations which tended to 'make' important traffic such as perishables could often also be shunted by through trains as well as their trip working.

 

 

Thanks Mike. I love all these stories about how these things were done on the ground, official and unofficial. People working together, real 'railway work'.

[coachmann]

When everything else goes round and round, the daily goods provides the operational aspect, more particularly at wayside through stations. It might be assumed the station one is modelling was shunted by trains in either direction and so research will be well rewarded. I was surprised to learn that Carrog's goods yard (Llangollen line) had to be served by Down trains only, the opposite to the track plan. It means that the loco had to run round its train before doing the shunt. I am guessing the safety aspect was that the driver would not accidentally set off in the opposite direction of travel towards Llangollen with only half his train or no brake van or with the brake van in the wrong place. The layout also ensured the loco was always positioned to prevent wagons running away down the falling gradient towards Glyndyfrdwy. Railway modellers are sometimes accused of taking their hobby too seriously, but to my mind, if one isn't modelling the real railway, one must by definition be playing trains.

Edited January 8, 2017 by coachmann

[jrg1]

A question to Tony and other model photographers, how do I stop losing the detail off the model. The roof hatches have lost their detail, all the white has blurred into one entity, there are hinges etc on the hatches. The loco is a Hornby class 47 converted to a class 48.

 

013rm.jpg

 

009 demu.jpg

You can just about see them in this photo.

 

If I was going to make a mistake a tenner for a Hornby engine that can be made to look semi-good would not be a problem. No way would I try a conversion on a Bachy or Heljan loco at today's prices.

Can you describe the class 48 conversion, please?

[Clive Mortimore]

Can you describe the class 48 conversion, please?

Hi jrg1

 

I have done so on my Rough Engineering Made Easy thread http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/62561-rough-engineering-made-easy-class-48-conversion/?p=2560922

 

The most difficult part was finding photos showing the roof details and then doing the drawing. It is not 100% accurate as the drawing is as good as I could estimate from the photos. I bet next week someone will say "I have a class 48 works drawing".

[92220]

This is great stuff Iain; very well done. 

 

If I've been only a tiny, tiny bit instrumental in your making of such wonderful models, then the spirit is lifted. 

 

Now, with regard to extra ballast/weight where it's needed: though the Belpaire 'box on the Scot is narrow at the bottom, it does widen out towards the top. Strips of lead should then be able to be glued into the inner sides and not touch the motor. Occasionally, a strip of lead will fit underneath the top as well. Or, you could use 'fluid lead' (or whatever it's called - liquid lead/liquid gravity?) There's usually space between the frames underneath the motor to squeeze in an 'ingot' or so of lead. And, don't forget the underneath of the cab roof. A quite sizeable strip of lead can be accommodated there.

 

As you suggest as well, having the front of the tender transfer weight to the back of the loco also works. I've tried all of these and they work. A coil spring on the bogie pivot also works; in two ways. For one, it transfers weight towards the rear and two, it usually helps the bogie to ride better as well.

 

Thank you, Tony. Rest assured that you have been considerably more than a tiny bit instrumental, and I'm most grateful.

 

The dismantled Scot photo isn't all that clear, sorry. I've got a compression spring on the front bogie, and some lead between the frames where I can. It's good advice to try a strip either side of the motor and also, if I can, on the underside of the cab roof. I'll do those and report back.

 

If I do try to hang the tender off the back of the loco, I assume that I need to make the front two tender axles floating?

 

Many thanks,

 

Iain

[jrg1]

Thank you, Tony. Rest assured that you have been considerably more than a tiny bit instrumental, and I'm most grateful.

 

The dismantled Scot photo isn't all that clear, sorry. I've got a compression spring on the front bogie, and some lead between the frames where I can. It's good advice to try a strip either side of the motor and also, if I can, on the underside of the cab roof. I'll do those and report back.

 

If I do try to hang the tender off the back of the loco, I assume that I need to make the front two tender axles floating?

 

Many thanks,

 

Iain

The Perseverance LMS tender chassis has the front two axles mounted on a free bogie, and the rear axle fixed.  The tender coupling hangs on the locomotive drawbar-a simple arrangement for load transfer