hayfield

Care to share where these places are?

A total lucky find and from experience not to be repeated at the same place. The dealer certainly knew how to charge for Dinkey and Hornby clockwork, and as I said 2 floors down there is a shop selling new RTR models. It was one of the shops in Battlebridge, I must add though everything else at all stalls/mini shops were overprices and or not would be of interest to modellers, got the feeling had the boxes had Airfix/Triang/Hornby/Dublo labels they would have been dearer

I think its just a case of going into second hand and charity shops and keeping an eye open, quite often on eBay its either estate sales or house clearances where the cheap gems arise and badly or incorrectly listed

I surmise you could pretty much double your money if you were to flog that on eBay.

No chance, I bought 2 GWR clearstory coaches from  Blacksmith's 40+ years ago. Both are partly made, but at the time I did not have either the skills or correct tools to build them. Now have a 3 coach train. The other two will give me some practice soldering the smaller detail parts

Here's an old previously broken L/H curved point rebuilt to 18.83mm gauge (notice I haven't said P4 or S4, cos I use slightly coarser frog clearances, to save a lot of wheel-changing). I'll be getting a lot of incoming flack now, where's my tin hat?

Cheers, Brian.

 

 

What a great way of using parts of a broken turnout, doesn't have to be in P4 or EM but could be recycled into an 00 gauge turnout, certainly answers the question what do I so with my old code 75 turnouts

Handsomely said, Phil, but it seems that any new-product thread has to endure a minority of naysayers and those who wish to pour cold water, or see quite clearly how it could have been done better. As you say, in the meantime, the rest of us look, learn and maybe invest.

Don't forget that it was those who constantly complained about 3.5 mm scale H0 track being sold to 4 mm scale modellers in 00 gauge that got you this product, plus of course the prospect of competition.

I do however agree with you about those who knock the product for the sake of it, but constructive comments is the way things improve,which is a benefit to all.

Excellent modelling and well worth posting, TVM, but I am a bit baffled why it is in the Product/Trade area?

Oop's. Just saw Narrow gauge and not that its in a trade area. No idea how to alter the area to list it in

I was dragged into one of those second hand shops described as an antique centre, fascinated by brand new  Swarovski or similar branded clocks which both plat tunes and have the clock faces spinning round on the hour. Found a model railway shop though but it was closed. Then there was a shop selling 0 gauge Tinplate stock and Dinky cars, but on the bottom shelf there was a Roxey Mouldings GWR 4 wheeled Metro brake second kit for £10, then saw a Blacksmiths GWR 50' all third clearstory coach for £20, finally a MSE GWR/ Taff Vale horse box for £10. Bank card came straight out. All 3 etched kits and untouched, Did not have the neck to ask for bulk discount. 

Also found a garden centre/ nursery we have been looking for which has very competitive prices, its set up really for wholesale (landscape gardeners) than retail with prices reflecting this

I spent a pleasant few minuets chatting about the locos with the owner/builder as I am fascinated with double ended/cabbed locos. He explained the bodies are built from plasticard and use ready to run chassis

Is there also a possibility that they will gain sales from those contemplating going to EM - but now happy with the improved appearance of the BH points compared to previous 00 offerings?

 

Cheers,

Mick

I think it is certainly going to have a very positive effect in all areas, many will want to replace H0 scale turnouts, others will want to start a new layout bases on 4 mm scale track. Then I expect a rise in track building/modifying as 00 scale modellers will want turnouts and crossings in differing sizes and formats. A few realising the dramatic effect that increasing the scale has had will want to go further in increasing the gauge.

All of this is good for both modellers and Peco as I suggested many months ago it will be the new must have within the ready to run part of the hobby and has created a new market to complement the existing range of flatbottom track, which I believe will carry on being supported by H0 modellers elsewhere 

Now will we get a range of 4 mm scale 00 gauge flatbottom track ?

Well. I will look forward to seeing what I can do with this. A simple Comet set of frames will replace the broken ones.

Why not have a chat with  Horsetan who might be willing to buy the inside motion off you. Item now wrapped up and will be in the post first thing in the morning, thank you for buying it

I guess there must be 20 boards in total, but only one more as complex as this one, so the others should move a lot quicker.  Most of the pointwork is already built and some of the boards are just plain track or a single cross over.  The other end of ET station is almost a mirror image of this one.

 

One area I had overlooked and it took a while to trace the short was the few inches after the frog where the copper clad sleepers are interlaced.  This is fine where the isolation gap is after the interlace area as it's then all the same polarity dependant on the Tortoise switching.  This hadn't happened to me before and it took a lot of head scratching to work this one out.  Where you have two turnouts in quick succession, there has to be an isolation gap and without thinking about it, I made the cut between the two.  I suspect with a little more thought, it could be made in an area that wouldn't be obvious or alternately I could gap the sleepers outside the rail section.

