Pencarrow: nothing to see, move along please.

[2ManySpams]

Thanks all for the suggestions on where to get electrical bits and bobs from, much appreciated.

 

I'm still puzzled though by what cables x wires / interconnects to use as what I'm doing isn't a standard DCC installation.

 

For droppers I've used the 16 / 0.2mm wire recommended on most webpage - that's all done.

 

Now if this were a single board (not 5) and I wasn't wiring to allow for 12 separate switchable DC sections I would run circuits of thicker red and black wire around under the layout and connect the red droppers to the red bus circuit and black to black. Two wires back to the DCC controller.

 

But I'm not doing this.

 

I can still run a looped bus around each board if necessary for the red common return. But the worse case for the black wiring is that I have 7 sections on one board. So that's 8 wires just for track power running back to the panel.

 

Various sites recommend either 32 / 0.2mm or solid core wire taken from mains cable for the bus. Taking the same type of wire, up to 8no, back to the control panel seems excessive (based on zero actual knowledge).

 

So could a 15 way d-sub interconnect and plugs/sockets be used instead? What rating should they be?

[2ManySpams]

Anyway, whilst I totally confuse myself on electrickery, I decided to do some scenic work instead. Safe ground for Spams.

 

Spot of plasterwork:

 

 

 

 

[bgman]

Hi Chris,

 

On my "test" 4mm layout I used some of these connectors for all of my wiring...

 

 

https://www.screwfix.com/p/ideal-2-port-lever-wire-connectors-pack-of-40/3526g

 

 

They are extremely simple to use and have the ability for testing in situ when wired up. Whilst I accept its another expense I'm all for the simple life and there is no soldering involved, hence using these. They can accept various cable ratings and in used in multiples.

 

Just a thought mate.

 

Grahame

 

p.s. the 4mm "test" layout is soon to be demolished disassembled and be replaced with a 7mm layout !

[Stubby47]

If possible use multi strand wire rather than solid single core - it's less likely to break.

Will you need a 15 way plug? Smaller numbers of pinned plugs are available.

[2ManySpams]

If possible use multi strand wire rather than solid single core - it's less likely to break.

Will you need a 15 way plug? Smaller numbers of pinned plugs are available.

I had a count up yesterday and including points and power, I'm up to 16 wires on one board.

[3 link]

I had a count up yesterday and including points and power, I'm up to 16 wires on one board.

Hex frog juicer ?

[2ManySpams]

Not if I want to run DC.

[3 link]

Not if I want to run DC.

Oh I didn't know that, I will have to change my electrickery plan now, dohhh.....

 

Martyn.

[Siberian Snooper]

In the club we use 7/0.2 mm cable for dc and DCC operation, if you are going to have a lot of current draw, i.e. a lot of locos and stock with lights etc you may need to beef up the common return as that will need to carry the most juice, your seperate section feeds will spread the loads in the feed side.

 

We only tend to have 2 or 3 locos on scene at any one time and only a few coaches with lighting.

 

I hope that this will allay your fears. NB this is under exhibition conditions.

[St Enodoc]

Thanks all for the suggestions on where to get electrical bits and bobs from, much appreciated.

 

I'm still puzzled though by what cables x wires / interconnects to use as what I'm doing isn't a standard DCC installation.

 

For droppers I've used the 16 / 0.2mm wire recommended on most webpage - that's all done.

 

Now if this were a single board (not 5) and I wasn't wiring to allow for 12 separate switchable DC sections I would run circuits of thicker red and black wire around under the layout and connect the red droppers to the red bus circuit and black to black. Two wires back to the DCC controller.

 

But I'm not doing this.

 

I can still run a looped bus around each board if necessary for the red common return. But the worse case for the black wiring is that I have 7 sections on one board. So that's 8 wires just for track power running back to the panel.

 

Various sites recommend either 32 / 0.2mm or solid core wire taken from mains cable for the bus. Taking the same type of wire, up to 8no, back to the control panel seems excessive (based on zero actual knowledge).

 

So could a 15 way d-sub interconnect and plugs/sockets be used instead? What rating should they be?

Before starting any DCC wiring it's worth browsing through the relevant parts of any or all of these sites:

 

http://www.wiringfordcc.com/

 

https://sites.google.com/site/markgurries/

 

http://www.members.optusnet.com.au/nswmn2/DCC.htm

[Simond]

Hex frog juicers are very good at supplying electrickery of the appropriate polarity to frogs, provided those frogs are part of a DCC layout. They are also a very expensive solution to a simple problem.

 

To supply a frog requires 3 wires. One to the frog, and one each to the stock rails. They should be connected to a single-pole change-over switch, whose moving contact is arranged to connect the appropriate stock rail to the frog, dependent on the blade positions.

 

This simple approach will support both DC and DCC (and, I suspect, though I’ve never tried it, AC systems too).

 

Of course this simple change-over system is incorporated in Tortoise motors (and presumably, Cobalts, too), but should you use servos, or wire-in-tube, or whatever other mechanical means to operate the blades, a simple microswitch will do the job.

 

Food for thought, I hope.

 

Meanwhile, a frog juicer, worthy of its name...

 

 

Happy thing!

Simon

[3 link]

Hi Simon,

 

I know these juicer thingies are one of your pet hates, but what with one single slip, one outside single slip ( with 4 vees built in ) and one bad back I thought this would be the easiest option. For instance, less stress, less swearing and less upside down soldering....

