Pint of Adnams Posted January 5, 2010 Share Posted January 5, 2010 Occasionally someone will post a query about the availability of the former Impetus kit range, often leading to sniping remarks about non-availability or other ill-informed comment. As I happened to be sat next to Richard McLeish recently at a Christmas lunch I took the opportunity to mention this and elicit his response, which he is more than happy for me to post here to inform those who might want one of the kits of the current situation. For various reasons, progress on upgrading the kits has not been made as originally intended. However, that does not mean that the kits are not available, just that they remain basically in the form as acquired from the previous owner. As previously stated, a polite enquiry to Richard McLeish at Karlgarin Models may well bring about a positive result, provided that the purchaser is prepared to accept a set of etches from the original master, whitemetal castings from the original patterns, and a copy of the original instruction sheet. Richard had a stand at that Christmas event, on which were a number of 7mm scale boxed kits for sale. PoA 4 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve K Posted January 5, 2010 Share Posted January 5, 2010 Thanks, PoA - that tallies exactly with what Richard told me at Shepshed (and said he was working towards, back at Burton). If he's willing to let that be more widely known, it may well be worth my while dropping him a line about an 88DS in 4mm... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pint of Adnams Posted January 6, 2010 Author Share Posted January 6, 2010 Thanks for the confirmation Steve. It might be useful to add that Richard also stocks the D&S kits in 7mm scale, useful as he has facilities to take card payments whereas Dan Pinnock does not. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Horsetan Posted January 9, 2010 Share Posted January 9, 2010 .....that does not mean that the kits are not available, just that they remain basically in the form as acquired from the previous owner. As previously stated, a polite enquiry to Rich McLeish at Karlgarin Models may well bring about a positive result, provided that the purchaser is prepared to accept a set of etches from the original master, whitemetal castings from the original patterns, and a copy of the original instruction sheet...... And that is surely what quite a few people want - an original-spec Impetus kit. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grovenor Posted January 9, 2010 Share Posted January 9, 2010 And that is surely what quite a few people want - an original-spec Impetus kit. But when you follow the link to Karlgarin models as quoted above, click on Impetus, you are presesnted with this text in bold type, PLEASE NOTE: Due to unfortunate circumstances, ALL KITS LISTED ON THIS PAGE ARE CURRENTLY UNAVAILABLE. WE CANNOT GIVE ANY PRICE OR DELIVERY DETAILS AT PRESENT. Please accept our apologies for any disappointment or inconvenience this may cause. For the latest information, please see our R&D page. It does not exactly encourage enquiries, if Rich actually wants to sell the kits he could start by saying so on HIS website. I don't see how you can call the Karlgarin website, "uninformed comment". NB. looking for the latest information on the R&D page leads to this: Please do not believe everything you might read on certain internet modelling forums. The truth is NOT out there - it's here.... So how can we believe you? Regards Keith Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Horsetan Posted January 9, 2010 Share Posted January 9, 2010 But when you follow the link to Karlgarin models as quoted above, click on Impetus, you are presesnted with this text in bold type, It does not exactly encourage enquiries, if Rich actually wants to sell the kits he could start by saying so on HIS website..... I think the OP is hinting that you have to ask, um, "unofficially" if you want the original spec. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buckjumper Posted January 9, 2010 Share Posted January 9, 2010 So how can we believe you? By phoning Karlgarin perhaps? 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ravenser Posted January 9, 2010 Share Posted January 9, 2010 I doubt the confusion is helped by the fact that Karlgarin has effectively pulled out of 4mm, and his stand, the last time I saw it, gave the strong impression that he only did 7mm these days (You're unlikely to ask a 7mm trader if he is going to reintroduce a vanished 4mm range) The notice on the website has been there since he broke his arm several years ago - however as I'm not the best at updating website copy myself , I can hardly criticise Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pint of Adnams Posted January 11, 2010 Author Share Posted January 11, 2010 But when you follow the link to Karlgarin models as quoted above, click on Impetus, you are presesnted with this text in bold type, It does not exactly encourage enquiries, if Richard actually wants to sell the kits he could start by saying so on HIS website. I don't see how you can call the Karlgarin website, "uninformed comment". NB. looking for the latest information on the R&D page leads to this: So how can we believe you? Regards Keith I didn't call the Karlgarin website "uninformed comment", my reference was directed to those on this Forum who continually repeat misinformation concerning the availability of Impetus kits despite posts to the contrary - it's been going on for too long and required a definitive correction. I appreciate that Richard doesn't help himself by not updating all of his website - which if you look around it you will see that it has not been updated for a while. I'll get in touch with him and suggest (once more) that it would be helpful to all concerned if he explained the current situation regarding availability. With Dan Pinnock and Jim McGeown both withdrawing their 4mm ranges, Richard has perforce concentrated more on 7mm and his Australian interests; in any event there are more than enough players in the 4mm marketplace. However, if you care to look at the R&D page more closely, and read below only that which you selectively choose to quote, there is a BIG CLUE in the number of kits in 7mm and 4mm for which stocks of etches are to hand, as well as the state of play of other (and new) kits. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
