Hattons announce 14xx / 48xx / 58xx

[Harlequin]

If the loco is going to be permanently with the autocoach that would be an avenue to pursue, but in the case of "9793" who probably wants his 58xx to work conventional trains that would probably be a non starter.  

But there again  http://www.kitmaster.org.uk/MotorisingKitsA.htm

Not quite right partnering a 58XX with an autocoach because 58XX's were not fitted with autotrain controls. I'm sure they often hauled autocoaches but a permanent connection might feel out of place after a while. [Edit: Sorry, that's kind of what you said already...]

 

Mine has a Zimo MX622N, partly because at £20 or so these are well priced for their performance, and partly because it can be set to what effectively amounts to a coreless motor mode. Dave Jones recommends turning back EMF off completely with coreless motors, but I can't say my attempts at this with the Zimo or previous Digitrax DZ126 have been satisfactory.

 

It sounds like I've been extremely fortunate to get what seems to be generally a good, reliable performer, to the extent that one of my friends astounded me at an exhibition by shunting with it and not having any pickup issues. I wish I could say the same about my Austerity!

It's interesting that as the topic goes on we're hearing more and more people saying that they've got a good one. It's normal for the satisfied to remain silent in many public discussions and that obscures the true picture. We still don't know what the ratio of good ones to bad ones is.

 

This may seem perverse but I'm tempted to buy another one, partly because of the price drop, partly because the livery (and number?) of mine is wrong for my era but also partly just to see if I get a good one or a bad one... (But in reality I'd need much better reasons than those to be able to justify £80!)

Edited October 31, 2018 by Harlequin

[chuffinghell]

Not quite right partnering a 58XX with an autocoach because 58XX's were not fitted with autotrain controls. I'm sure they often hauled autocoaches but a permanent connection might feel out of place after a while. [Edit: Sorry, that's kind of what you said already...]

 

It's interesting that as the topic goes on we're hearing more and more people saying that they've got a good one. It's normal for the satisfied to remain silent in many public discussions and that obscures the true picture. We still don't know what the ratio of good ones to bad ones is.

 

This may seem perverse but I'm tempted to buy another one, partly because of the price drop, partly because the livery (and number?) of mine is wrong for my era but also partly just to see if I get a good one or a bad one... (But in reality I'd need much better reasons than those to be able to justify £80!)

 

I too 'was' tempted to go for a 58xx in "GREAT WESTERN" livery

 

Instead I've ordered another Andy Barclay to modify (once the latest cab I've drawn up arrives from Shapeways)

Edited November 1, 2018 by chuffinghell

[gwrwill]

Took delivery of a 48xx and 58xx today and both are poor runners.stop start and speeding up for no reason.i have set the cvs to what hattons recommend with no joy.they are currently running on rolling road in the hope things improve as I really want these locos to run on my layout.

[Tom F]

Took delivery of a 48xx and 58xx today and both are poor runners.stop start and speeding up for no reason.i have set the cvs to what hattons recommend with no joy.they are currently running on rolling road in the hope things improve as I really want these locos to run on my layout.

 

Exactly what mine did (If you look at the video from a few days ago I posted). Mine had the CVs and decoder fitted by Hattons themselves and still ran like crap!

 

You have have my sympathies. I've never known a modern loco have so many issues..... 

[gwrwill]

Exactly what mine did (If you look at the video from a few days ago I posted). Mine had the CVs and decoder fitted by Hattons themselves and still ran like crap!

 

You have have my sympathies. I've never known a modern loco have so many issues.....

 

I'm gutted now do I chance replacements or just get a refund.

[Tom F]

I'm gutted now do I chance replacements or just get a refund.

 

 

That's the question..... I have seen one run well on DCC. The loco in question belong to Geoff Taylor and he fitted a Bachmann decoder, didn't alter the CVs and it seems to run very happily.

 

So there are good ones out there. 

