MidlandRed

I was under the impression that at least some of them were delivered via the Great Central, Banbury, Oxford, Didcot to Swindon (there are photos on Flickr of various class members on delivery). The batch allocated to the Lickey as bankers didn’t move there until the mid 60s, taking over from D69xx locos - however some of those Hymeks appeared on parcels workings in the Birmingham area, but after the timeframe specified.

Especially the WCML Pullman sets in reversed livery - and how cool they looked - especially the Manchester one which was a whole train of them (in contrast the WR Pullman units very definitely looked rail grey after repainting from Nanking Blue). Im tending to agree the trim on E3028/36/44 is white - I think colour rendition from 60s slides plays tricks dependent on light conditions and the shapes/angle of the surfaces of the objects concerned. Interesting that E3100 was not present in storage at Bury when I visited on 28/8/69 - E3028, 36 and 44 all were. The only other class AL3 or class AL4 missing was E3043 (at Rugby at the time). Severely fire damaged AL2 E3055 was there as well.

I think there was a photo of E3036 from the other side, at Chester. I would think E3028 ran in service in that condition for a while - class 83 didn’t get stored until later than the 84s - I tend to agree E3036 and E3044 didn’t run in service in repainted form!

As did the FTSE 100 generally, although it started at a 52 wk high.

Yeah sorry I’ve altered my post. I don’t think any rail blue with blue cab tops had syp. However the question with the odd AL4 rail blue repaint (E3036) was whether the cab tops were rail grey - some Flickr photos appeared in a thread on RMWeb of the loco at an exhibition at Chester and they don’t look white. Of course, class AL4 was largely stored after 1967 - E3044 got repainted in the overall rail blue with fye and became the exhibition loco, appearing at various exhibitions and open days. Apparently E3028 got repainted rail blue, syp, white or rail grey cab tops/window surrounds etc as a result of collision damage - that wasn’t in service that long before storage of the class in the later 60s also. It’s interesting to note that 225 new mk 2 coaches (blue and grey) were ordered by April 1965, and allocated (much to the annoyance of ER and WR whose provision was delayed as a result) to the WCML electrification - thus all trains thereon from early 1967 (except catering vehicles and BGs - which were 100 mph capable and repainted blue and grey) comprised the new stock with (in the case of AL6 hauled trains, which many passenger trains were) rail blue locos.

AL6s were rail blue from the start (first delivered in 1965) - as for roof and window surround colours, I thought these were white. However there was a thread on here where photos of AL4 E3036 repainted rail blue with syp, and E3028 similar, were posted and certainly with E3036 the rooves looked to be rail grey. E3044 was repainted early on also but was one of the first in all over rail blue with fye. All repaints after late 1966 got the rail blue cab tops and with fye and yellow window surrounds. So taken was I with these that I repainted my Hornby Dublo E3002 accordingly (and renumbered it E3016). My other one remained electric blue but got syp added and was weathered (yes I hear the groans - I still groan about it but I was about 10 yrs old at the time - one has its original pink box and instructions etc as well). As for DMU cab tops, this became generally a WR feature. I always wondered whether BRCW, past whose works eventually to be class 116 and 122 passed every few minutes, copied the white cab tops. The white tops on WR repaints stopped when the fye versions started (early 67 from Swindon). So 55005 got rail blue, fye wrap around over the cab doors and roof coloured cab tops, whereas 55000, 8 and 15 all got the syp, red buffer beam, white cab top with rail blue. Whilst there were other units in the era up to 1966 with white cab tops most were WR (or built at Swindon (eg class 124) or BRCW (some class 104 and 110). In common with most other classes, many AL locos got the FYE added to existing liveries in the later 60s. As to the AL loco livery, as well as part of the livery created/ influenced by the design panel as a design, I suspect the white elements were partially to make them more visible to staff on the track. Similarly for DMUs.

