Donington Road Posted May 5, 2015 Share Posted May 5, 2015 Did I blink and miss it, but did someone mention a sand drag a while back? Does anyone know how to effectively model one? I've had a quick look thru' Google Images and they seem quite common on underground terminal bays but photographic evidence away from LT is a bit thin. Is it as simple as wooden shuttering either side of the track and an infill of sand, maybe an untra-fine beige ballast in 4mm? Sorry Andy for wandering, just curious... I have a short run-off track ending in a buffer stop to model and a sand drag might be a slightly unusual feature. Photos of sand drags at Peterborough North. If you want to see the modelled form then have a look at the photos on Gilbert's Peterborough North thread starting at page 100, heres the link http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/18451-peterborough-north/page-100 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Donington Road Posted May 5, 2015 Share Posted May 5, 2015 The Point Motor count has now risen from the original 12 through to 14 AND NOW 17 , I wonder how many more will go in before I'm finished, hahhhah. There was I thinking you were going to build your own, perhaps not Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew P Posted May 5, 2015 Author Share Posted May 5, 2015 There was I thinking you were going to build your own, perhaps not Hi Mick, thanks for the Sand Drag pics and link, this is the one our O Gauge Guys did, which I'm told is typical Midland but some Guys said that many in the Midland and elsewhere in the UK were as you have depicted above, or with a single board on the outside and then filled with sand. I will be doing mine with just sand over the tracks. Re building my own Points, I will be doing that on the next Layout on the other side of the Shed which will be BR / WR Transition BLT. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Physicsman Posted May 5, 2015 RMweb Premium Share Posted May 5, 2015 Thanks Jeff, 3 Days and still nothing running, so NOT GOOD. hahhahha. :nono: It must be giving up the coffee that you mentioned in the PM. Or was it the slug of whiskey? Anyway, take your time and the bottom line is "do what makes YOU happy". Never mind the rest of the punters! Jeff Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Kazmierczak Posted May 5, 2015 Share Posted May 5, 2015 I'd be inclined NOT to have a sand drag Andy. Locos will only be coming slowly out of the stabling point and in that situation I don't think one would've been provided. In earlier days, a wagon might've been parked at the end of that siding as a coal store for the signalbox. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew P Posted May 5, 2015 Author Share Posted May 5, 2015 I'd be inclined NOT to have a sand drag Andy. Locos will only be coming slowly out of the stabling point and in that situation I don't think one would've been provided. In earlier days, a wagon might've been parked at the end of that siding as a coal store for the signalbox. Looks like a nice spot for the 08 then Peter. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold mudmagnet Posted May 5, 2015 RMweb Gold Share Posted May 5, 2015 Impressive and rapid work there Andy! Just take it easy and don't go pushing yourself too much! I thought that you were going to build your own track ? Or have I missed something ? Having typed that, the flow of track through the points does look good though! Are you going to add point rodding ? Your work rate puts mine to shame ! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew P Posted May 5, 2015 Author Share Posted May 5, 2015 Hi Richard, see the bottom of post #78 re the trackwork. And thanks I am taking it easy because I'm enjoying it so much more than Bitton, and really looking forward to its operation.Not sure about Point rodding yet, I feel the Ratio/Wills one is a tadge over scale, so if I do any it will be with Brass Rod or Plastruct. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold mudmagnet Posted May 5, 2015 RMweb Gold Share Posted May 5, 2015 Hi Richard, see the bottom of post #78 re the trackwork. And thanks I am taking it easy because I'm enjoying it so much more than Bitton, and really looking forward to its operation. Not sure about Point rodding yet, I feel the Ratio/Wills one is a tadge over scale, so if I do any it will be with Brass Rod or Plastruct. Oops, should have read the bottom of that post more closely! Studying the photos too closely to read properly! At the end of the day (it gets dark......), you need to enjoy yourself and feel comfortable with your modelling. I tend to agree with your comments re the plastic point rodding. I bought a pack myself a while ago to have a look and not yet used them. Might look OK with code 100 and look off scale, as you suggest, against code 75. The MSE stools etc does look good, but fiddly and relatively expensive. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Highlandman Posted May 6, 2015 Share Posted May 6, 2015 Hi Andy I am looking forward to watching the progress on this layout. I am amazed at the amount of work you have got done in such a short space of time. You put me to shame. The track layout should provide some really good operating sequences so the follow button has been pressed and I await the next installment with bated breath. Great work Andy Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted May 6, 2015 Share Posted May 6, 2015 ...this is the one our O Gauge Guys did, which I'm told is typical Midland but some Guys said that many in the Midland and elsewhere in the UK were as you have depicted above, or with a single board on the outside and then filled with sand. Thanks for that Andy. Looks good. Prototypical or not, it makes for an unusual feature. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
westerner Posted May 6, 2015 Share Posted May 6, 2015 Andy, Good luck with this new venture. I hope it satisfies you more than Bitton did. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jock67B Posted May 6, 2015 Share Posted May 6, 2015 Morning mate, I know you said you'd be absent for a few days but I've only just stumbled on the thread from the link at the bottom of one of your posts on George's 'BS'! My excuse is having been off sick!! Apologies for all the ratings to everyone as I've just trawled through and I must say you have achieved a remarkable amount in such a short time. HOWEVER, I do hope you have learned your lesson and are not pushing yourself too hard - remember what happened last time! I got to Mick's comment on the trackwork before I realised you'd passed on 'self built' for this project and I can't wait to see the Peco all ballasted and coloured as I intend using similar, but modified like Ray(tender)'s on his Camel Quay thread. I hope you've saved the beautiful points that you and Jason produced for use on the next project? Jeff offered good advice and it does no harm to be reminded that it is your baby to do with what you like! Hope the politicking wasn't too stressful and I've now 'followed' this thread - can I safely assume that the Bitton one won't be getting any more input from you and 'un-follow it now? Really looking forward to the next episode, Kind regards, Jock. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
