Train spotting at Finsbury Square

[31A]

10 minutes ago, 5BarVT said:

OTOH, you may like the stacked arms.

 

Thanks Paul, yes another doll to the left might be an answer although I think the site at Harrogate is a bit more spacious than my layout.  But yes, I do quite like the stacked arms!

[Flying Pig]

Going right off the deep end now, would something like this this work?  I think the shunt signal for platform 3 should be lowered as well.

 

[31A]

14 minutes ago, Flying Pig said:

Going right off the deep end now, would something like this this work?  I think the shunt signal for platform 3 should be lowered as well.

 

 

Thank you, that's brilliant!  Although the arms on the left might need some ingenious crank arrangements to make them work.  But I do prefer it with the arms lined up across the bottom (yes I agree, the platform 3 shunt signal should be lowered into line).

[St Enodoc]

1 hour ago, 31A said:

 

Thank you, that's brilliant!  Although the arms on the left might need some ingenious crank arrangements to make them work.  But I do prefer it with the arms lined up across the bottom (yes I agree, the platform 3 shunt signal should be lowered into line).

I'm not convinced by the "stepped" girder on the left. A prototype photo would change my mind though...

[Flying Pig]

8 hours ago, St Enodoc said:

I'm not convinced by the "stepped" girder on the left. A prototype photo would change my mind though...

 

Well first, it isn't a stepped girder.  It's a gantry with an additional bracket fixed to the left hand post, so structurally I think it works.  And second, you're right, it really does strain credibility quite hard.  

[31A]

Another go; Mock Up v3.

 

All the arms are on one level except for upper left, and the whole thing has worked out about 10mm lower, although I'll still have to lengthen the posts a bit.

 

I think I'm happy with this and now just have to work out how to make it.  Thanks to everyone for their input which is much appreciated and especially @Flying Pig for making me think again about underhung arms!

 

 

[St Enodoc]

11 hours ago, 31A said:

Another go; Mock Up v3.

 

All the arms are on one level except for upper left, and the whole thing has worked out about 10mm lower, although I'll still have to lengthen the posts a bit.

 

I think I'm happy with this and now just have to work out how to make it.  Thanks to everyone for their input which is much appreciated and especially @Flying Pig for making me think again about underhung arms!

 

 

Now that I do like.

[31A]

I've made a start on the new signal gantry.  This shows the basic parts; the Model Signal Engineering gantry etch, and lattice base posts and 7ft lattice bracket from D&S Models which I'd had in stock for a long time (similar parts are available from MSE nowadays).  The posts have had 1mm x 1mm brass angle run up their corners which improves the appearance and also makes them stronger.  More 1mm x 1mm brass angle is ready to be soldered along the tops of the girders.

 

 

And this shows those parts soldered up, with sockets for the dolls from 4mm OD square brass tube.

 

 

But there is no bracing between the girders.  I think modellers often ignore this and I've been just as guilty of that, but on this occasion there will be no walkway across the top to hide its absence.  After a couple of false starts I decided to make this bracing as a zig zag of 15 amp fuse wire, and made a bending jig by making saw cuts in an offcut of paxolin.

 

 

I found it easiest to do this in short sections; here is some of the lower bracing in place.

 

 

And lastly for now, the main gantry structure complete:

 

[Chas Levin]

Nice work Steve! I built the Traintronics TT181 4-track gantry and you're quite right about the absence of bracing and about the presence of a top walkway hiding the fact... Too late to add it now though, painted and installed!

[31A]

A bit more work on the signal gantry.

 

I have made the wooden doll posts from real wood; old chopsticks to be precise which I presume are probably bamboo.  It's nice hard wood which can be cut, drilled etc. very accurately.  I made the dolls by first planing a length square, then putting the taper on using a big file.  I had a whitemetal one to copy, but think there are various advantages to using wood.  For one thing, there's less risk of bits becoming unsoldered when you solder other bits on!

 

The arm bearings are from small brass tube; I filed a notch in the dolls for the bearing to sit in, then attached it to the post by a U shaped hasp of brass wire soldered to the tube and passed through holes in the post, then clenched over on the other side and filed flat.  The lamp brackets are from brass strip, with a hole drilled for a pin through the post to be soldered to them.  Again, the pin head filed flush on the other side of the post.

 

 

The arm bearings incorporate a clutch arrangement to ensure the arms stand horizontally when "on" and limit the amount they raise to when "off".  This is done by filing a half section on the end of the bearing, and making a collar to fit behind the arm, with a half section filed in that too so that each half section mates when the arm is placed in the bearing, then filing away the piece on the post until the arm stands horizontally and rises to about 45 degrees when off.   The challenge is to make these pieces small enough that the arm is close to the post when it's in place.  But I think better than seeing arms at random angles, which can be the case with model signals.  Hopefully the picture makes this clearer than my words!

