phil gollin Posted December 29, 2010 Share Posted December 29, 2010 . The changing of the bogies (sometime between 1957 to 1959) means that almost any single version in brown/umber will only be limited to a few years of full accuracy. . Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sunshine coast Posted December 30, 2010 Share Posted December 30, 2010 Gentlemen, I have written confirmation from Simon Kohler this morning that the "1967" version of their Brighton Belle is in Blue/Gray livery. Regards Trevor ... Brighton Belles now listed on the Hornby website as "1934" and "1969". Regards Trevor ... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Gwiwer Posted December 30, 2010 RMweb Premium Share Posted December 30, 2010 Duly noted, thank you. Still wondering if 1934 means 1937 but, hey, one step at a time! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sunshine coast Posted December 30, 2010 Share Posted December 30, 2010 Duly noted, thank you. Still wondering if 1934 means 1937 but, hey, one step at a time! Yes ,there is a bit of confusion at the moment regards various details,but I shall try and get more solid info when I visit Hornby in a week or so..... at the moment the offices are basically closed over the Christmas/New Year period,so it was good of Simon to respond to my queries in his holiday time and also get the website altered ...and I do not wish to bother him further at the moment... Regards Trevor .... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete2210 Posted January 2, 2011 Share Posted January 2, 2011 I don't think I've missed this, but is there any indication of what unit number is going to be produced, personally I'm hoping for 3052...............my wife's name is Audrey. Is there any decals on the market that would allow easy unit renumbering? Pete Williams, Uxbridge. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Oldddudders Posted January 2, 2011 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 2, 2011 I don't think I've missed this, but is there any indication of what unit number is going to be produced, personally I'm hoping for 3052...............my wife's name is Audrey. Is there any decals on the market that would allow easy unit renumbering? Pete Williams, Uxbridge. Hi Pete Nice to see your name on here! Given that there were only the 3 of 'em, and that a small number of folk will want to run 10-cars, I should think they might do all three. Audrey is not a common name among youngsters these days, but I knew at least 3 in my schooldays, and was pleased when I first watched the Pullman of that name flash though Earlswood in 1960. All the best Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
10800 Posted January 2, 2011 Share Posted January 2, 2011 Is there any decals on the market that would allow easy unit renumbering? Fox Transfers sheet FRH4716, there may be others. As Ian says: Given that there were only the 3 of 'em, and that a small number of folk will want to run 10-cars, I should think they might do all three. Which I suspect will be the case even if not immediately. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete2210 Posted January 2, 2011 Share Posted January 2, 2011 Thanks Ian and 10800, a 5Bel was on my shopping list anyway, now just waiting for a 6PUL/PAN....................dream on Williams!! Pete Williams, Uxbridge Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Oldddudders Posted January 2, 2011 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 2, 2011 Thanks Ian and 10800, a 5Bel was on my shopping list anyway, now just waiting for a 6PUL/PAN....................dream on Williams!! 10800 will certainly be in the queue with you on that one! Apart from the BEL, his new viaduct would look most apt with such a train. Nice to dream! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
10800 Posted January 2, 2011 Share Posted January 2, 2011 now just waiting for a 6PUL/PAN....................dream on Williams!! You and me both - I think even in this current EMU-friendly climate that's a wish too far though! We're probably going the Phoenix kit route for those - maybe with one of them having the orginal Maunsell slab-sided driving motor Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete2210 Posted January 2, 2011 Share Posted January 2, 2011 Well I wouldn't baulk at a 4CIG/BIG as long as it was green, however with the way that both Hornby and Bachmann are going it will be likely, if anything of the EPB family. To get on your hobby-horse 10800 a model of Balcombe Viaduct would look great as a display area. Pete Williams, Uxbridge Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
10800 Posted January 3, 2011 Share Posted January 3, 2011 To get on your hobby-horse 10800 a model of Balcombe Viaduct would look great as a display area. I suspect it will get used quite a bit for that! My first 5BEL will have to be 3051 because I have six sets of these which came from Kitchen First 'Doris' (maybe I could model them somehow ). They still get used occasionally - Laurence Olivier may have eaten a kipper off one of them Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
10800 Posted January 3, 2011 Share Posted January 3, 2011 Just been looking at this again - at about 2:35 there is a shot of a 10BEL crossing the Ouse Viaduct, and near the end a very brief glimpse of the front cab of the umber/cream unit coupled to a blue/grey one. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Re6/6 Posted January 3, 2011 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 3, 2011 I suspect it will get used quite a bit for that! They still get used occasionally - Laurence Olivier may have eaten a kipper off one of them Or Dora Brian! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Re6/6 Posted January 3, 2011 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 3, 2011 Just been looking at this again - at about 2:35 there is a shot of a 10BEL crossing the Ouse Viaduct, and near the end a very brief glimpse of the front cab of the umber/cream unit coupled to a blue/grey one. Well that's that then! Our 'scratch' set will have to be in B/G livery. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shedmaster Posted January 5, 2011 Share Posted January 5, 2011 Good evening, I'm not sure if it's too early to expect an answer, but can anybody please explain what exactly Hornby are releasing here, if you might know ? To explain....... Hattons are listing a 1934 2 x car driving set, and a 1967 2 x car driving set. I think I know what this means.............a Pullman liveried set and a BR Blue / Grey liveried set. However, with the trailers, instead of saying i.e 'pullman first with kitchen in pullman umber and cream', or 'pullman first with kitchen in BR Blue / Grey', they are confusing me with nonsense about version 1 and version 2 etc. I would like to place an order, but am unable to work out what is what, as it is unusually unclear. I realise I could of course ask Hattons or indeed Hornby's Mr Kohler direct, but knowing that traders frequent this site, hoped that you may know ? Many thanks for any help.........and of course sincerest apologies if I have missed something.... Kindest Regards, Dave Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium zarniwhoop Posted January 6, 2011 RMweb Premium Share Posted January 6, 2011 Good evening, I'm not sure if it's too early to expect an answer, but can anybody please explain what exactly Hornby are releasing here, if you might know ? [...] Dave Based on what has been said elsewhere, I'm expecting a brown and cream unit with a 305x number (they were renumbered in about 1937 if my memory is correct) with the original bogies (I think those got replaced in the late 1950s). As to which pullman crest is on this,, or the roof colour - no idea, The so-called '1967' is the blue and grey version with the modern bogies. Of course, someone who has chapter and verse might shoot me down in flames, but for now I'll take that risk! ĸen, having second thoughts about whether the blue-grey version is worth the money for a "that makes a change, running on a railtour" train. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Natalie Posted January 6, 2011 Share Posted January 6, 2011 Regarding dates of repainting into blue/grey I thought the following information that I have might be of interest. "The Brighton Belle" Nicholas Owen, SEG Third Edition June 1981: 3052 outshopped in December 1968 3051 outshopped in February 1969 3053 outshopped in May 1969 A picture on page 21 shows 3052 in blue/grey with stencil headcodes on 20th April 1969 whilst working 11.00 London Bridge- Brighton. This J. Scrace photo shows that another blue/grey BE is couped to the rear which the appendix states to be 3051. The text of this interesting booklet also states that "From January 1st 1937, the numbers of the units were changed to 3051-3." John Atkinson of SEmG also gives the same repainting dates (as Nicholas Owen) in his excellent document detailing the transition from green to blue and bue/grey liveries. I assume that the new David Brown book 'Southern Electric Vol 2' will have the definitive information- my copy is still en route to me... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Gwiwer Posted January 6, 2011 RMweb Premium Share Posted January 6, 2011 I won't speak for and on behalf of the authors though both are known to me and I have discussed Nick Owen's publication with him personally (while seated in a 4DD coach!). The records which survive would probably all come from a single source. Brown has updated and improved upon the previously standard Moody work "Southern Electric" which gives the same information. Therefore at this distance from events we have to make an assumption that all are offering actual correct or official dates and are not wide of the mark through lack of research. I'd be willing to bet the units were not actually renumbered physically on New Year's Day but 74 years later who would know? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sunshine coast Posted January 6, 2011 Share Posted January 6, 2011 Good evening, I'm not sure if it's too early to expect an answer, but can anybody please explain what exactly Hornby are releasing here, if you might know ? To explain....... Hattons are listing a 1934 2 x car driving set, and a 1967 2 x car driving set. I think I know what this means.............a Pullman liveried set and a BR Blue / Grey liveried set. However, with the trailers, instead of saying i.e 'pullman first with kitchen in pullman umber and cream', or 'pullman first with kitchen in BR Blue / Grey', they are confusing me with nonsense about version 1 and version 2 etc. I would like to place an order, but am unable to work out what is what, as it is unusually unclear. I realise I could of course ask Hattons or indeed Hornby's Mr Kohler direct, but knowing that traders frequent this site, hoped that you may know ? Many thanks for any help.........and of course sincerest apologies if I have missed something.... Kindest Regards, Dave As I said earlier in this thread,details are not clear at the moment ,but the later unit is now listed on Hornbys site as "1969" and when I return from visiting Hornby on Monday,I shall post all information that I have found out with regards to the Belles ... Regards Trevor ... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shedmaster Posted January 6, 2011 Share Posted January 6, 2011 Good Morning, After posting last night at 22:20.......I then emailed Mr Kohler anyway, wondering why I hadn't just done that in the first place.... I was kindly provided a response VERY early this morning, way before the expected office hours start, and my question has been clarified for me. I expect that the various website listings will be corrected in due course as and when information becomes available. Thanks again, Dave Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
robertcwp Posted February 24, 2011 Share Posted February 24, 2011 I am interested to know whether Hornby will do both types of bogie. The differences were by no means trivial. As built all 5 Bel and 6 Pul/Cit vehicles (or to be more accurate as built 5 Pul and 6 Cor) had equalising beam bogies often referred to as Dutch bogies. The whole lot were modified in the mid-1950s to have leaf springs, which can be seen clearly in this view and this view. Those leaf springs were not present on the bogies prior to modification. This change affected all motor and trailer bogies of all Bel and Pul vehicles (including the ordinary non-Pullman stock in the Pul units). Volume 2 of the David Brown book has excellent photos of 6 Pul Pullmans illustrating the difference. Incidentally, the 6 Pan units had different trailer bogies (like those on suburban and sem-fast units) and a modified design of motor bogie. So far as I can establish, the Pan motor bogies were not modified with leaf springs. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garethp8873 Posted March 11, 2011 Share Posted March 11, 2011 I hope I ain't going off subject, but I am trying to put together an appropriate set of Pullmans that would work with either a Southern T9, Arthur or West County. At the moment I have First Class Kitchen Car Argus, First Class Kitchen Car Minerva, First Class Parlour Car Cygnus, First Class Parlour Car Ibis and the Devon Belle. What else would make an appropriate rake? Garethp8873. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Godfrey Glyn Posted June 15, 2011 RMweb Gold Share Posted June 15, 2011 Taken on the Hornby stand at DEMU last Saturday, I was impressed Godfrey Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Godfrey Glyn Posted June 15, 2011 RMweb Gold Share Posted June 15, 2011 A second shot Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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