When I visited their stand at Warley they seemed very friendly, and were entertaining @Jenny Emily - they were all dressed in KR outfits with their names on - all impressive I thought. I know their Fell turned out not to be as detailed as some models at the high end are these days - however I personally know of several people who’ve bought them and are very pleased (warts - well perhaps more realistically, skin blemishes (dependent on your outlook) and all). I guess we should be thankful firms are willing to make models of such quirky prototypes.

However what Accurascale’s website doesn’t make very clear is you don’t have to pay anything up front for a pre order (they offer this as an option). So in effect the website does point the unwitting towards funding AS in advance. I do find these ‘dismantle a model maker’ threads extremely odd - well maybe not - armchair internet observers who think they know how to run someone’s firm better than they do is quite a popular pastime across the internet. KR Models appear to have committed an RMWeb cardinal sin - apparently (though as always it’s only conjecture) ignoring sage advice from RMWeb experts (noting they often disagree with one another as well). Whether that was in time to do anything about it is also unknown. Well I suppose it makes a change from object flinging at Hornby (and likely in reality the TV star himself). Meanwhile one would get the feeling as an occasional observer of this forum that the sun shines out of the proverbial of Accurascale - I’m an admirer of what they do but I’m sure they are not 100% perfect!! It sometimes makes me wonder whether some of the usual suspects (with the stone throwing at some firms) actually have more than a model making interest 😉

Definitely not a problem - imagine five different suppliers across 100 locos without such input - could have been worse than some of the modernisation plan diesel horrors (which could have been worse bearing in mind sketches/ proposals published in BR design books since - the Brush Type 2 original idea being one of the most terrible - the resultant class 30/1 with Design Panel input actually looks pretty good, say compared to the ‘Wonderloaf’). The reverence given to those AL1-5 electrics was phenomenal in the early 60s by enthusiasts in the LM area where they operated was massive - what’s not to like - iconic livery, tiny (in comparison to power) loco, iconic shape, generally 100 mph capable continuously - and the roar whilst stationary!!! The Blue Pullmans were a similar iconic train of the era - I guess sitting within an era of grey and soot they would all stand out. My favourite was the AL4, somehow slightly neater (especially the area around the headcodes) - no doubt these, followed closely by the AL3, were the most disliked by the engineers and operators owing largely to their reliability issues resulting from their mercury arc rectifiers.

I tend to agree - however my recollection of spotting in the early 60s was ‘pannier’ was the shout, in the same way ‘Semi’ was for a Coronation Pacific (when one came into view in the distance). I suspect of the pannier tanks around at that time, only the few remaining 94xx, or a 15xx might be particularly identifiable approaching from a distance (maybe also the smaller versions such as 16xx, 54xx, 64xx). Nonetheless I don’t recall there being nicknames for the various named ex GWR classes - presumably the official name being good enough. Whereas Brittania Pacifics were definitely ‘Brit’!! None of the WR names lent themselves to shortening in the same way!!

I agree with all of this except for the class 25 comment, apparently only really a failure on the WR - perhaps not entirely unsurprising as a product of Derby being imposed 😄 In fact on hauling trains from the Peak District, their rating for haulage exceeded an 8F and was commensurate with a 9F…. Even the less powerful class 24 (in multiple) replaced 9Fs on Consett iron ore trains (eliminating a banker also); pairs of these were also used on the Summers iron ore trains (Bidston) - so it’s not really clear what happened on the WR but perhaps the locos were thoroughly worn out by the time they got there (interestingly the newest three of all went to Ebbw Junction in the early 70s), or maybe the crews and operators lacked training in how to get the best out of them 🤪 (Apologies - thread drift). Some contributions to the class nicknames - Co Bo - Co Bo; Wonderloaf - you have to chuckle at the latter (dubbed by engine men in the north west of England) - their shape was much like an enlarged wonderloaf (1960/70s sliced loaf), and wonderful they were not, much of the time - so somewhat of an ironic nickname. Class 40 - these seem to have been universally known in the West Midlands by spotters in the early 60s as ‘Tats’ - not sure why. Peak (between D1 and D10) - one to tenner. The Semi name appeared to be used (by spotters) for all Coronation Pacifics. LMS 4F - Duck (again, West Midlands spotters and pre-dating the Rev Awdry loco of the same name but rather different) LMS 2MT tender loco - Mickey WR steam and diesel was far more orderly - Hall, Grange, Castle, Pannier, Western, Warship etc etc!!! Class AL1-AL6 - Elecky (during the period when steam, diesel and electric operated side by side on the WCML). I echo what was said by a previous poster - I was astonished at some of the nicknames for loco classes which appeared in early editions of Rail Enthusiast magazine, wondering whether some had been invented by the editorial staff!! However they seem to have stuck and become universal.

