wombatofludham Posted October 8, 2014 Share Posted October 8, 2014 http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-29531099 First not having a lot of luck with their franchising recently. If the news is correct, it looks like Abellio will be taking over the operation of Scotrail. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
westie7 Posted October 8, 2014 Share Posted October 8, 2014 Confirmed this morning on BBC Scotland news website Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xerces Fobe2 Posted October 8, 2014 Share Posted October 8, 2014 What a great start to my day Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Legend Posted October 8, 2014 RMweb Premium Share Posted October 8, 2014 Interesting. I think First did an OK job on Scotrail. Admittedly I'm really only a weekend user , but it did seem to be going from strength to strength. However lets wait for official announcement on what Abellio are bringing to the party. I do hope as well as keeping an eye on value for money its a quality based bid, and we haven't just selected the low cost option Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
westie7 Posted October 8, 2014 Share Posted October 8, 2014 At least we don't have to deal with a rebranding Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bon Accord Posted October 8, 2014 Share Posted October 8, 2014 Well that's made a positive start to my day! I might have preferred Arriva, but lets see what Abellio do - a Chiltern-esque Mk 3 upgrade for Glasgow/Edinburgh-Aberdeen services would be much appreciated indeed! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
westie7 Posted October 8, 2014 Share Posted October 8, 2014 Not wrong there! Did Queen St to Aberdeen yesterday and although the 170 was in reasonable shape with no wheel flats under first as is usually the case. The gearboxes don't half hold on forever before changing up. Cabin noise and vibration was shocking. There's been a lot of new staff on the GLQ-ABD recently and its doing good. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
woodenhead Posted October 8, 2014 Share Posted October 8, 2014 A quote from http://www.railstaff.co.uk/2014/01/20/scotlands-new-railway/ 'The ITT contains a detailed specification for rolling stock, all of which must have Wi-Fi. For inter-city stock this includes the need for a ‘passenger environment consistent with modern inter-city passenger stock in UK and Europe; seats to be aligned with windows, large luggage areas within sight, cycle storage and flexible pram space.’ As the current class 170 DMUs do not meet this requirement, new or refurbished rolling stock will be required.' With the IEP about to come on stream (well in a few years) then perhaps HSTs up north for the Aberdeen & Inverness services, Abellio did go out to tender last year for about 100 electric sets as well. Would Scotrail customers though see even a refurbished Mk111 coach as a backwards step given their age even if they were given a full makeover with plug doors, realigned seats etc. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold mcowgill Posted October 8, 2014 RMweb Gold Share Posted October 8, 2014 Ah, a possible destination for Abellio's tatty under-maintained Mk3 carriages from Crown Point so that we can have something newer down here... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
luckymucklebackit Posted October 8, 2014 Share Posted October 8, 2014 With EGIP on the horizon there is going to be a huge surplus of DMU stock as it is, wouln't mind seeing short formed HSTs on the Aberdeen and Inverness routes and the 170s ditched totally. DMUs are for suburban services, not long haul. One interesting thought, First Bus could easily now go in the offensive to cut fare prices on routes that compete with railway routes they previously ran, might drive down some fare prices in the long term. Jim Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bon Accord Posted October 8, 2014 Share Posted October 8, 2014 Not wrong there! Did Queen St to Aberdeen yesterday and although the 170 was in reasonable shape with no wheel flats under first as is usually the case. The gearboxes don't half hold on forever before changing up. Cabin noise and vibration was shocking. There's been a lot of new staff on the GLQ-ABD recently and its doing good. I occasionally use the 0526 Aberdeen-Glasgow for work purposes, however if given a choice (and the time) I always travel up and down with East Coast. The 170's are a bit more bearable now that they've had wifi fitted, but they're still a DMU at the end of the day and that's never going to be as pleasant a travelling experience as LHCS. Abellio would do well to implement an East Coast style fare structure as that would certainly bring in more punters for first class and therefore help fill a Mk3 FO! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Stationmaster Posted October 8, 2014 RMweb Gold Share Posted October 8, 2014 Having travelled this year on something they currently 'operate' I wouldn't even give Abellio a franchise to sweep station platforms - I wonder if those who have awarded this franchise actually went to look at Abellio's current dismal efforts on Anglia? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
great central Posted October 8, 2014 Share Posted October 8, 2014 Maybe ask some people in current Abelliio-land for their opinions? AGA is set to lose some routes to Crossrail which will have new rolling stock in the foreseeable future..... As for DMUs not being suitable for long distance work, has anybody spoken to XC and Virgin about that Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete_mcfarlane Posted October 8, 2014 Share Posted October 8, 2014 I wonder if those who have awarded this franchise actually went to look at Abellio's current dismal efforts on Anglia? I suspect the assessment of bids deliberately doesn't do that to ensure a level playing field. Ditto looking at how well the current incumbent is doing. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Legend Posted October 8, 2014 RMweb Premium Share Posted October 8, 2014 You could have shortened HSTs , like 6 car ones. Not sure that would be of benefit though, even though it would make it more interesting for enthusiasts. Theres not much detail at moment , but two attention grabbers 23% increase in coaching stock. Presumably new emus will be aquired for EGIP and existing dmus cascaded to other routes achieving this capacity increase. £5 fare between any 2 Scottish cities. Would increase my use of trains for recreation. Might have been tempted to try for the Dundee Model Railway show this weekend, had these fares been available now Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