 

If you remember the electrical diagram to drew for me, the fact that only one circuit will be for DC surely means I could still use a hex juicer if needs be?

 

Your best pupil,

 

Martyn.

[St Enodoc]

Hi Simon,

 

I know these juicer thingies are one of your pet hates, but what with one single slip, one outside single slip ( with 4 vees built in ) and one bad back I thought this would be the easiest option. For instance, less stress, less swearing and less upside down soldering....

 

If you remember the electrical diagram to drew for me, the fact that only one circuit will be for DC surely means I could still use a hex juicer if needs be?

 

Your best pupil,

 

Martyn.

I don't think that frog juicers will work on DC at all.

[3 link]

I don't think that frog juicers will work on DC at all.

Hi,

 

When it comes to anything electrical I'm useless , so a while back Simon was very kind and drew me a dummies guide plan of my layout. It is designed to be DC/DCC switchable, but saying that only one part will be DC which does include a complete circuit, the rest is all DCC.

 

Martyn.

[2ManySpams]

No frogs will be juiced on Pencarrow.

[3rd Rail Exile]

Hex frog juicers are very good at supplying electrickery of the appropriate polarity to frogs, provided those frogs are part of a DCC layout. They are also a very expensive solution to a simple problem.

 

To supply a frog requires 3 wires. One to the frog, and one each to the stock rails. They should be connected to a single-pole change-over switch, whose moving contact is arranged to connect the appropriate stock rail to the frog, dependent on the blade positions.

 

This simple approach will support both DC and DCC (and, I suspect, though I’ve never tried it, AC systems too).

 

Of course this simple change-over system is incorporated in Tortoise motors (and presumably, Cobalts, too), but should you use servos, or wire-in-tube, or whatever other mechanical means to operate the blades, a simple microswitch will do the job.

 

Food for thought, I hope.

 

Meanwhile, a frog juicer, worthy of its name...

 

54BDBB00-77AE-44FC-92C4-C044B8F75471.jpeg

 

Happy thing!

Simon

I know a few frogs I'd like to juice with that!

[Simond]

Martyn

 

I’ll have to look again to be sure, but I don’t think you can use a juicer, as there are frogs in the circuit that would be DC/DCC switchable.

 

Have a look at my P.D. thread, there’s a bit there about using choccy blocks with Tortoises. Saves dripping molten solder in your eye...

 

Best

Simon

[Jintyman]

Hi Simon,

 

I know these juicer thingies are one of your pet hates, but what with one single slip, one outside single slip ( with 4 vees built in ) and one bad back I thought this would be the easiest option. For instance, less stress, less swearing and less upside down soldering....

 

If you remember the electrical diagram to drew for me, the fact that only one circuit will be for DC surely means I could still use a hex juicer if needs be?

 

Your best pupil,

 

Martyn.

I have a hex frog juicer that I use for my junction complex and, in my honest opinion, is worth every penny as it has simplified the wiring for my double junction that contains one single slip and one threeway. The junction works seemlessley throughout as can be seen on my videos.

 

Not only do they change the polarity of the frog with just the two feeds and one frog wire, no matter what position the blade is in, but there is no secondary mechanical switching to undertake if you go via the alternate route.

 

This is simply my opinion on Hex Frog Juicers, all my other turnouts are switched via the mechanism within the Cobalts. Plus I'm a dummy with electrickery!!!

 

Jinty

[3 link]

Martyn

I’ll have to look again to be sure, but I don’t think you can use a juicer, as there are frogs in the circuit that would be DC/DCC switchable.

Have a look at my P.D. thread, there’s a bit there about using choccy blocks with Tortoises. Saves dripping molten solder in your eye...

Best

Simon

Hi Simon,

 

Yes I'm going to use the choccy blocks, and I'll probably fit relays to make them as reliable as possible the same as Chaz has done. I will just have to wait until the family go out for the day, otherwise the swear box will be brimming.....

 

Sorry for the hijack Chris....

 

Martyn.

[2ManySpams]

No worries Martyn, interesting to see what other folk are doing.

[Simond]

Just for the record, I don’t hate frog juicers, I just don’t see them as very good value, hence the steam hammer - crack a walnut joke, but they won’t help where the requirement includes DC as well as DCC. I reckon a few minutes with the microswitch is time well spent, and, once it’s done, it’s done - if it should fail, it’s a matter of a few seconds and a few pence to locate the issue and replace a wire or the switch. I guess they’re pretty reliable, but if your frog juicer fails, I guess a new one would be the only solution.

 

David, I’m unconvinced by your protestations related to electrickery - you’ll be trying to convince us that you’re a dummy with weathering & loudspeakers next!

 

I’m always happy to chuck my two penn’orth in to switching & electrics, do shout if help required!

Best

Simon

[2ManySpams]

Unt tonigt I as bin mostly byin wirin. Red unt blik. 50 meteors off etch.

[3 link]

Unt tonigt I as bin mostly byin wirin. Red unt blik. 50 meteors off etch.

Can someone please translate for me, I cannot understand this Cornish script.....

[gwrrob]

Can someone please translate for me, I cannot understand this Cornish script.....

Tonight I've enjoyed a nice bottle of red wine and decided to put the soldering iron away.

[Stubby47]

Can someone please translate for me, I cannot understand this Cornish script.....

Tonight, Matthew, I'll be singing "Red, Red, Wine", whilst running 100 metres.