 

 

Having done that for all the arms, they are now temporarily in place to check they all line up horizontally.  Not bad, although there might be a little bit more tweaking required!

 

 

So far so good; I still haven't really worked out how it's all going to work, but I guess that's the next stage!

 

Edited November 1, 2022 by 31A
Typo (meant to write 'drilled' not dried!

[Graham T]

Very impressive work there!

[lezz01]

Nice work Steve.

Regards Lez.

[Chas Levin]

On 01/11/2022 at 17:08, 31A said:

A bit more work on the signal gantry.

 

I have made the wooden doll posts from real wood; old chopsticks to be precise which I presume are probably bamboo.

Excellent material for Chow Mein-line signals, Steve! 😉

 

(Sorry, dreadful pun, couldn't resist though: how often does anything to do with Chinese food crop on here? 🤐)

[Mallard60022]

On 01/11/2022 at 17:08, 31A said:

A bit more work on the signal gantry.

 

I have made the wooden doll posts from real wood; old chopsticks to be precise which I presume are probably bamboo.  It's nice hard wood which can be cut, drilled etc. very accurately.  I made the dolls by first planing a length square, then putting the taper on using a big file.  I had a whitemetal one to copy, but think there are various advantages to using wood.  For one thing, there's less risk of bits becoming unsoldered when you solder other bits on!

 

The arm bearings are from small brass tube; I filed a notch in the dolls for the bearing to sit in, then attached it to the post by a U shaped hasp of brass wire soldered to the tube and passed through holes in the post, then clenched over on the other side and filed flat.  The lamp brackets are from brass strip, with a hole drilled for a pin through the post to be soldered to them.  Again, the pin head filed flush on the other side of the post.

 

 

The arm bearings incorporate a clutch arrangement to ensure the arms stand horizontally when "on" and limit the amount they raise to when "off".  This is done by filing a half section on the end of the bearing, and making a collar to fit behind the arm, with a half section filed in that too so that each half section mates when the arm is placed in the bearing, then filing away the piece on the post until the arm stands horizontally and rises to about 45 degrees when off.   The challenge is to make these pieces small enough that the arm is close to the post when it's in place.  But I think better than seeing arms at random angles, which can be the case with model signals.  Hopefully the picture makes this clearer than my words!

 

 

Having done that for all the arms, they are now temporarily in place to check they all line up horizontally.  Not bad, although there might be a little bit more tweaking required!

 

 

So far so good; I still haven't really worked out how it's all going to work, but I guess that's the next stage!

You have the Patience of Glasshopper when he was Meditating. 

Will the Signal Arms, if operated in sequence, play 'Chopsticks' as they clank up and down? Asking for a friend.

Phil

 

[31A]

2 hours ago, Chas Levin said:

Excellent material for Chow Mein-line signals, Steve! 😉

 

(Sorry, dreadful pun, couldn't resist though: how often does anything to do with Chinese food crop on here? 🤐)

Nice one, Chas! 🤣🤣🤣

 

Sorry, I can't think of anything to follow that with!  The chopsticks were never any good for eating with (or not for me, anyway), I think they came with a Wok and I was going to throw them away but they actually make good modelling material!

[31A]

I've been making up sets of weight bars and cranks, using the MSE Part S001 Signal Post Fittings,

 

 https://www.wizardmodels.ltd/shop/signals/s001/  

 

in the hope that I'll somehow be able to connect them all together and make it work:

 

 

Meanwhile at the station, Enabling Works have started, involving digging a trench in the platform.

 

 

Now we can get an idea of what it will look like, although it'll be easier to see when it's painted!

 

 

 

[31A]

Today I made a start on details such as the walkway, handrails and smoke deflector plates; good finger singeing stuff!

 

These are mainly based on the signals at Leeds Central that @Flying Pig posted a photo of earlier, but it's quite conjectural really as details such as these usually just appear as black silhouettes against the sky in photos.  Perhaps the smoke deflectors are on the small side; not sure, but I don't think they're going to change now.

 

I also tried fitting one of the arms to see if it would work; the sub arm on the main stem.  It does work, but not with my usual 5 amp fuse wire, which just sagged too much.  I've temporarily used some thin brass wire for the horizontal pull but will probably use some 0.31mm N/S when I come to do it properly.   This also confirms that this arm won't be very visible from normal viewing angles!  However I mustn't forget to give that arm its lamp before I start painting, and also the ladder is still to do.

 

 

 

[Flying Pig]

7 minutes ago, 31A said:

These are mainly based on the signals at Leeds Central that @Flying Pig posted a photo of earlier,

 

That was actually @Northroader.

 

It's looking very good.