luckymucklebackit Posted October 8, 2014 Share Posted October 8, 2014 The big problem with all the ideas for the Edinburgh/Glasgow-Aberdeen/Inverness services being HSTs as much as i would absolutely love it to happen is Platform space at Queen street, its two constrained to have a 2 power cars taking up platform space and you can't have one hanging off the end as thats where the points are They did it before (albeit once a day) - they could remove a full restaurant/buffet car and replace with a micro-buffet as was done with Mk2 stock bring the legth down to manageable proportions. Also part of the Queen Street rebuilding is to lengthen the platforms. Edit to add link to official franchine document, check out the Scotrail Liveried HST at the top of page 5!!!! http://www.transportscotland.gov.uk/system/files/images/Rail/ScotRail%20franchise/Scotrail%20Brochure%20October%202014.pdf Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Talltim Posted October 8, 2014 Share Posted October 8, 2014 A quote from http://www.railstaff.co.uk/2014/01/20/scotlands-new-railway/ 'The ITT contains a detailed specification for rolling stock, all of which must have Wi-Fi. For inter-city stock this includes the need for a ‘passenger environment consistent with modern inter-city passenger stock in UK and Europe; seats to be aligned with windows, Hang on, do they want consistent with UK or Europe? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Reorte Posted October 8, 2014 RMweb Premium Share Posted October 8, 2014 I occasionally use the 0526 Aberdeen-Glasgow for work purposes, however if given a choice (and the time) I always travel up and down with East Coast. The 170's are a bit more bearable now that they've had wifi fitted, but they're still a DMU at the end of the day and that's never going to be as pleasant a travelling experience as LHCS.Loco-hauled on a non-electrified route is far and away my preference (the posts flicking by the windows is something I find really annoying with overhead electrified lines) but some of the better DMUs that look like they were designed with longer routes half in mind aren't too bad. This probably won't go down well but I've been on Voyagers that have been reasonably quiet (is there an unpowered vehicle in them though that I might've just got lucky with?) The problem with 170s and the like are doors in the wrong place - 1/3 2/3 doors make for a more commuter-train like environment, and the quality of the seating, which could be put on any train. Wi-fi a must? I know why people want it but I can't help thinking that it would do more people more good to just sit back and watch the world go by every once in a while... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Stationmaster Posted October 8, 2014 RMweb Gold Share Posted October 8, 2014 They did it before (albeit once a day) - they could remove a full restaurant/buffet car and replace with a micro-buffet as was done with Mk2 stock bring the legth down to manageable proportions. Also part of the Queen Street rebuilding is to lengthen the platforms. Edit to add link to official franchine document, check out the Scotrail Liveried HST at the top of page 5!!!! http://www.transportscotland.gov.uk/system/files/images/Rail/ScotRail%20franchise/Scotrail%20Brochure%20October%202014.pdf An interesting link thanks - some of it sounds as far fetched (for achievability and the longer term) as their blatherings about the new sleeper contract. Just where are they going to get HSTs - they now seem unlikely to be available off the GWML until 2016/17 and in any case I believe some of the power cars actually belong to First Group and are not leased, plus First will undoubtedly retain the best (least corroded) vehicles for the West of England workings leaving anything going back into the market as in need of the most work. Some of the rest of it sounds laudable but where is the money coming from to pay for it - in fact some of it sounds so good why aren't we going to get similar new stock for GWML and MML electrification instead of cast-offs? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Adam1701D Posted October 8, 2014 RMweb Gold Share Posted October 8, 2014 It looks like the new Scotrail franchise will be running 2+5 HSTs between the major cities, when the sets are released from East Coast or FGW. The illustration shows Chiltern-style power doors, which can only be a good thing. There is a lot to like in the new franchise document. Here's hoping the new Northern franchise gets a similar boost. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glorious NSE Posted October 8, 2014 Share Posted October 8, 2014 Very little modern Intercity stock in the UK has passenger seats aligned with windows, in fact, off the top of my head, just the 180s? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Reorte Posted October 8, 2014 RMweb Premium Share Posted October 8, 2014 What does "aligned" mean? Completely aligned, i.e. only works with face-to-face seats (hope so!) or simply with a window next to most of it? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Talltim Posted October 8, 2014 Share Posted October 8, 2014 Preferred bidder for new EMUs - Hitachi Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glorious NSE Posted October 8, 2014 Share Posted October 8, 2014 An interesting link thanks - some of it sounds as far fetched (for achievability and the longer term) as their blatherings about the new sleeper contract. Just where are they going to get HSTs - they now seem unlikely to be available off the GWML until 2016/17 and in any case I believe some of the power cars actually belong to First Group and are not leased, plus First will undoubtedly retain the best (least corroded) vehicles for the West of England workings leaving anything going back into the market as in need of the most work. Some of the rest of it sounds laudable but where is the money coming from to pay for it - in fact some of it sounds so good why aren't we going to get similar new stock for GWML and MML electrification instead of cast-offs? Think there is one line buried in there that mentions "From 2019" for the HSTs, that should give some time for some to have become free and go through refurbishment. Wonder if the idea is that (by then somewhat elderly*, albeit nice!) 2+5 HSTs may be cheaper to lease and run than 170s in multiple? And will the 170s be free early enough to stop users of TPX going into apoplexy? (*Would any of the folk involved in the project back in the 70s have guessed at them starting yet another new life at age 43!) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
westie7 Posted October 8, 2014 Share Posted October 8, 2014 Some "Oh so Informed" comments on the news article now on BBC Scotland news page Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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