I dunno about all this, I was at Warley and thought Hornby had some great future OO models in EP form on what has to be described as a very impressive exhibition stand - with a large TT display. I’m a relatively recent returnee to railway modelling and RMWeb and am not used to the apparent queue of people who have lots of ideas for how Hornby should be running their business (although there was a very long running thread about them dealing with model shops - of which there aren’t that many these days other than very large including high volume on line operations, which also commission models (usually from Hornby’s competitors). This is not new on specialist hobby forums - pick almost any subject and they have people doing this, usually with extensive sage armchair/ keyboard advice for one or two specific manufacturers. A couple of points however - I noticed at Warley (first time I’ve ever been) and commented to my friends that the volume of elderly and grey haired visitors was extremely high and one guesses that it is these who buy the highly detailed OO scale models which Hornby participate in (I bought one of their superb 9Fs this year), but it seems there are several manufacturers vying for that market. I suspect Hornby are improving their offerings to remain in that market but are trying to appeal also to other demographics and particularly younger people or children (or parents/grand parents of them). The TT stuff looked really good to me. I’m guessing there’ll always be a market for highly detailed OO scale models but I just wonder for how long people of advancing years will be willing to buy ‘the ultimate Deltic’ etc etc?? I can’t help feeling this thread might be making a mountain out of a mole hill - surely Hornby’s major sales volume would be in the run up to Christmas - now if they’re making a loss then, perhaps it would be more worrying - however conjecture without all the info (which we are not party to) is simply that. Perhaps we should try and be a bit more positive about Hornby - as I said, I’m fairly recently back into this hobby and do find some of the negativity rather tiresome….. although some of the points made do make sense based on the conjecture.

Centre headcode versions of the class 37 - including proper 60s/70s WR versions (NB there were EPs of these at Warley) 😍

Until boundary changes in 1963, Yeovil Town to Pen Mill was Southern Region. There are people far more expert than me around these parts but I thought it was Western Region Bristol Division on transfer - certainly the two railbuses which were used to dieselise the service were allocated to Bristol but from mid 1966, as were the (soon to be) class 122 and 121 which replaced them (they were transferred to the Scottish Region in January 1967. However the two rail buses which were used on these services started on them at the end of December 1964, and were allocated from then until transfer to Bristol to Plymouth Laira (info from railcar.co.uk - it’s possible the service came under the Plymouth Division during that period (late 1964-mid1966).

I was forgetting the class 24s - often pictured at Kings Cross until the mid 60s - it was nearly 100% Brush 2s on the smaller diesel loco duties there by the time I spent time spotting at Kings Cross in the later 1960s - these were interspersed with the occasional Baby Deltic. I wonder whether any class 26 or dare I say……. class 21 had trip cocks pre FP (Hornsey)!

Extraordinary that the High Dyke branch tablet fitted batch (D5671 on) had trip cocks as well - I seem to recall them working trains to the north (eg Scunthorpe) - or were they originally London area locos for a time? It’s also extraordinary that 60+ locos required trip cocks initially!! Interestingly, the High Dyke locos appear to have gained several different styles of livery by the late 60s (from a number of photos in the Dave F’s photos thread). Plenty of scope there for livery variants on the High Dyke tablet equipment fitted models!