industrial Posted January 20, 2011 Share Posted January 20, 2011 I sent him an email on the 1st Jan as the R&D says that he is doing the RH 165DE in 4mm but doesn't say if it is the 0-4-0 or the 0-6-0 one but has not had an reply from him. It is not surprising people say they have gone for good. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frank S. Posted January 30, 2011 Share Posted January 30, 2011 Hi all, a year onwards and nothing much has changed, except the message on the Kalgarin Models website which now reads for IMPETUS KITS : July 2010 Sorry, this page is unavailable while it is being reconstructed. Please accept our apologies for any inconvenience this may cause. As it's now January 2011, not much has happened in the interim. Rather than get involved in asking for answers unofficially rather than officially, Can I just state that I want to purchase a 4mm ex-Impetus LNER Sential Y10 kit and two of the conversion kits for the W&U Drewery Tram. Is there ANY chance I'll be able to do so before I drop dead ??? Can I ask WHY do manufacturers buy up ranges of kits when they apparently have NO intentions of reissueing them in original or improved form - do they get some perverse pleasure from this, I wonder ??? Wouldn't it be better, albeit less fun, to pass the range onto someone who might(?)actually DO SOMETHING WITH THEM ! Apart from wiping the dust off the masters every five years or so ! :angry: Cheers, Frank Savery, Tasmania., AUSTRALIA 4 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
industrial Posted January 30, 2011 Share Posted January 30, 2011 Hi all, a year onwards and nothing much has changed, except the message on the Kalgarin Models website which now reads for IMPETUS KITS : July 2010 Sorry, this page is unavailable while it is being reconstructed. Please accept our apologies for any inconvenience this may cause. As it's now January 2011, not much has happened in the interim. Rather than get involved in asking for answers unofficially rather than officially, Can I just state that I want to purchase a 4mm ex-Impetus LNER Sential Y10 kit and two of the conversion kits for the W&U Drewery Tram. Is there ANY chance I'll be able to do so before I drop dead ??? Can I ask WHY do manufacturers buy up ranges of kits when they apparently have NO intentions of reissueing them in original or improved form - do they get some perverse pleasure from this, I wonder ??? Wouldn't it be better, albeit less fun, to pass the range onto someone who might(?)actually DO SOMETHING WITH THEM ! Apart from wiping the dust off the masters every five years or so ! :angry: Cheers, Frank Savery, Tasmania., AUSTRALIA I think the business is a 'hobby' to him so when he has time something gets done. The Y10 is listed on the R&D page for March 2009 but are they there, as the RN 165HP DE is listed but all the etchings are no good and no more have been done. The web site went down and he will not rebuild it until he has some kits to put on it. It will be the best if he sold it on to somebody who will update them and bring them out again. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kenton Posted January 30, 2011 Share Posted January 30, 2011 It will be the best if he sold it on to somebody who will update them and bring them out again. I wonder, if that would ever happen? Until then we continue to fight over the scraps on eBay. and mutter about the silly prices reached despite them coming up with regularity. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kenton Posted January 30, 2011 Share Posted January 30, 2011 Until then we continue to fight over the scraps on eBay. Yet another example popped out of the ether today EBay Link but then it did include the VERY RARE Sharman wheels in P4 - so some might see that price as a bargain. (BTW: the winner wasn't me - after all what on earth would I do with P4 wheels) 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arthur Posted January 30, 2011 Share Posted January 30, 2011 Just curious, when did Kalgarin acquire the Impetus range? Several years ago I know. . Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adrian Posted January 30, 2011 Share Posted January 30, 2011 Can I just state that I want to purchase a 4mm ex-Impetus LNER Sential Y10 kit and two of the conversion kits for the W&U Drewery Tram. Why not have a go and scratchbuild one? That's what I did in 7mm, if you can get a spud motor unit about the right wheelbase then the rest is easy to build. I had to turn the buffers but the rest of it was built just using the minimum of handtools, a piercing saw, riveting tool, scriber, steel rule, square and needle files. A few details are on my website along with a basic outline sketch (7mm) which you could use to build your own model. http://www.cherryclan.com/locos/y10.html it really isn't that difficult and the satisfaction of building your own loco is brilliant. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Fen End Pit Posted January 30, 2011 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 30, 2011 i spoke to Richard from Karlgarin on his stand at the Royston Show in November. The story on Impetus was quite logical. It sounded as if Richard was willing to produce some kits, but felt very aware that while we all remember them with great fondness the standard of etching, casting and instructions were not quite up to today's standards, or at least the standards which Richard would like to attain. I got the impression that if he was going to produce them he would want to 'do it right' and not just re-release something which he wouldn't feel happy selling. I think this is the reason why the occasional polite request for some etchings on a 'I know what I'm asking for and accept what I'm getting' basis sometimes results in getting hold of bits if available. I can understand this position, better to not sell them than get the reputation for selling something sub-standard. David Barham 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Mike Bellamy Posted January 