[gwrwill]

That's the question..... I have seen one run well on DCC. The loco in question belong to Geoff Taylor and he fitted a Bachmann decoder, didn't alter the CVs and it seems to run very happily.

DSC04392.jpg

 

So there are good ones out there.

 

I bought Hattons own 6 pin decoders I wonder if a different decoder might help???

[57xx]

I'm gutted now do I chance replacements or just get a refund.

 

If you really want them, then chance it, there are some less bad ones out there. You can always get a refund on the replacements if you don't have any luck.

[gwrwill]

I just tried a gaugemaster 6 pin decoder and both run beautifully now.work that one out lol

[Tom F]

I just tried a gaugemaster 6 pin decoder and both run beautifully now.work that one out lol

 

 

Did you tweak your CV's or not? Really pleased they are running well! Hope mine do too!

[gwrwill]

Did you tweak your CV's or not? Really pleased they are running well! Hope mine do too!

No they worked with no tweaking

[Covkid]

I just tried a gaugemaster 6 pin decoder and both run beautifully now.work that one out lol

 

Did you tweak your CV's or not? Really pleased they are running well! Hope mine do too!

 

No they worked with no tweaking

 

Interesting that. When I bought my AB from Hattons the planned Hattons decoder was advised by them as not suitable, and the Gaugemaster 6 pin recommended, which I agreed to. It might be that the Hattons 6 pin decoder didn't fit in the AB, but mine runs very nicely with the Gaugemaster chip.

 

Be interesting to hear whether yours behave any differently with a different decoder "9793".

 

I learnt quite a few years ago how different a loco can behave with a different decoder.  A mate had an original DCC onboard Bachmann class 25 which was noisy and very unsmooth.  A letter to Bachmann resulted in a new PCB with socket, and a new decoder to fit in the loco.  If I hadn't done the swap over myself, I'd swear they were two different locos.        

Edited November 2, 2018 by Covkid

[gwrwill]

Just off phone with hattons and they recommend the gaugemaster chips so 2 being sent with free post and 2 hattons chips being sent back for refund.a positive outcome.

[Tom F]

Just off phone with hattons and they recommend the gaugemaster chips so 2 being sent with free post and 2 hattons chips being sent back for refund.a positive outcome.

 

So why don't they supply them with Gaugemaster decoders? Somewhat annoyed now.....quiet likely it was the decoder from Hattons that was the issue with my last one. Why aren't they actively advocating ones that work, rather than supplying there own......

[Paul_sterling]

So why don't they supply them with Gaugemaster decoders? Somewhat annoyed now.....quiet likely it was the decoder from Hattons that was the issue with my last one. Why aren't they actively advocating ones that work, rather than supplying there own......

 

Possibly a favourable profit margin on their own over the bought-in Gaugemaster unit?

[gwrwill]

So why don't they supply them with Gaugemaster decoders? Somewhat annoyed now.....quiet likely it was the decoder from Hattons that was the issue with my last one. Why aren't they actively advocating ones that work, rather than supplying there own......

I thought the same but I ordered online and there not going to question my choices even though it's obvious what the decoders were for.hope you get a favourable outcome mate

[Tom F]

Possibly a favourable profit margin on their own over the bought-in Gaugemaster unit?

At the expense of having locos run well. I suspect you are right.

[Garry D100]

Hi,

Im looking to get a 58xx but been put off so far by the problems others are having.

Those that have put gaugemaster dcc decoders in, how are the locos still running?

Thanks.

[Thebigshot]

Hi,

Im looking to get a 58xx but been put off so far by the problems others are having.

Those that have put gaugemaster dcc decoders in, how are the locos still running?

Thanks.

