David Bigcheeseplant Posted March 25, 2013 Share Posted March 25, 2013 Ally Pally seemed less busy than previous years due I expect to the snow. I do wish that the layout of the show was improved as there seemed to be no logic and a real mish mash to the placing of layouts and trade, and layouts could be missed due to being tucked away in odd corners. Why for intance was there two tool traders very close together. David Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
iL Dottore Posted March 25, 2013 Share Posted March 25, 2013 Ally Pally was my first (and probably last) exhibition as an "exhibitor" (albeit as only a locum). I did manage to see a little of the layouts on display and managed to get key items from the traders. And whilst there was certainly enough variety in layouts and traders, the west hall (location of BCB) did seem to be a bit of an afterthought to what could be considered the "main event" in the main hall. I am also surprised that Warners, as a major sponsor, did not set up shop in the main hall. Brightspark mentioned the catering, and indeed my late Saturday breakfast sausage sarni and my Saturday afternoon "tea-break" beer were good indeed, alas the same could not be said of the meals provided to the exhibitors. Low-grade industrial catering is the most charitable description I can give of it (horrifyingly, Geoff and John from BCB informed me that this was some of the better catering they had encountered as exhibitors!). Frustratingly, the prices posted for the "cottage pie" (Saturday) and the "steak pie" (Sunday) were no different to those posted for a number of items sold by the food outlets in the main hall - but the exhibitor's meals were of a considerably inferior standard to that of the food outlets in the main hall. I know that there is a limited budget for feeding the exhibitors, but surely whomever organised the meals, could have negotiated something suitable with one of the food outlets in the main hall. But what really wound me up was the drinks policy - exhibitors got vouchers for tea and "coffee" (posted price £1.70) however, under NO circumstances you could get a bottle of mineral water (posted price £1.50) instead of tea or "coffee". Why on earth couldn't you get a cheaper substitute? Finally, whilst the show itself was well organised and enjoyable (so well done MRC and Warners), I found Ally Pally - outside the main hall - to be very grubby and shabby indeed: multiple rips in stairwell carpets, repaired with black gaffer tape; ice-cold, unheated loos reminiscent of Stubby47s finest creations; scuffed, chipped and dirty paintwork, etc. etc. Hardly what I would expect of a premier location. Overall, the show was great, but with a number of caveats. iD Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Ian J. Posted March 25, 2013 RMweb Premium Share Posted March 25, 2013 I popped over to AP yesterday. It seemed to have fewer layouts this year and fewer specialist traders, so consequently it did feel a bit lightweight for the £11 entry fee. The layouts were of reasonable to good standard though. It was a bit quieter than years past and I expect that's due to the wintery weather. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
-missy- Posted March 25, 2013 Share Posted March 25, 2013 But what really wound me up was the drinks policy - exhibitors got vouchers for tea and "coffee" (posted price £1.70) however, under NO circumstances you could get a bottle of mineral water (posted price £1.50) instead of tea or "coffee". Why on earth couldn't you get a cheaper substitute? iD I agree, its a bit frustrating when you dont drink Tea or Coffee... Missy. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bbishop Posted March 25, 2013 Share Posted March 25, 2013 Ally Pally was my first (and probably last) exhibition as an "exhibitor" (albeit as only a locum). iD, never say never! It's useful to know the location of a tame operator on the continent. Sorry I missed you at Ally Pally, but your laboratory is a gem. But where was the still? When I was an undergraduate we ran a distillery in the far corner of the Organic Chemistry lab. Ok, the chemists may have been boring but, sure, we were always invited to parties! Bill Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Stationmaster Posted March 25, 2013 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 25, 2013 That fold -out 'guide' - I was a bit surprised to be handed a long rectangular sheet of paper as i was waiting to go in but quickly found that it unfolded to give a list layouts/traders and a plan of the show. No sign of a show guide book but these seem in any case to be increasingly rare commodities (Warley is the major exception in my experience although some other shows also do good ones) and this is hardly surprising when you consider the costs of producing glossy multiple page brochures. So exhibition