60012 Commonwealth of Australia Posted May 6, 2015 Share Posted May 6, 2015 Hi Bodgit, Great work so far! Looking forward to seeing more progress. Peter Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
D1059 Posted May 6, 2015 Share Posted May 6, 2015 Interesting - look forward to seeing this one progress Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Alister_G Posted May 6, 2015 RMweb Gold Share Posted May 6, 2015 What's this? A new thread by AndrewP and I haven't seen it!! :nono: Blimey, I don't log on to RMWeb for a couple of days and you're up to page 4 already Nice one mate, it looks much more like a Bodgit layout, and you're obviously enjoying it, looking forward to more! :locomotive: Al. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rob D2 Posted May 6, 2015 Share Posted May 6, 2015 I'm sure I've seen a picture of a 47 off the road in a sand drag at Dorchester west... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian D Posted May 6, 2015 Share Posted May 6, 2015 Stone me, Andy. Slow down a bit mate - you put the rest of us to shame. Here's me bought some track last week and still not laid it, still faffing about with the control panel Seriously, all the best with this project. As long as you are fit and happy then that is the best place for you to be. Best wishes, Brian. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marcus 37 Posted May 6, 2015 Share Posted May 6, 2015 I'd be inclined NOT to have a sand drag Andy. Locos will only be coming slowly out of the stabling point and in that situation I don't think one would've been provided. In earlier days, a wagon might've been parked at the end of that siding as a coal store for the signalbox. Not true unfortunately. Kidderminster turn back siding has a sand drag which is 5mph so perfectly feasible. Marcus Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zomboid Posted May 6, 2015 Share Posted May 6, 2015 There are other examples knocking around without a sand drag. The turnback at West Worthing, for example has no sand drags. Or didn't last time I saw. And similarly at Gillingham (Dorset), that has a very similar arrangement to Andy's, with no sand drag. I'm sure more examples either way could be found. If Andy fancys modelling a sand drag, there's real-world justification. If not, there's also justification. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marcus 37 Posted May 6, 2015 Share Posted May 6, 2015 Sand drags are basically used where you wouldn't want a train to derail onto an adjacent line or down an embankment. For instance at Small Heath goods loop where it is in the middle of two running lines you wouldn't want a train to derail on a set of trap points and become foul of oncoming traffic. So there is some justification as to where you would or not would not find one. Luckily, touch wood, I've had the good fortune to never find myself in one! Marcus Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zomboid Posted May 6, 2015 Share Posted May 6, 2015 Sand drags are basically used where you wouldn't want a train to derail onto an adjacent line or down an embankment. For instance at Small Heath goods loop where it is in the middle of two running lines you wouldn't want a train to derail on a set of trap points and become foul of oncoming traffic. So there is some justification as to where you would or not would not find one. Luckily, touch wood, I've had the good fortune to never find myself in one! Marcus Absolutely, though design rules change as time passes, and things change. If they were building the turnback at Gillingham in 2015 it would no doubt look different to the thing they built many years ago (presumably in the early 90s when the 159s were introduced on the route, but that's definitely a tangent). So the question is really, when is it imagined that the spur in question was built? And what were the rules then? And what does Andy feel like building Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Ray H Posted May 6, 2015 RMweb Premium Share Posted May 6, 2015 My possibly flawed understanding of the use of sand drags is that they help to retard a trains progress and slow it down before colliding with the buffer stops thereby lessening the impact. I can think of a few places where they've been used on LT at the (departure) end of platform tracks. Presumably the task there being to supplement the train stop in arresting a train's progress if the driver starts up against a red signal. Such a train would invariably be carrying passengers so a derailment wouldn't be too desirable (nor would colliding with the buffer stops!). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marcus 37 Posted May 6, 2015 Share Posted May 6, 2015 Most of them are waste bins these day Mickey. Since the advent of TPWS they have become almost redundant. Leamington Spa's bay platform is exactly the same. Come into fast now and the TPWS will get you so not much chance of going through the buffers. Anything above 10mph usually. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marcus 37 Posted May 6, 2015 Share Posted May 6, 2015 Absolutely, though design rules change as time passes, and things change. If they were building the turnback at Gillingham in 2015 it would no doubt look different to the thing they built many years ago (presumably in the early 90s when the 159s were introduced on the route, but that's definitely a tangent). So the question is really, when is it imagined that the spur in question was built? And what were the rules then? And what does Andy feel like building I thought Andy wanted a sand drag??? Now I'm confused as I thought someone told him he couldn't.Believe it or not though, the turn back at Kidderminster was only put in in the last ten years and they put in a brand new sand drag as it was still manually signalled at the time. A driver I know did accidentally end up in the sand drag and just to further his embarrassment he was further ridiculed by the other drivers asking if he had brought along his bucket and spade. Anyway Andy, sand drags or no sand drags the layouts coming along a treat mate, at a great rate of knots as well. Pardon the pun but it is based near Plymouth. Cheers Marcus Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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