 

Hi

 

I have used a lenz 6 pin and it works fine from day 1 although I have tried a hattons chip in a heljin class 26 and wasn't inpressed 

 

thanks

Alan

 

P.S you get what you pay for

[BWsTrains]

Hi

 

I have used a lenz 6 pin and it works fine from day 1 although I have tried a hattons chip in a heljin class 26 and wasn't inpressed 

 

thanks

Alan

 

P.S you get what you pay for

 

 

Hi,

Im looking to get a 58xx but been put off so far by the problems others are having.

Those that have put gaugemaster dcc decoders in, how are the locos still running?

Thanks.

If you refer back to post 1849:  http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/92852-hattons-announce-14xx-48xx-58xx/?p=2679312

 

you will see what DJM Dave had to say on the question of DCC chips and coreless motors and draw your own conclusions. Earlier he had stated:

 

"A range of decoders were tested, and tested with various NMRA compliant controllers." (post #1834)

 

However as far as I can recall there has not been a clear statement or list of suitable / unsuitable DCC chips other than whatever Hattons were recommending on their site after launch (they are no longer doing this). So the question remains is it the chip or the motor / loco? you pay your money and take your chance. 

 

Colin  

[Thebigshot]

If you refer back to post 1849:  http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/92852-hattons-announce-14xx-48xx-58xx/?p=2679312

 

you will see what DJM Dave had to say on the question of DCC chips and coreless motors and draw your own conclusions. Earlier he had stated:

 

"A range of decoders were tested, and tested with various NMRA compliant controllers." (post #1834)

 

However as far as I can recall there has not been a clear statement or list of suitable / unsuitable DCC chips other than whatever Hattons were recommending on their site after launch (they are no longer doing this). So the question remains is it the chip or the motor / loco? you pay your money and take your chance. 

 

Colin  

 

Hi Colin

 

I have no idea what DJM Dave has done but from what has been said on here and from what I have seen with the Hattons chip id suspect the chip may be the problem but I no expert I use 2 controllers a lenz 200 and a prodgy and the hatton's chip didn't behave on either system but that's not to say that the chip wasn't compatible with either system but I have used lenz and hows sound and Bachmann chips I even have a Hornby sound chip and they all work fine on both system's but as you have said you pay your money and take your chance

 

thanks

Alan 

[Sir TophamHatt]

Is there anything you don't pay your money and take your chance with in this world though?

I honestly can't think of a single thing.

[outatime]

Hi,

 

i also experienced the stopping and starting issue with more than one Hattons 6pin Decoder.

I tried it in different locos and it behaved the same way.

The changing of CVs did not have any influence, i sent the decoders back and got a refund.

 

My 14xx currently runs with an ESU Decoder but i don't know how common they are in the UK.

 

If someone wants to use an ESU Decoder, try the following for coreless motors:

Set CV 52 to 0, this will improve running.

If not satisfied, try setting CV 51 between 5 and 15.

You could also try to reduce CV 10 to values between 8 and 4.

CV 53 should be between 120 and 140.

 

This could lead to better running, possibly.

 

But in regard to coreless motors, i would not recommend ESU decoders in general.

 

Regards,

Bjoern

[The Black Hat]

Hi,

 

i also experienced the stopping and starting issue with more than one Hattons 6pin Decoder.

I tried it in different locos and it behaved the same way.

The changing of CVs did not have any influence, i sent the decoders back and got a refund.

 

My 14xx currently runs with an ESU Decoder but i don't know how common they are in the UK.

 

If someone wants to use an ESU Decoder, try the following for coreless motors:

Set CV 52 to 0, this will improve running.

If not satisfied, try setting CV 51 between 5 and 15.

You could also try to reduce CV 10 to values between 8 and 4.

CV 53 should be between 120 and 140.

 

This could lead to better running, possibly.

 

But in regard to coreless motors, i would not recommend ESU decoders in general.

 

Regards,

Bjoern

 

Is that not going to be an issue for people using sound - as many of them use a Loksound ESU decoder...??

[The Black Hat]

Is there anything you don't pay your money and take your chance with in this world though?

I honestly can't think of a single thing.

 

Anvils?