RMweb Premium melmerby Posted January 6, 2013 RMweb Premium Share Posted January 6, 2013 Hi all I see GWR 2-8-0 No. 2885 in Moor Street is being removed next weekend, presumably by road. See these road closures in Brum: http://www.networkwestmidlands.com/bus/servicechanges/RoadWorks.aspx It had been up for sale for some time so I assume it is not going back to Tyseley. Any idea where it's new home will be? Cheers Keith Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkC Posted January 7, 2013 Share Posted January 7, 2013 Reported elsewhare that the new owner(s) wish to restore it, and that it IS going to Tyseley Mark Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold big jim Posted January 7, 2013 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 7, 2013 it should have moved last year but when they came to move it the crane wasn't big enough, or has a long enough reach to get to it, it has been split for a while ready to move. im in on the sunday hopefully may see it being moved if its not done over night Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coppercap Posted January 7, 2013 Share Posted January 7, 2013 Reported elsewhare that the new owner(s) wish to restore it, and that it IS going to Tyseley Mark If it's going to Tyseley, it's going to be reunited with one of the GWRPG's other locos, namely 4110. It's been there years, some work done on the frames/wheels/axleboxes etc, but nothing done for years. It's still in lots of (rusty) bits........... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium melmerby Posted January 7, 2013 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted January 7, 2013 Why can't it be towed to Tyseley? Put a temporary connection to the running lines. Flood the axleboxes with lube and move it slowly? - Or are the bearings too knackered? The cost of cranes must be pretty high plus the cost of disrupting the centre of Birmingham for two days! Keith Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold big jim Posted January 7, 2013 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 7, 2013 i should imagine the cost of a crane etc would be a lot cheaper than trying to reconnect the line to the mainline, there was a cost being banded round the messroom of what it had already cost the owner for the aborted attempt to remove it which was 5 figures. unfortunatly there is simply no room to get any tracks in between the end of the platform and current sidings anyway, not even a way of getting it dragged to the end of its current severed line and craned over to the track as there is no way of getting a crane down there without coming from bordesley and having to make some sort of roadway/crossing to get it to the right side of the tracks for a lift there is of course a nice kirow crane currently sat in bescot yard which could possibly do the job if they did find a way of getting it moved by rail Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold roundhouse Posted January 7, 2013 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 7, 2013 Whilst the aborted crane hire might be costly, road closures take some weeks to arrange and can be the larger part of the cost with all the operatives employed such a banksmen operative for the road closure management etc. , road haulier and so on. So yes, a five figure sum is easily reached. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Stationmaster Posted January 7, 2013 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 7, 2013 Why can't it be towed to Tyseley? Put a temporary connection to the running lines. Flood the axleboxes with lube and move it slowly? - Or are the bearings too knackered? The cost of cranes must be pretty high plus the cost of disrupting the centre of Birmingham for two days! Keith Did it need to be craned out to load it on a road trailer? Even if it did you could probably still get a suitable crane for under £2,000 or so for the time needed to do the job and even if it cost 5 times that it would still come in a lot cheaper than messing around with a track layout for a day or two and putting it back afterwards let alone adding in the rail haulage charges and necessary arrangements for a very special special moving a loco whivch would probably need a lot of preparation prior to even being examined let alone shifted. Overall I bet the road move saved them a sum well into 5 figures and unless it was going to Tyseley it would still have to be loaded to road anyway. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold big jim Posted January 7, 2013 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 7, 2013 i think its going to take quite a substancial crane to get it out, its got quite a reach to achieve to get above it, grabbed these pics earlier on...... its got to be lifted over basically 3 track spans and down onto moor st queensway which isn't exactly flat! you can get a idea of how steep the road is where the crane will have to sit by looking at the bus in this picture, even if its levelled out the recieving wagon will be on the slope this is a panorama pic of the site which gives a better idea of the task ahead and here is the other end of the track its sat on, walking route right across the end of it as well as gsmr gubbins, lights etc, so a real no no Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold roundhouse Posted January 7, 2013 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 7, 2013 The canopy is also potentially going to get in the way of any lifting. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium phil-b259 Posted January 7, 2013 RMweb Premium Share Posted January 7, 2013 unfortunatly there is simply no room to get any tracks in between the end of the platform and current sidings anyway (ish) Yes that is one of the aspects I found puzling when I saw the reinstated platforms at Moor Street. I mean even if it isn't strictly needed for the current service level there is nothing to stop it doubling up as a stabling road. Thing is with that canopy passengers are potentially better protected from the elements than the other platform currently in use (the one backing onto the through line). Even if it isn't needed now not having room to reconnect it in the future does seem daft. Mind you the station throat looks very 'mimimalistic' too as it doesn't seem to allow parallel arivals and departures either Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RJS1977 Posted January 7, 2013 Share Posted January 7, 2013 The obvious question is - how did it get in? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold big jim Posted January 7, 2013 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 7, 2013 Often wondered that myself Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