organisers are left with a choice - do a glossy brochure and charge for it (and put up with the moans and groans if you charge enough to cover its costs or get some sponsors) or do something else. Now I rather liked the Ally Pally 'something else - it was free (as it should be), it was about 100 times simpler to use as a guide to find things than many exhibition guides tend to be, the paper being slightly matt allowed me with my specs on in a well lit hall to actually be able to read the print, and it didn't take up any room to carry. So we just used it as I presume it was meant to be used - to find things we particularly wanted to see or visit - and it was ideal for that. Now back to glossy guides. I think that if you make up your mind to do one you have to do it properly. Kenton is famous (or is it infamous? ) on here for his regular comment about provision, or lack of, layout plans but he has a very good point - the best way to understand a layout is to see a plan of it. But assembling and possibly redrawing those is time and money for the organisers - whoever they are. Folk also want pics - they too need to be obtained, correctly sorted and so on and before you know it a large exhibition guide is a major printing job, which the punters will demand to be 'on decent paper' - but then think it should be in the entrance price. So the admission price is increased by several £s to cover the cost of the guidebook, and then people moan about the exhibition entry cost being too much. Sorry - but if you want a guide you pay for it, I'm very happy with the sort of thing we got at Ally Pally this year as it's what I really need to help me find my way around the show. For pre-information 'do a Basingstoke' and put tasters, and layout plans if available, on the show's website - so I can see what's going to be there before I arrive. And If I want a full guidebook I'll buy one - but I'm still trying to disencumber myself of ones going back to exhibitions of many years ago, via the recycling bin. I shall now retire to my bunker and don steel helmet. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Jason T Posted March 25, 2013 RMweb Premium Share Posted March 25, 2013 I should have added that the shot of the Black Five isn't mine, it was taken by Tim (the proud owner of said loco). I might have been instrumental in it's appearance though Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisf Posted March 25, 2013 Share Posted March 25, 2013 Flavio's comments above are of great interest. Years of visting shows have taught me to expect nothing, or at least very little, where catering is concerned. I happen to think that anything more than £1 for tea or coffee is a rip-off given the minimal skill required to add water to a teabag or equivalent in a cardboard cup and leave the customer to find his own milk but then I'm a tight fisted git and don't care who knows it. My normal modus operandi is to have a good breakfast either before I set out or on the way to the show, avoiding motorway service areas wherever possible, and make my own sandwiches: why pay £2+ for two slices of bread, unspecified emulsion masquerading as butter and arty farty filling when an entire loaf may be had for less than 50p? I would have hoped that exhibitors are gven slightly better treatment than paying customers as far as fodder is concerned but thus far I have not experienced the vagaries of show cuisine. Lucky lucky me? As for last time as an exhibitor, every time I swung by BCB there was Flavio, controller in hand and smile on face, thriving at having been thrust in at the deep end and apparently enjoying every minute! Sure, Ally Pally has seen better days as a venue but I reckon that its touch of decrepitude is all part of the charm. I wouldn't like to see the owners spend megabucks on sprucing it up and retrieving the cost from patrons! Chris Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon020 Posted March 25, 2013 Share Posted March 25, 2013 Martyn You were most welcome!! To add to Martyn's pics here are a few more of Essex Belt Lines inc setting up on Friday http://www.flickr.com/photos/13460546@N02/sets/72157633077425946/ Cheers Dan Dan, we enjoyed watching the operations early on on saturday and whilst I was stood in front of you for a while and intended to say "hi", you were quite occupied with what I took to be driver training... another operator being given some clear concise instructions on shunting (switching?) ... so I left you too it. My son loved watching the extreme length of the trains; somethign we don't really see on UK lines. Hope you had a good weekend... and all worked well successfully. Jon Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timara Posted March 25, 2013 Share Posted March 25, 2013 I should have added that the shot of the Black Five isn't mine, it was taken by Tim (the proud owner of said loco). I might have been instrumental in it's appearance though Not to mention the 60 the following day Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Stationmaster Posted March 25, 2013 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 25, 2013 Not to mention the 60 the following day Well at least it wasn't blue Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
