letterspider

REDBRIDGE

AFAIK the Class 74 orders were in a sense underwritten by Kernow and they have offered refunds. Dave says he is out of pocket because the company doing the CAD have taken his money and not delivered them. In the case of the ATP project monies are being managed by DToS but they are not going to offer refunds if this project fails - and considering the amounts involved I can't see Dave having pockets that deep. A lot of commentators on here are saying stop moaning, trust Dave etc. on this APT . Yeah I do trust him but we have now had our eyes open to the process of model manufacture which looks very murky like mafia dealings! Are those same people willing to dip into their pockets and bail him out for being robbed and fobbed by these bandits? I would say put your money where or mouth is - I will chuck in a fiver to Dave's pocket if you do.

Hey that is is smoke and mirrors!

Hi Dave perhaps you didn't understand - I want to keep my order perhaps I would even increase it to 10 sets but ironically it is the lack of fine detail which is the problem here. Are we going to be privy to any of the relevant details of this contract - how are you going to mitigate the risk this time - it could be a case of new supplier and same old problem yes? Can you guarantee that you have an agreement in place with your contractors down the line that would assure us that we receive the service that we are paying for?

I would go so far as to see it is a ruse by Elon Musk to divert attention away from the massive losses recently announced by Tesla. The test track looks like it has had hundreds of millions of dollars poured into it but if what you say is true then it could have been cobbled together for a lot less than a million dollars. That would work out very cheap for publicity that could fool and assure investors. I would expect Saatchi and Saatchi would charge considerably more!

[Puts on tin hat and ducks behind sand bags] I have placed my interest into the APT-P but I am withdrawing my order - with a lot of reluctance. I would recommend crowdfunders read the DJM Class 74 thread and consider very carefully the very high risks involved If Dave is employing the same company to work on the tooling, then the possibility of them taking his money yet again without providing the service are incredibly high. It would also be seen by outside observers as incredibly reckless for him if he did go back to the same company. I also get the feeling, considering how often the delivery timescales of the major manufacturers are slipping back, that they are also having problems with the way business apparently is being conducted in China. What hope then for the little fish? I am reluctant now to commit myself to losing these sorts of sums without assurances. I understand in normal business practice it is natural that Dave does not reveal to his competitors where he is going to get this work done, however I cannot see now that he has much of a choice if he is going to maintain the confidence of crowdfunders who don't have tunnel vision and bottomless pockets. His competitiors probably know anyway. I am happy to be proven wrong - and I hope this does project does find its way and gets past the finishing line.

I have to say that what I have read on this thread about the Class 74 development has caused me tremendous alarm. I have a lot of faith in DJM and want to see his designs come to fruition but my personal feeling is that a lot of observers are going to see it as highly reckless to take money from crowdfunders and pass it on to a 3rd party to carry out work without any assurances they won't just take the money and walk. In a time where industrial espionage is commonplace and the truth is perhaps stranger than the conspiracy theories, I wonder whether Dave should give some thought as to whether his opponents in the business field have decided to take him out of competition. For example I think we need to be very, very concerned if (for example) Hornby announce a Class 74 in a few days time. It is completely unacceptable to pay upfront and not receive a service - this is not classified as good business practice wherever or whoever you are and I would walk away from any business which conducts itself in such a manner. I would like Dave to consider what might be achievable if everyone who signed up for the Class 74 put pressure onto the company by using social media, because even the most selfish businessman wants to avoid bad publicity. I think also the Department of Trade should be involved - if they seriously want Britain to play in the global playing field they need to maintain a database of bad companies like this one (same as the Financial Authority does in the UK). Then investors can check up in advance if a company is blacklisted. This also would act as a deterrent for rogue companies, particularly if they were sanctioned against. Again this is somewhere where us investors can help and support through social media. This is how WE CAN CHANGE and WE MUST CHANGE the way business operates, after all we can always walk away.

What I don't understand is - the tooling. Dave says this will be a one off, so if nobody else has any objections - I am going to put in first dibs for the tooling...

I am also impatient to play with this model!

I hope this isn't down to a last minute undiscovered quality control issue discovered at Margate. If so full credit to Hornby to sort it out before general release. In the meantime here is a Class 87 photo to cheer everyone up https://farm5.static.flickr.com/4432/36775263412_6954da2ec3_b.jpg It could be in the thread 'photos of the real thing which look like models'

Seems to me that if Hyperloop may move objects at Hypersonic speeds,perhaps may be better suited for lanching stuff into space?

Thanks don't suppoe you have another one of those...?

Send him a cheque - guess the amount compared to other products and if you have overpayed give him your Paypal address for a refund. Otherwise suggest how he can make up the difference with some glazing. I would think he may even give yhou some products on approval if you give him a nod on this website here. I promise you that this will be the easiest and quickest way. A satisfied customer.

Upper Holloway was closed last month

Short hop to Finchley Road

from wavering in Havering all the way to Haringey GOBLIN via Barking to to enjoy a sunny day in UPPER HOLLOWAY

A big thank you to all the advice on this forum. I can confirm that a cheque, SAE and and order list resulted in all of the items arriving within a matter of days!

Okay that didn't work out so well. Why not try again, have a lavish dinner party and TURNHAM GREEN with envy

You'll need something to cook that lot - I'd recommend a short walk to WOOD LANE

This was on Bargain Hunters nearly a week ago

From Leicester (Square) to Oxford (Circus)

The APT seems to be the most troubled prototype in the world - even the models have problems. I admit I am nervous about coughing up £1000 notes but the thought of the Police knocking on my door - I can't back out now..!

from underground to undercover ... Vauxhall Cross

Okay - can see an opportunity to jump from Victoria station to the Victoria line and according to the Pantone regulations the closest move I can make turns out to be onto the DISTRICT LINE, believe it or not

In reply to the above movement of money generates wealth and consumer opinion is now recognised as one of the prime market forces of all. Dapol Class 73's now selling at £75 mark after 3 years on the shelf - not good. With the benefit of hindsight - getting that cash flow back to the manufacturer quicker could have beaten the exchange rate fluctuations that are seeing costs and RRP rise and get out a second batch by now = Dapol could have been in a better finanical situation. No at all intention to slag off Dapol - I think they are a great manufacturer but unfortunately they engaged modellers in this thread with the Class 73 process and it did not have the happiest ending. Not to worry - managing failures is where success comes from. Handling of Class 68 livery errors was done well. Well done Dapol. Now it is time for everyone to buy more of their stock - looking forward to next batch of Class 73's