31, 2011 RMweb Premium Share Posted January 31, 2011 Hotmail problems are also being discussed here http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php/topic/30217-registering-on-rmweb-with-hotmail-addresses/page__pid__317776#entry317776 I recall your discussion and so I think I know the manufacturer you mean who has also bought products from two other manufacturers who have both retired but won't release them until he has upgraded the kits - they were excellent when first introduced many years ago but things have moved on since then. However I do know that other brand new kits recently introduced have helped to progress the improvements to the others and so there is light at the end of a long tunnel Mike Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kenton Posted January 31, 2011 Share Posted January 31, 2011 I can understand this position, better to not sell them than get the reputation for selling something sub-standard. Personally I think that is completely the wrong approach. The masters might well be poor and of "old" standard but if they are at all usable then selling kits at no better than the used to be would be better than sitting on them indefinitely. As long as people know what they are getting (unimproved kit) then they are not being sold a pup and the sales and customer feedback would go a long way to indicate which kits need more urgent attention in terms of updating. From a commercial perspective the kits would at least be paying their way and the customer base would be satisfied that the brand is not worthless/disappeared. Communication that a kit was currently being updated would enable customers to decide to wait or be able to run with the old option. Communication both website and email is critical, most folk are probably fast forming an opinion about the way he does business, perhaps wondering about things like "if I can't get a reply now, what about when something goes wrong with my order, or I want to consult on the way the kit goes together". As it is we have nothing. 4 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
cctransuk Posted January 31, 2011 Share Posted January 31, 2011 yet he insists on communicating via a known hotbed for spam as an ISP, e.g. hotmail... I mean, come on... Your opinion, maybe - but I conduct business with no problems whatsoever via a Hotmail account. Yes, some of my Inbox content is spam, but it is easily recognised and simply deleted unopened. Regards, John Isherwood, Cambridge Custom Transfers. http://www.cctrans.freeserve.co.uk/ Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Horsetan Posted January 31, 2011 Share Posted January 31, 2011 Well, the kit range may be "dead" (in the manner of Father Jack after he drank the floor polish) , but this thread is very much "in production". Wonder if we could market and sell this thread instead....? 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hollywoodfoundry Posted January 31, 2011 Share Posted January 31, 2011 Your opinion, maybe - but I conduct business with no problems whatsoever via a Hotmail account. Yes, some of my Inbox content is spam, but it is easily recognised and simply deleted unopened. Regards, John Isherwood, Cambridge Custom Transfers. http://www.cctrans.freeserve.co.uk/ Sure, that's what happens at your end. The issue with Hotmail is that many ISPs and large companies filter out anything with a Hotmail address and dispose of it. Therefore your emails may not get through to your customers. I can tell you anything with a Hotmail address goes straight into the SPAM folder on my PC due to the ridiculous quantity of advertising that Hotmail append to the end of users messages. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pixie Posted February 1, 2011 Share Posted February 1, 2011 As previously stated, a polite enquiry to Richard McLeish at Karlgarin Models may well bring about a positive result, provided that the purchaser is prepared to accept a set of etches from the original master, whitemetal castings from the original patterns, and a copy of the original instruction sheet. Did anyone get any results from this? I phoned Richard shortly after the original posting went out to try and get hold of a 4mm 88DS. I think I caught him at a busy time as he was flying out to Australia the next day but assured me that if I dropped him an email, he'd let me know when the bits were available (IIRC he had the etches but not the castings, or vice versa) and it should be around Easter. Easter came and went without hearing a sausage and after a couple of attempts of making contact with him I gave up. Pix Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
cctransuk Posted February 1, 2011 Share Posted February 1, 2011 Sure, that's what happens at your end. The issue with Hotmail is that many ISPs and large companies filter out anything with a Hotmail address and dispose of it. Therefore your emails may not get through to your customers. I can tell you anything with a Hotmail address goes straight into the SPAM folder on my PC due to the ridiculous quantity of advertising that Hotmail append to the end of users messages. Well - all I can say is that I cannot recall a single instance of a customer complaining that I did not respond to their enquiry. I will bear what you say in mind in the event that I might need to order your products. Advertising? I just ignore it - be it in e-mails, via my letterbox, on TV, on hoardings, or any of the other myriad media that bombard us daily. If businesses are conned by the ad-men into believing that they have no option but to spend billions on advertising then that's their problem. I'm not going to get worked up about it, though. Regards, John Isherwood, Cambridge Custom Transfers. http://www.cctrans.freeserve.co.uk/ Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kenton Posted February 1, 2011 Share Posted February 1, 2011 Advertising? I just ignore it - be it in e-mails, via my letterbox, on TV, on hoardings, or any of the other myriad media that bombard us daily. Is that also a recommended approach for your customers ? Or should that be "potential customers"? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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