warbonnetuk Posted March 25, 2013 Share Posted March 25, 2013 Jon Glad you and your son enjoyed our layout and apologies for not paying better attention to the watching public ;-) Weekend was v good considering we hadn't run the entire set-up together in that size before. That it ran so well is a testament to the work of the module owners While it isn't the same size (yet) as the offering at AP I'll have my 'Seaboard Southern' hat at the Crawley MRS show at Tanbridge School, Horsham on 13/14th April where we'll have our HO modular set up running (28' x 8'). Cheers Dan Dan, we enjoyed watching the operations early on on saturday and whilst I was stood in front of you for a while and intended to say "hi", you were quite occupied with what I took to be driver training... another operator being given some clear concise instructions on shunting (switching?) ... so I left you too it. My son loved watching the extreme length of the trains; somethign we don't really see on UK lines. Hope you had a good weekend... and all worked well successfully. Jon Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Delamar Posted March 25, 2013 Share Posted March 25, 2013 a few snaps, I didnt take many as i have already taken shots of some of the layouts at other shows. overall it was a great weekend and a very enjoyable show, thanks to all involved. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baby Deltic Posted March 25, 2013 Share Posted March 25, 2013 This is the first year that I've actually missed the show. Regrettably with bad weather and my father's recent death I wasn't in the mood to drive all the way to Muswell Hill. Looks like it was a very good show. On the plus side, I saved a lot of money by not going on the usual Ally Pally spendathon. More money for those class 16's when they appear. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
trisonic Posted March 25, 2013 Share Posted March 25, 2013 That viaduct by Johnny Gringo on BCB is my "Model of the Year"! Best, Pete. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
glo41f Posted March 25, 2013 Share Posted March 25, 2013 I thought it was a great show with some really stunning layouts. 82G was amazing in its extended form as was Leavesden. Lots of talk too which is one of the hobby's better features.It is lovely to compare notes with others of like mind. Copenhagen Fields is totally awesome and a real work of art. I hope that it is recognised for what it is by future generations. My companion and I found the catering very good too. We were not tempted to spend anything as there was not much there for us 7mm types. There were lots of folk buying though so I hope the traders were happy. I really wonder how such a show can be done for the money which I think is very reasonable especially if you book in advance. I still got clobbered by shoulder bags! I also noticed that there were not too many children present which does not bode well for the future. Regards Martin Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium John M Upton Posted March 25, 2013 RMweb Premium Share Posted March 25, 2013 I also noticed that there were not too many children present which does not bode well for the future. Waiting outside (in the freezing cold) in the huddle outside the main doors prior to being let into the Palm Court on Saturday morning I looked around and realised that I was one of the youngest people there waiting, and I am 38!!! Not wishing to start a debate but it does seem to have become very much an old mans hobby now. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Stubby47 Posted March 25, 2013 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 25, 2013 That viaduct by Johnny Gringo on BCB is my "Model of the Year"! Best, Pete. Oh dear, you're going to be in someone's bad books.... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pacific231G Posted March 25, 2013 Share Posted March 25, 2013 what really wound me up was the drinks policy - exhibitors got vouchers for tea and "coffee" (posted price £1.70) however, under NO circumstances you could get a bottle of mineral water (posted price £1.50) instead of tea or "coffee". Why on earth couldn't you get a cheaper substitute? You could. The caterers were happy to fill my bottle (ex London Olympics) with drinking water for free and London water is pretty good. The answer on bottled water is possibly because they have to buy it in wholesale for maybe 30-40p a bottle whereas the marginal cost of tea or coffee, once you've got the urns going, is only a few pence though I've no idea what the organisers had to pay the caterers for that. Finally, whilst the show itself was well organised and enjoyable (so well done MRC and Warners), I found Ally Pally - outside the main hall - to be very grubby and shabby indeed: multiple rips in stairwell carpets, repaired with black gaffer tape; ice-cold, unheated loos reminiscent of Stubby47s finest creations; scuffed, chipped and dirty paintwork, etc. etc. Hardly what I would expect of a premier location. I didn't notice the unheated loos, the ones I used seemed fine, but maybe we used different ones. Despite being a bit faded- a bit more faded now than when the show first went there- Ally Pally does have a certain grandeur and the location on Muswell Hill is magnificent- especially when you can see London laid out before you which you couldn't yesterday. It's easily my favourite of the regular show venues so my plea to the MRC and Warners is:- . Please please please please please don't move the show to Excel. I've been there twice in the past six weeks for trade shows and I loathe that place almost as much as I do the NEC. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
trisonic Posted March 25, 2013 Share Posted March 25, 2013 Oh dear, you're going to be in someone's bad books.... Sorry Stu, It was a damn close run thing! Plus I'm hoping John will send me a detail from the drawings he made (for the wall off my office)....... Best, Pete. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Ian J. Posted March 25, 2013 RMweb Premium Share Posted March 25, 2013 ...I also noticed that there were not too many children present which does not bode well for the future. Regards Martin Waiting outside (in the freezing cold) in the huddle outside the main doors prior to being let into the Palm Court on Saturday morning I looked around and realised that I was one of the youngest people there waiting, and I am 38!!! Not wishing to start a debate but it does seem to have become very much an old mans hobby now. I think the winter conditions played a very important part in keeping away the families, though there were a few there yesterday (Sunday), so I wouldn't take this year's attendence pattern as anything other than an exception, much like the weather itself. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Stationmaster Posted March 25, 2013 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 25, 2013 You could. The caterers were happy to fill my bottle (ex London Olympics) with drinking water for free and London water is pretty good. The answer on bottled water is possibly because they have to buy it in wholesale for maybe 30-40p a bottle whereas the marginal cost of tea or coffee, once you've got the urns going, is only a few pence though I've no idea what the organisers had to pay the caterers for that. I didn't notice the unheated loos, the ones I used seemed fine, but maybe we used different ones. Despite being a bit faded- a bit more faded now than when the show first went there- Ally Pally does have a certain grandeur and the location on Muswell Hill is magnificent- especially when you can see London laid out before you which you couldn't yesterday. It's easily my favourite of the regular show venues so my plea to the MRC and Warners is:- . Please please please please please don't move the show to Excel. I've been there twice in the past six weeks for trade shows and I loathe that place almost as much as I do the NEC. In my experience Excel is far worse than the NEC, and a lot more difficult to get to despite being nearer to my home! Incidentally I had an excellent cup of tea in the catering are immediately next to the smaller hall, one of the best cuppas I have ever had at a catering outlet at an exhibition centre. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium 2ManySpams Posted March 25, 2013 RMweb Premium Share Posted March 25, 2013 That viaduct by Johnny Gringo on BCB is my "Model of the Year"! Best, Pete. Hi Pete - a correction for you.... John drew up the viaduct plans BUT Andy Banks constructed the model. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Nile Posted March 25, 2013 RMweb Premium Share Posted March 25, 2013 A few more pics of layouts I've not seen posted here yet (I hope). Leavesden - O scale NSE , as featured recently in Model Rail. Valleyfields - 4mm EM gauge LNWR . Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
trisonic Posted March 25, 2013 Share Posted March 25, 2013 That viaduct on BCB; drawn up by Johnny Gringo and built by Andy Banks is my 2013 "Model of the Year"! Respect! No offence to the other fine builders of this beautiful layout (and toilets)........ Best, Pete. PS That is what comes from leering from 4,000 miles away, apologies to Andy..... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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