RMweb Premium Hippo Posted April 27, 2019 RMweb Premium Share Posted April 27, 2019 I have had an e-mail from Ultrascale this morning to let me know they had reached the minimum to produce anther run of EM gauge wheel sets for the chain drive Sentinel Quote Dear Customer, The Hornby 'Sentinels' for EM gauge, have now reached the required batch run quantity. As you showed interest in this item, you are getting this email to find out if you are still interested and would like to order this conversion. If you do then please let me know and I will email the 'Special order code' required for you to place your order. The batch run will be started once I have confirmed orders from all customers that showed interest. Please note that this conversion is for the Hornby 'Sentinel' WITHOUT the outside cranks. Also it is for the EM version ONLY and that this will be the last batch run of this conversion. Once this batch is done no more will be produced In case any one is interested, now is the time to contact them Thanks Owen 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stoker Posted May 2, 2019 Share Posted May 2, 2019 On 03/04/2018 at 18:43, rprodgers said: Is the Hornby model of the Sentinel the same as were used in the China clay industry in Cornwall Denise, Sharon? The chain drive version is a good fit for P403D "Denise", although there were a few minor detail differences. It was fitted with railings instead of side panels, the brake gear was run behind the wheels rather than in front of them, it didn't have the air vents on the roof, and by the time it was in service with ECC it'd lost it's sentinel swords. In vacuum braked form it had a vac tank on the right hand side of the engine, in air braked form the vac tank was removed and it had an air compressor compartment added on the left hand side of the engine. The locomotive was delivered new to British Steel in 1960, who painted it orange, with yellow stepwells, black valances, and wasp striped buffer beams. ECC bought it in 1970, and they retained the British Steel paint scheme, although the shade of orange varied over the years from high-vis to ochre. P401D "Sharon" was an English Electric Vulcan Foundry 0-4-0. To the best of my knowledge, nobody has made a kit of this type yet. As far as I know, ECC only owned one other Sentinel, an 0-6-0 which they operated at one of their stone quarries outside of Cornwall. This was later divested to CAMAS. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium rprodgers Posted May 2, 2019 RMweb Premium Share Posted May 2, 2019 Thanks Stoker for such an informative reply Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1722 Posted May 19, 2019 Share Posted May 19, 2019 Potentially odd question here. I own a Sentinel that is not the outside crank version. Do people think it would be possible/viable to turn it into the outside crank version? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon A Posted May 19, 2019 Share Posted May 19, 2019 58 minutes ago, 1722 said: Potentially odd question here. I own a Sentinel that is not the outside crank version. Do people think it would be possible/viable to turn it into the outside crank version? As far as I know they are different wheel bases. Gordon A 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1722 Posted May 19, 2019 Share Posted May 19, 2019 5 hours ago, Gordon A said: As far as I know they are different wheel bases. Gordon A Appreciate the help. Thanks. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Michael Edge Posted May 19, 2019 RMweb Premium Share Posted May 19, 2019 Different wheelbase, wheel diameter and platform/ buffer beam width. The buffer beams are an entirely different shape as well. Cab and casings are the same. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stoker Posted May 22, 2019 Share Posted May 22, 2019 @Michael Edge have you ever considered doing a dress-up kit for the Hornby Sentinel? Valence overlays, pipe railings, side filler fuel tank, air compressor box and intake, behind-wheel brake linkage overlay, etc.? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steamport Southport Posted May 22, 2019 Share Posted May 22, 2019 Don't RT Models already do the valences? https://www.rtmodels.co.uk/rt_models_023.htm Jason 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stoker Posted May 22, 2019 Share Posted May 22, 2019 22 minutes ago, Steamport Southport said: Don't RT Models already do the valences? https://www.rtmodels.co.uk/rt_models_023.htm Jason They do but they don't have sandbox covers. If you gain seamless valances but lose sandbox covers, that feels like a net zero to me. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Michael Edge Posted May 23, 2019 RMweb Premium Share Posted May 23, 2019 8 hours ago, Stoker said: @Michael Edge have you ever considered doing a dress-up kit for the Hornby Sentinel? Valence overlays, pipe railings, side filler fuel tank, air compressor box and intake, behind-wheel brake linkage overlay, etc.? Not really but we do have etched n/s swords and "Sentinel" for £3 a set. We don't do the full brake linkage even in our kit since it was designed to use a motor bogie - the Sentinel brake linkage is actually rather complicated. Open handrails would only be wire and the various boxes you mention differ greatly from one to loco to another. The Hornby model is not really a suitable base for the rod drive version as I have explained earlier. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold RThompson Posted May 24, 2019 RMweb Gold Share Posted May 24, 2019 On 22 May 2019 at 23:50, Stoker said: They do but they don't have sandbox covers. If you gain seamless valances but lose sandbox covers, that feels like a net zero to me. The spill plates below the sandbox filler openings are included on the etch. For the sandboxes, just reuse the originals by cutting them off and filing the face down slightly. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stoker Posted May 24, 2019 Share Posted May 24, 2019 On 23/05/2019 at 01:41, Michael Edge said: Not really but we do have etched n/s swords and "Sentinel" for £3 a set. We don't do the full brake linkage even in our kit since it was designed to use a motor bogie - the Sentinel brake linkage is actually rather complicated. Open handrails would only be wire and the various boxes you mention differ greatly from one to loco to another. The Hornby model is not really a suitable base for the rod drive version as I have explained earlier. A fair enough answer. I will backtrack through the thread to read your impressions on the rod drive version. 6 hours ago, RThompson said: The spill plates below the sandbox filler openings are included on the etch. For the sandboxes, just reuse the originals by cutting them off and filing the face down slightly. My apologies, I was under the impression that they weren't included. In that case I will likely order a set or two as I've got quite a few sentinels planned. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Porcy Mane Posted May 24, 2019 Share Posted May 24, 2019 (edited) On 19/05/2019 at 23:19, Michael Edge said: Different wheelbase, wheel diameter and platform/ buffer beam width. The buffer beams are an entirely different shape as well. Cab and casings are the same. On 23/05/2019 at 06:41, Michael Edge said: The Hornby model is not really a suitable base for the rod drive version as I have explained earlier. Could you elaborate please. The reason I ask is the Hornby Rod Drive I have, utilises a totally different chassis casting. The axle centres are higher in the frame to accommodate the larger 14mm wheels (as opposed to correct 12 mm dia in the chain drive) thus maintaining correct buffer height. The buffer/drag beams have different shape cutouts to the chain drive chassis as per prototype. I can't confirm the correct wheelbase at the mo as my rod drive is away on its holidays checking electrical continuity on mates P4 layout but the measured axle hole centres on the dummy side frames are at 24 mm centres so I suspect the wheelbase is correct at 6' 0" as opposed to the chain drive's 6' 6". I'll ring my pal later so that he can confirm the wheelbase. EDIT: Just read back through my notes when I converted my rod drive to P4. The wheelbase is correct at 24 mm. https://paulbartlett.zenfolio.com/industriallocomotive/h12FDA580#h12fda580 https://flic.kr/p/qzmgzx P Edited May 24, 2019 by Porcy Mane Spilling etc. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
decauville1126 Posted May 24, 2019 Share Posted May 24, 2019 2 hours ago, Porcy Mane said: Could you elaborate please. 2 hours ago, Porcy Mane said: EDIT: Just read back through my notes when I converted my rod drive to P4. The wheelbase is correct at 24 mm. I may have asked this before (?) but I'm sure your method of P4'ing the rod-coupled version would be of great interest to many, even if it was images of hand-written sketches. Thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold RThompson Posted May 24, 2019 RMweb Gold Share Posted May 24, 2019 8 hours ago, Porcy Mane said: Could you elaborate please. The reason I ask is the Hornby Rod Drive I have, utilises a totally different chassis casting. The axle centres are higher in the frame to accommodate the larger 14mm wheels (as opposed to correct 12 mm dia in the chain drive) thus maintaining correct buffer height. The buffer/drag beams have different shape cutouts to the chain drive chassis as per prototype. I can't confirm the correct wheelbase at the mo as my rod drive is away on its holidays checking electrical continuity on mates P4 layout but the measured axle hole centres on the dummy side frames are at 24 mm centres so I suspect the wheelbase is correct at 6' 0" as opposed to the chain drive's 6' 6". I'll ring my pal later so that he can confirm the wheelbase. EDIT: Just read back through my notes when I converted my rod drive to P4. The wheelbase is correct at 24 mm. https://paulbartlett.zenfolio.com/industriallocomotive/h12FDA580#h12fda580 https://flic.kr/p/qzmgzx P Also the footplate is correctly wider on the rod version. However Hornby DID make a mistake in where they made the skirts symmetrical, they should be asymmetrical which my etches are correct for this. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Porcy Mane Posted May 25, 2019 Share Posted May 25, 2019 On 24/05/2019 at 14:03, decauville1126 said: I may have asked this before (?) but I'm sure your method of P4'ing the rod-coupled version would be of great interest to many, even if it was images of hand-written sketches. Thanks. You have. Further to the linked post these two phots should make things clearer. A brief explanation of the adaptor used on George Watts pullers to remove the Black Beetle wheels whilst keeping axle pin points intact is here. 22 hours ago, RThompson said: Also the footplate is correctly wider on the rod version. Thanks for the reminder Robert. I think we gave that a mention way earlier in the thread. P 3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SDJR7F88 Posted November 13, 2019 Share Posted November 13, 2019 A short running session featuring the superb Hornby Outer-Crank Sentinel, "Barabel" in smart lined Maroon, with Wasp-Strips, edited with Real Sound. Sounds are provided by a number of similar class members from my sound collection, captured at various Gala and Preserved Railways over the past few years. Hope you enjoy! 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sleepyrider Posted November 18, 2019 Share Posted November 18, 2019 @SDJR7F88 love the sound on that video! Must have taken a fair bit of work but well worth it 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SDJR7F88 Posted November 19, 2019 Share Posted November 19, 2019 9 hours ago, sleepyrider said: @SDJR7F88 love the sound on that video! Must have taken a fair bit of work but well worth it Many thanks! Certainly did, especially the coupling up clips. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
montyburns56 Posted December 12, 2019 Share Posted December 12, 2019 I came across these pictures from Abram Disposal Point, Leigh in the late 70s on Flickr which struck me as any easy conversion of the Hornby MSC version. In fact i did wonder if this one originally came from the MSC?? 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Moxy Posted December 12, 2019 RMweb Premium Share Posted December 12, 2019 1 hour ago, montyburns56 said: I came across these pictures from Abram Disposal Point, Leigh in the late 70s on Flickr which struck me as any easy conversion of the Hornby MSC version. In fact i did wonder if this one originally came from the MSC?? That's an interesting question. According to 'The Railways of the Manchester Ship Canal' (Thorpe OPC ISBN 0860932885), none of them were sold direct from MSC to the NCB Opencast Executive. Most of them were sold to Thomas Hill (Rotherham) Ltd, (who had bought Rolls Royce's Sentinel business,) in 1971/72. I wonder if Thomas Hill reconditioned one (or more), and then sold it to NCB Opencast at a later date? The livery certainly looks like it is ex MSC. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold tractionman Posted December 12, 2019 RMweb Gold Share Posted December 12, 2019 (edited) 1 hour ago, Moxy said: The livery certainly looks like it is ex MSC. Was the MSC livery close to NCB blue? Would be a good livery for Hornby to cover for the Sentinel in the future. cheers, Keith Edited December 12, 2019 by tractionman clarity 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold rodent279 Posted March 10, 2020 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 10, 2020 Just to add my two penn'orth, here's ex-MoD 0-8-0 Sentinel no. 610, awaiting restoration at a rainy Bitton, in 2012. And here's the Ribble Steam Railway's 10282 in 2015. Cheers N 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold rodent279 Posted March 10, 2020 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 10, 2020 (edited) Now-can anyone tell me if the Hornby model covers these two:- These are the pair that worked at the Castle Cement terminal at Pitstone, Tring, until the early 1990's. One survives at Rushden. Cheers N Edited March 10, 2020 by rodent279 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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