 

I'll give it some more thought over the weekend, but have to admit it was a real b*gger trying to find the short when I knew all the wiring etc was correct.

 

Another lesson learned....

Its strange that no matter how many turnouts you build every now and again something new crops up

I now use a slower method on the few copperclad turnouts I build, which is after cutting the timbers to length, I use a felt tip pen to mark the isolation gaps. Then using a junior hacksaw I gap the timbers first (it is also easier to fill the gaps at this stage and sand flat) With the timbers gapped I can solder the rails and check the crossings with a loco as they are being built 

Out of interest where about is he based?

The address is on the website

125 Reaver House 12 East Street Epsom KT17 1HX Phone 01372 748490

I think with hind sight Phil would agree with you, plus I think how he imagined the business would run in practice was a bit wrong and he is taking steps to remedy the issue

For the last year or more Peter was trying to sell the business, so all investment was stopped. There is now a massive catch up to be made to take the business forward and its Phil's intention is to improve the products in many areas. You are right he needs to get things straight as quickly as possible. On the other hand like all small businesses he has to keep lots of balls in the air at the same time.

The business needs to go back to a cottage industry style, so profits can be made to invest into the product range. The first job is to get a reliable yet easy to use trading method working, this will benefit all, going to shows will be an important aspect of this.

Its a pity I live so far away from him as there are a few things I could have helped with, having said this I do plan to go and see him and give him a hand in a couple of areas

Again if anyone has a specific issue send me a PM and I will try and assist. 

Mind you , with the recent price increases, building a fully chaired turnout is rapidly approaching the £20 mark.

The last time I bothered to calculated the cost the parts varied between £12 to £15 per turnout

Question..  When ordering and paying by bank xfer, It says at the top to pay when he has picked it and sent an invoice, but at the bottom of the page it gives you the info and tells you to pay now as does the email you get after placing an order?  Which method has everyone else done?

Interesting observation. I just left it with waiting for the email that comes once packed and ready to pay. Maybe this is where it's all going wrong

 

So if we had ordered and paid straight away we would all have our goodies by now ?

 

I suspect I am thinking along the same lines as others. Here is our order, send us an email for payment as instructed if you want our business you will be in touch. No malice against the guy and we all want his business to thrive and supply us what we want

I had a chat with Phil on Tuesday, the way he had hoped the system would work was not as seamless as he had hoped and in fact there was an issue with part of the email system being being affected by something else owned by the previous owner being turned off, at this moment it would be wise to give Phil a call whilst the new system is being bedded in 

Could do with a B8/9 point, the double slip , i hope is bigger than the code 75 one, long wheel base loco seem to slow down a bit running through the one i had on my layout.

The clever part of the existing design of Peco turnouts is the compatibly of the different sizes if crossings and turnouts within the range, I believe this is done by using identical crossing angles and changing the length of the switch, would this still work with larger turnouts? 

I have had a chance to catch up with Phil, he mentioned that he is trying to work through a backlog of enquiries and orders. Unfortunately unknown to Phil a system of C&L which when turned off affected the incoming emails. Phil is now working through what he has but is finding some of the customer email addresses are missing, might be worthwile giving him a call if you are still waiting 

Having recently built a very small 7mm shelf layout with 4 turnouts, 2 tracks and circa 3m in length using C&L/Exactoscale products I have to say the overall cost was much higher than originally estimated. This was mainly due to having to buy many more components than actually required and ending up with a large surplus of parts which will not be used but had to pay for in order to complete layout.

 

I believe The higher costs were introduced before the sale of C&L Finescale and the high cost of Exactoscale Fishplates compared to a large bag of Chairs were really expensive for such a small number of parts and this pushed the overall cost of the project upwards.

Greenmonkey

There is a simple solution, for some reason on eBay these will be fought over (especially as there are reported minor supply issues). Clear photo(s) with an accurate description, listed in the correct section will reap rewards. Regarding the cost it has been well reported why these and other components from other suppliers cost so much. How much did you pay for your last loco on 0 gauge ( I bought a cheap one and it was over £200)?

Hello,

        I think there is a serious risk using plastic chairs is fast becoming too expensive for hand built track to be a viable proposition for the average modeller. The costs involved in just building even a small layout using these methods means any chance for new younger modellers to start are very unlikely. I have bought these products in more economical times but some of the prices floating about now make this very unlikely for the future. Any plans for for a layout of significant magnitude are rendered non-viable due to financial considerations for many. I understand the need for a profit margin for any commercial activity but it would seem long term returns are no longer acceptable and such returns need to be instant. It does not bode well for the future that such attitudes are so prevalent.

Entrepreneurs in this day and age have my sympathies.

trustytrev.

