Norton961

In the early 1960s there were regular Banana trains from Barry in South Wales and Shrewsbury allocated Jubilees were used on a regular basis. I think the trains went to Crewe and beyond. David

Anyone had a look at the wheels/axle/gear wheel as a precursor to converting to P4? Given the wheels are the same as the 57xx and Ultrascale do a conversion set, will the Ultrascale set fit? David

Does the fitting of DCC make a difference? Does the chip need to be matched to the motor? David

I would have ordered one of these, but the power train is a no no to convert to P4. It’s an expensive way to have a loco when buying the RTR .loco and then a Mike Edge chassis. So I am buying one of the Victory class to be introduced by Planet as it has a conventional power train. David

My understanding is that Hattons no longer sell new Bachmann. I had to order my 94xx from Rails. David

On the basis that you may be using the vice for many years I would search for a quality jewellers vice second hand on say EBay. I bought the attached from a modelling colleague for £40.00. Mounted on an IKEA bread board cut down. David

I thought the problem was not the motors but the fact that the gearboxes are too stiff, giving the motor a really hard time. So perhaps check how stiff the gearboxes are before just replacing the motor. David

Withdrawal by a list sent from Control was not confined to the Clans. Sheffield Millhouses was told to withdraw all its re built Patriots and re built Scots on a given date. This annoyed the sheds boiler smiths as they were in the process of completing a. re tube one of the re built Patriots. Because the shed was now in the Eastern Region the locos were not transferred away. The Caprotti Stanier Black 5s suffered a similar fate, Control instructed all sheds that no money was to be spent on any repairs. Southport received a loco a week out of Crewe works which needed some adjustment to the brake gear, this was not authorised and the loco withdrawn 2 weeks after leaving Crewe works.

David, which loco are you modelling as there are lots of differences in balance weights. Some locos had Stanier style balance weights some on all wheels, some only on one or two axles. Let me know and I will sort out some photos. David

Dave, I know you like a challenge! What are you doing for a Crank axle and what wheels are you using? David

I found giving any recent Hornby loco a coat of Klear darkens and brightens up the flat colour. You can apply with a brush. You won’t believe the difference. David

Re. Neil Phillips and photo credits for using photos in a book, I am the guilty party as the author of the Class 24/25 book. I always take great care to credit photographers but sometimes there is no name on the back and more than once the publisher ( Ian Allan) would slip in a photo after I submitted the text and photos so the first time I would see the photo was when it was published. I once had a very irate letter from Chris Croft’s berating me for using one of his photos without credit, I sent him the photo which was blank on the back! I to have seen photos I took appearing for sale on eBay, David

Re D1733 and the logos, I have a photo taken at Wellington (Salop) working on a Birkenhead to Paddington service in 1964 proving the red on white logos were used in revenue service, even if only for a short period. David

The only source for a Stanier 3500 gallon tender is the Brassmaster etched version, there is no RTR version. K,s did one many years ago but the rivet pattern is all wrong. ( I have one). David

The type of repair would dictate whether a loco was repainted, a “casual” definitely not, an “ intermediate” which did not require the boiler to be taken out of the frames ( and therefore the boiler cladding not being removed) probably not. An intermediate would involve the wheels and motion dismantled and the wheels out of the frames but the boiler would remain in situ. When the revised tender coat of arms appeared in 1957 some locos still had the early emblem into 1964 so 73025 was still running with this, indicating it had been through works without being repainted. At least one rebuilt Scot withdrawn in 1963 was still carrying the early coat of arms at withdrawel.

BR issued an edict in December 1963 To all works overhauling steam locos that all locos needed re painting were to be painted in plain black for those classes that had been previously lined out and the same applied to green locos ( Jubilees and Britannia’s, Ivatt class 2s et) that were previously lined out. Some works were a little slow in following the new instruction and St Rollox works was still lining out locos into early 1964. 45312 was seen ex works from Cowlairs on 22-March 1964. A few Jubilees received the plain green and all the Brittanias although if you scrapped the green paint of the previous lining was revealed underneath. The green used was also a slightly different colour being more of a Khaki green. Only 1 BR standard 5 was painted plain black. Some locos went into works lined out and were not repainted so retained lining when they left works, a cleaning being all that was required. Some Black 5s retained lining until the end of steam in 1968.

One of the issues with the Brits was how to drive them. When they went to Holyhead they were not liked by the crews who preferred the re built Scots and Patriots. Because of complaints a loco inspector travelled with the crews from Holyhead. He noticed that they were being driven on a partial regulator ( as per the Scots). On the next trip he suggested they use full open regulator and drive on the cut of. Result, the train shot out of the station! so like lots of new classes they needed a different driving style, drivers don’t like change!

I think Chris Gibbons of High Level is planning a P4 chassis kit. David

Mike I feel your pain, as I have some of the revised livery wagons (and I sponsered the production of the transfers!). But like you I cant prove its a post grouping change and so far no one else can so as you say Rule 1 applies. David

The Lilleshall Co wagon livery appears to change I think after the Grouping with the lettering changing from plain Lilleshall Co, Shropshire to the full Lilleshall Co Ltd with Glazed Bricks, Coal and underneath Pig Iron and Steel sections, Shifnal Shropshire. There are few pfhotos of this later livery and all appear to have been taken in the 1930s leading me to think its a post grouping change. Attached is a photo taken in the 1930s at Hadnall station and shows a Lilleshall Co wagon in the background. Further down the line a LC (standing for Littleton Colliery) liveried wagon can be seen. Cant quite make out the livery of the wagon next to the Lilleshall one though.

Interesting about the GWR buying loco coal from collieries near the various depots. The Lilleshall Co in Shropshire had a contract with the GWR to supply Loco coal and I presume that would go to the sheds at Wellington, Much Wenlock and possibly Shrewsbury. Wrexham shed would be provided by the local collieries. The LNWR also had a contract with the Lilleshall Co so that would supply Trench, Coalport and again possibly Shrewsbury (LNWR side). They might also have supplied Stafford. The railway companies did not want the cost of shipping coal over long distances if decent coal was available local to the shed. David

Robin, love the weathering on the sand dryer. David

Ian Rathbone has suggested mixing a colour, Humbrol No 9 Tan and No 69 Gloss Yellow mixed 50-50 and then add a tiny drop of green. This gives a khaki colour. As an alternative Precision Ochre Brown or MGNR Golden Gorse. David

Ian, thanks for that very helpful. My friend ( who owns the Milk Van ) will probably give me some more Midland vans to do. David

The odd Stanier 3500 gallon tenders appeared behind Rebuilt Scots ( 2 of them I think) and 8Fs. David