roythebus Posted January 7, 2013 Share Posted January 7, 2013 Possibly a giant hand from above, as per the model railway fiddle yard? Mike, you forgot the cost of rail replacement bus services for 2 weekends while the track is altered... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Horsetan Posted January 7, 2013 Share Posted January 7, 2013 It might be Jeremy Hoskin he's acquired a few loco's recently, thats some train set he owns now!! If so, it won't be too long before he owns virtually every mainline-certified engine there is...... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium melmerby Posted January 7, 2013 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted January 7, 2013 If you look at this: http://maps.google.co.uk/maps?q=Birmingham+Moor+Street+Station&hl=en&ll=52.477701,-1.889391&spn=0.001313,0.002411&sll=52.8382,-2.327815&sspn=10.681665,19.753418&oq=moor+street+station&t=h&hq=Birmingham+Moor+Street+Station&radius=15000&z=19 The buffer stop line could be extended into the unused lines fairly easily. Don't forget this was a 4 track formation with parallel fast (Snow Hill) and slow (Moor Street) lines which ran all the way out to Lapworth. It is an extremely difficult site to crane a loco out of and the road disruption is going to horrendous (and expensive) Keith Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coombe Barton Posted January 7, 2013 Share Posted January 7, 2013 Not knowing how they're going to do it, so just speculation - if they jacked it up and slid it sideways first across to the region of the fence there'd be a lot less luff on the jib. In fact, if you took the wall out you'd nearly be able to do the whole job with jacks and beams with the loco ending up on a trailer. More than one way is possible - be interesting to see how they finally do it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold big jim Posted January 7, 2013 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 7, 2013 it may look level from the sky but its certainly not at ground level, not horrendously unlevel but a fair bit of work involved, plus there is the raised concrete walking route with lights, various troughing, and 2 point motors to worry about. i dont think the disruption to traffic will be too bad as the uphill bit of the queensway will still be open from what i can gather, since the remodelling of the road outside of moor st, very little apart from buses uses the downhill bit towards park st Not knowing how they're going to do it, so just speculation - if they jacked it up and slid it sideways first across to the region of the fence there'd be a lot less luff on the jib.what they need is some sort of traverser..........oh wait! http://warwickshirerailways.com/gwr/gwrms1699.htm Don't forget this was a 4 track formation with parallel fast (Snow Hill) and slow (Moor Street) lines which ran all the way out to Lapworth. thats something i'd like to see happen again, traffic on the line out to leamington surely warrants it, if you look at my cab ride video on youtube you will see that there are very few places en route to lapworth where 4 tracks couldn't be reintroduced, station carparks would have to move but other than that the infrustructure is there Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold TheSignalEngineer Posted January 7, 2013 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 7, 2013 Just before it arrived there was an access from the road for construction traffic, so it may have come in that way. Regarding the lines over the viaduct, there were 5 running lines to Bordesley South then 6 to Tyseley South prior to the diversion of traffic to New St in 1967. Even with today's rules there would be room for 4 tracks, although I think that equipment would need moving out of the way at some locations. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium melmerby Posted January 8, 2013 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted January 8, 2013 Just before it arrived there was an access from the road for construction traffic, so it may have come in that way. Regarding the lines over the viaduct, there were 5 running lines to Bordesley South then 6 to Tyseley South prior to the diversion of traffic to New St in 1967. Even with today's rules there would be room for 4 tracks, although I think that equipment would need moving out of the way at some locations. Forgot the pair of goods lines coming off the N Warks line at Tyseley Junction. Jim The road will be closed completely 0010-0600 Sunday so one assumes that is when the action takes place Keith Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
stewartingram Posted January 9, 2013 Share Posted January 9, 2013 Will there be a "Road Replacement Rail Service" for the duration? You mean something like this one? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Neal Ball Posted January 9, 2013 RMweb Premium Share Posted January 9, 2013 Is this the 28xx that was owned by the Great Western Preservation group? One of the posts earlier mentioned it being re-united with their 4110 Err Yes! http://www.gwrpg.co.uk/2011/08/for-sale-collett-class-2884-gwr-heavy-goods-locomotive/ I remember this arriving at Southall back in 1981. Anyone know why the GWRPG have sold it? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium phil-b259 Posted January 10, 2013 RMweb Premium Share Posted January 10, 2013 The obvious question is - how did it get in? I believe that Moor St was refurbished (and the loco installed) at the same time the adjacent Bullring shopping center was undergoing redevelopment & extension. Thus it was probably far easier to find space for a crane etc. than it is now everything has been finished. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coppercap Posted January 10, 2013 Share Posted January 10, 2013 Is this the 28xx that was owned by the Great Western Preservation group? One of the posts earlier mentioned it being re-united with their 4110 Err Yes! http://www.gwrpg.co.uk/2011/08/for-sale-collett-class-2884-gwr-heavy-goods-locomotive/ I remember this arriving at Southall back in 1981. Anyone know why the GWRPG have sold it? It was sold because the GWRPG has realised that it was unlikely to get round to restoring it now, considering how long it has been in it's ownership. The group restored (well, had restored, at Swindon) Pannier tank 9682, and it's due to return to service in 2013 again. Large Prairie tank 4110 was started on at Southall before being moved to Tyseley where further work was carried out, but that has ground to a halt. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Richard E Posted January 10, 2013 RMweb Premium Share Posted January 10, 2013 According to the GWRPG site this move was originally to take place last June! The locomotive was said, at that time, to have been sold to a Birmingham based consortium and that it would be restored at Tyseley. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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