Trustytrev

Using the components (making your own switches and crossings) you can build a turnout for about £15, far cheaper than buying Peco 00 gauge turnouts even from the discount houses. If would be far more expensive building a small layout let alone one of even modest magnitude 

Whilst I appreciate you want to get things running, most do start off buying a few bits at a time. I certainly agree with Nick that buying flexi track is much cheaper than set track

I can understand where Nick is coming from with second hand track, on the other hand it could be a solution and there are bargains to be had. Many of us use eBay and do get a few bargains. Just read the description and look at the photos

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/1-x-RH-3-x-LH-small-radius-Peco-Code-100-Insulfrog-points/322857329335?hash=item4b2bcbe2b7:g:eBgAAOSwQcJZ-Ltv

4 turnouts ending today, look OK with the exception of a few broken sleepers (could be repaired once laid and before ballasting

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/2-x-RH-2-x-LH-small-radius-Peco-Code-100-Insulfrog-points/322857333050?_trkparms=aid%3D444000%26algo%3DSOI.DEFAULT%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D48785%26meid%3Da99eb695e6ff41d4ad15600108c4800c%26pid%3D100752%26rk%3D3%26rkt%3D5%26sd%3D322857329335&_trksid=p2047675.c100752.m1982

Another 4 from the same seller, again a bit tired but these certainly get you started

Actually the price of 500 4mm scale chairs is £27.50 and £28.50 for 7mm scale ones. I'm sure that there used to be more of a price differential? Having said that, the labour costs are going to be very similar so the raw material cost is probably not a large proportion of the overall manufacturing cost.

In a supermarket shoppers complain larger boxes and cheaper pro-rata than smaller boxes of goods, as you say its the same cost to handle both

I would suggest all those threads that have had to be locked because a number of people seem to take great pleasure in posting on them how the new point isnt prototypical at all, because thats not how they did it at Swindon in the 1930s (or whatever).

 

Modellers in OO have been crying out for better point and track work for years. This is exactly what people have been asking for, and constant criticism of how tiny details are slightly incorrect are not going to encourage the manufacturer to expand the range. 

John

In one way I agree with you in another way I disagree, but we can beg to differ in opinion without falling out or being rude

This is a great step forward for 00 scale/gauge modellers, and hopefully the start of a decent size range. But it has only happened now because enough 00 scale modellers showed their dissatisfaction with what was on offer

I have used this analogy, if someone was commenting on a error with a loco would they suffer similar comments, if they stated a coupling rod was wrong. I doubt it

The turnout is not a direct replica of an actual prototype, so some details will differ for practicalities eg the tiebar. Perfectly acceptable in my book. Others will be due to era or regional differences, again perfectly acceptable. On the other hand why do the switch rails end between sleepers and not on a slide chair ?

There are other small details which most will either accept or just be unaware of. For me its just sloppy design as it would be just as easy to do correctly as it is to do it wrongly.

As I have said, a great move forward and hopefully the first of a large range, hopefully most will see this as constructive comment, not knocking either a product or producer 

This is what you call an untidy railway room

Thankfully the dividing wall (old kitchen into new extension) is being taken down on Friday along with another wall (which increases the size of the lounge) then I have a week to lay the floor in the extension before the plasterers arrive

Before anyone comments the electricians are back tomorrow to tidy up the wires, and central heating man will redirect the pipes (cavity in the floor) once the wall is down.

Could even have the room operational (well usable) before Christmas

Anybody know of somebody selling these on a website, not found any on the usual subjects ?

Merfyn

In one way this is the best news for all, Peco can now see the benefit of their investment in this product, which hopefully will lead to a new 00 scale range

Thinking about their(or was it their importers) advert calling it H0 track, there could be a new market in H0 for unifrog turnouts which would boost sales, all be it they are to 4 mm not 3.5 mm scale

The only reason that commercially ready built copperclad pointwork is cheaper is that the time involved to build them is much less than those built from mouldings. Mind you, if you are building them for the fiddle yard, you could economise on the number of timbers used.

Stephen

How very right you are, I can remember in the 60's it was very common to build the turnouts from copperclad in fiddle yards, this was for economic reasons. In addition only 1 out of every 3 timbers were used, resulting in a 2/3rds cost reduction in copperclad

The way costs can be reduced is to use ply timbers and RTR flexi track, fine for home layouts but for portable ones I would strongly advise the use of plastic timbers for a belt and braces approach

If I were reviewing a loco and mention certain discrepancies I doubt if too many would object, so hopefully these thoughts will be taken in the same manner.

LET ME SAY ITS A VAST IMPROVEMENT ON THEIR H0 offerings, and should be congratulated for taking notice of what 4 mm scale 00 modellers wanted

With the slide chairs they look very good, but why do the tip of the blades not stop on the first slide chair ?

The block chairs in the 3PL and 4PL positions are excellent, but why are the last 2 slide chairs which should have the inside chair against the stock rail not been modelled (easy fix though)

The common crossing chairs differ to the style I am used to. I could be a copy of a different style though