Yeah I remember, and very good they look too - I’ve never plucked up courage to redo mine - I don’t think it would be possible to match the paint colour if needed, so would require a respray. I’m just worried that having updated the model, Dapol wont be able to do blue liveried versions of this update with accurately placed numbers and symbols with the holders on the cab side.

Having spent many hours as a child there in the 1960s watching the cricket (my dad played for the team), but also train-spotting, pre, during and post electrification I can vouch for the fact that many balls were lost (and sometimes recovered) on and across the railway lines although I don’t recall the catenary (or any trains) being hit!! It was great for train spotting, and particularly when WCML trains were diverted via Wolverhampton, Bescot, Aston, Stechford, Coventry at weekends whilst the Trent Valley section was being electrified. Beyond the cricket pitch on the north-east side, next to the railway the archery club operated - I always gave it a wide berth but it always made me wonder if it was a little dangerous next to a railway track - the target boards were down in the south east corner so they fired adjacent to the oncoming north-westbound trains. In the area at the south east corner of the triangle was a railway served and operated water softening plant - there were manual signal boxes at the north west (replaced on electrification by the relay boxes seen in the Google image) and southern corners. I’m presuming access may have been gained by the signalmen via the edges of the cricket ground and across the boarded crossing - although I never saw that happen - if not via nearby over bridges (although I don’t recall pedestrian gates at either). Access (pedestrian) is gained via a boarded crossing of the south to north west arm of the triangle. I recall on one occasion a Stanier 8F hauled loaded ballast train which had been travelling on the southbound line was parked across the crossing for a period of hours, resulting in the entire pair of teams, supporters and ancillary staff (scorers, umpires etc) having to clamber over one of the ballast wagons - which at least had manual access at the end!

An example was on the Hornby stand at Warley - although I had to ask for directions to it amongst the other rather nice new EPs and the very impressive TT layout. The Coronation coaches (next to 46220) were particularly nice - maybe I was dazzled by the presence of the TV stars Simon Kohler and Montana!! 😁

I wish they would also do it without the crew name holder - then they could do the blue versions with numbers and logos correctly with the correct spacings. This affects all of the blue versions except those with logo on the body side (I.e almost all of them!!)

Looks great - also has the headboard clips so a Central Wales Line style lighting unit could be done. I didn’t see this or the Dapol later batch class 22 yesterday - a case of too much to see I think - didn’t see the Hornby Coronation initially either!!

I tend to agree - the large logo livery really suits the diesel classes it was applied to. Seeing all those class 50s at Crewe in the late 60s, some pristine straight after delivery, the older ones already quite dirty was a sight to behold - and particularly when new and shiny, those heavily rippled side panels made all the more obvious is an element not to be forgotten - I suspect no models have picked this particular facet up, however.

Love the D1960 - is this a TMC or other retailer one. Definitely of great interest 😀

I’m afraid I simply can’t unsee this, it looks so wrong!! Like a Hymek subjected to the loco equivalent of a 1970’s pro dart player diet 🤪 And surely it would have the broad green band a la class 25 and 47 thinking - those being the last new two tone green BR productions - the narrow low level sherwood green Of the Deltic/Hymek is a late 50s/early 60s design panel variant!! Nice idea though 😄 Love the D423, Accurascale - you would see 20+ of these a day at Crewe, 1968/9 onwards. Unfortunately they didn’t venture much south of Crewe until banishment to the WR!! 😉

And there was me thinking you were describing the subject of today’s announcement - your phrase sums it up perfectly and if I was in the market for an early BR vintage thoroughbred, 46220 in blue would fit the bill perfectly 😉😁 Im pleased to see other manufacturers including late 60s blue diesels in their new offerings as well - perfecto and likely to lighten the wallet (eventually)!! 😉