[31A]

1 minute ago, Flying Pig said:

 

That was actually @Northroader.

 

It's looking very good.

 

Oh sorry, I didn't check back & then did wonder if I'd got it right!  Thank you anyway, glad you like it!

 

[31A]

The structure of the gantry is now just about finished, with the addition of the ladder.  I used a flat etched ladder from MSE, but soldered pieces of the 0.45mm square nickel silver wire (that Wizard Models sell for point rodding) up the stiles to reinforce it and keep it straight, as well as adding some relief detail.

 

 

 

 

As it seems to have stopped raining here for today at least, this afternoon I managed to spray a coat of primer onto it.

 

[31A]

Continuing rainy weather has slowed progress with the signal gantry, it being unsuitable weather for spray painting in the back yard.

 

So I looked around for something else to do, and lighted on a remarkable bargain from the Leeds show a few weeks ago - a Hornby N2, as new, for £40!  The picture on the box was of 69546, which is one I haven't got, but when I opened the box it contained 69506 which I have got.  In fairness the end flap of the box did say 69506.  Taking it out of the box, extra wiring was visible inside the cab, which turned out to be attached to a Chip, which was no use to me but has since gone to a good home.

 

So bearing in mind that I'd be changing the number, I thought I'd convert it into a  non-condensing N2 for a bit of variety.  Looking through books etc. produced a picture in "Locomotives in Close Up" by Tony Wright and David Addyman of 69560, which seemed to fit the bill, having been allocated to London area sheds during the 1950s.  It seems there were several non condensing N2s in the London area at that time.  Presumably they had to be kept away from the "Drain" workings, as they also had no LT Trip Cock apparatus (or at least, this one didn't).  Perhaps they were kept to ECS workings?

 

Anyhow, to make my model into that one involved more than just the transposition of the last two digits of the number.  69560 was one of the 1925-built batch of N2/2s, and as such left hand drive.  As far as the model goes, this meant moving the ejector exhaust pipe from the right hand side to the left, and doing the opposite with the steps on the bunker side.  Also, the lubricator arrangements were different, and the picture showed this one at least was fitted with LNER Groups Standard buffers (with stepped casings).

 

I had a rummage in the Stash, and came up with some bits that looked useful.

 

 

Slater's buffers, Craftsman lubricators, and a Crownline chimney.  There's not too much wrong with the existing chimney, but having had the brass one for so long I thought now or never was probably the time to use it.  I didn't use the GW Models smokebox door handles as it turned out the base was too big; instead I found a lost wax cast one from Branchlines.

 

I'd soon taken off most of the bits I didn't want, and plugged some holes.  At this point I wasn't sure about the lubricators so they were still on.  Getting the ejector pipe off the side of the boiler wasn't easy, especially where it runs along the top of the tank.

 

 

 

 

 

[31A]

So moving swiftly on (it was supposed to be a quick project!), these pictures show most of the added bits.

 

I didn't intend to replace the original handrails, but did want to move the smokebox door handrail to the more usual position, above the upper hinge strap.  To do so, I used Alan Gibson handrail knobs, which made the original ones look rather gross, so I used up a few more in replacing them all.

 

The balancing pipes between the side tanks and the bunker tank, behind the cab steps, were made from 2mm brass rod and had to be attached to the mechanism rather than the body, because of the way it fits together.  I chamfered the rear edges of the steps to make them look thinner.

 

The steps on the bunker side are filed down pieces of Evergreen T section styrene.

 

There are now no steps on the tank fronts.  The picture of the real loco shows just a lubricator mounted on the front of the RH tank (no steps) and I found a picture on line of the LH side which seems to show no steps on that side either, although the front is in shadow.  I find it hard to believe there weren't any, otherwise how could water be put into the loco, but for now I've left them off.  They could be added alter if I find out differently.

 

 

 

 I had a couple of goes at the bracket on the front of the RH side tank, for the lubricator.  The first effort was bent up from etch scrap, but it looked too big and the corners weren't very square.  In the end, I made one from some rectangular brass tube, basically cutting off one side, and making the diagonal stays from the lower side.  In the picture below, the lower one is the one I actually used.

 

 

[Neil]

Apologies for injecting an unannounced video into your thread Steve but I rather think you'll like it.

 

 

The railway stuff really comes into full focus after about three minutes but there's plenty to like in the first section too.

Edited November 27, 2022 by Neil

[2750Papyrus]

What a great video, I particularly liked the shots of the goods station.

 

Also noted the mess of the "Indian village" in front of the passenger station, little traffic with pedestrians walking between moving vehicles, and room to park!

[45568]

Like the N2 Steve, I did one some years ago to represent 69552, which was at Colwick for a while in the 1950s.

Removal of the condensing pipes totally changes the appearance.

Cheers from Oz,

Peter C.