Legend

Really? I think I've seen it all now . Frankly I'd rather have the pair of marigolds!

Maintaining good customer relations has got to be one of the key priorities for a manufacturer, accepting that in most cases, unless you deal direct your contract is with the retailer. It seems though that Dapol have spectacularly failed by not replying to criticisms. I feel really sorry for people who so looked forward to this model and who are now disappointed . For me I have no interest in 73 but I have been monitoring the thread because I am interested in a 68. There's no way on earth I'm preordering a 68 until I establish if it runs well and is properly decorated.The complete lack of customer care from this manufacturer has completely put me off! Bad enough £100+ but would you spend £400+ on a "Black Label"loco with this mob ? I just don't think they have any notion of customer care

Nah, got to be a McIntosh 812! Still this does look like a nice model and I think it could be joining my GWR collection.

Rapido could still do a Mk3 . I think they are likely to do one for the prototype HST . I can't imagine anyone just producing the power car. They could do a very highly detailed one at a price, catering for that market (Rapido can have low production runs which would probably cater for the High Fidelity market). I see the Oxford one as competing for the Middle market , where people like running trains and are not too bothered at pipes underneath etc . It will have to be competitively priced given the relative low cost of Hornby versions, especially when sold in Bundles direct by Hornby

Yep think I'm up for collecting these. Are they mainly NB prototypes?

Yes I'm thinking this is the best chance for Scotrail variants

Well let's wait see. Seems a shame it's the shopkeeper or Customer that will be doing the QC checks again

Sounds like the Clayton debacle all over again. Is there no such thing as individual loco testing either at Heljan or the manufacturer?

Is there actually a Hornby announcement? You sure it's not someone being a touch ironical? Hornby did make an announcement last year just ahead of Bachmann but I haven't seen anything mentioning this year

Well , thanks to the Bargain Hunters thread , ordered 42xx @ £60 from Hawkins Bazaar on Wednesday. Amazingly good service it arrived on Thursday. Finally got to run it today. What a superb locomotive. Smooth running , after a spell of running in , got her crawling round my layout with 20 mineral wagons . No problem at all. Really impressed both with the service and the loco.

Other costs have not been increasing by 17% over the last two years either but that hadn't stopped Bachmann. And in fact in some cases prices have increased by more than 17% , I'm thinking Pressflo for instance. Still let's wait and see. Know anything else that's increased by such an extent over the last two years, during falling oil and raw material prices............no me neither! Still convinced it's not about increasing margins to European Levels? If everyone accepts such price increases that's where they will go.

If an Autocoach which has no DCC gubbins and is actually a pretty plain and straightforward coach comes in at £69.95 I think you'll find the DBSO will come in more expensive. Bachmann have clearly established they can get away with charging more for "specialised " vehicles hence the inspection Saloons and Autocoaches, even though the last would in my opinion be a very popular model, if priced correctly.I wouldn't be surprised if the DBSO ends up in the £80 range. Of course that's way too expensive for me. I'm hoping this will release a trickle of converted Airfix DBSO s that I'll be able to pick up relatively cheaply. I just need it to top and tail a repainted Jouef set and I don't need the DCC bits. Something much simpler will do for me.

My fear is the cost of the DBSO which I do want but not at silly prices.

I suppose it depends if you need it in the next 2-3 years. If you do, go Hornby. Recent gestation periods for Bachmann models have been very long eg Stanier 2-6-0, mk2 coaches ,class 158 . No reason to believe the 121/117 will be any different even though a lot of preliminary work done by Kernow. So if you need it now I'd really get the Hornby one

Only if you pay them. Still plenty of bargains around and as Black 5 Bear let's see what happens when they are on the shelves for a while.

Great pics. Very atmospheric layout.

Surprised the LB&SCR umber version has not sold better. Perhaps there is a contributory factor in that Bachmanns massive price hikes have put people off collecting pre grouping models as a side line. I had the intention of collecting pre grouping locos but it ended with the L&Y tank ( Locomotion models)as I felt that continuing the collection would be prohibitive and I wasn't really likely to run them.

As Zunnan pointed out earlier it's going to be really interesting reading the mag reviews on this. Such is the level of disquiet on here on various issues , and I'm sure on other forums , you would have thought to give their readers a comprehensive review they will investigate some of the issues or at least mention them .

Well ordered my Rood Ashton Hall from Hornby direct @£79 and it arrived last week exactly as promised, so well done them. I'm happy I got a bargain, but lined up against my Hogwarts red Olton Hall (@£47 back in March sale) I can't actually see much difference! Still not keen on shade of green. The cab has a small white x printed above the red circle route restriction. Anyone know what the purpose of this is? I've not come across it before

With my 'Elf and Safety' (seasonal what?) I would point out that although freestanding you really should secure to wall . You don't want 33 kgs of primarily glass plus contents toppling over on wee Johnny who has been jumping up and down excitedly in front of it! I've got mine resting on an IKEA unit to take the weight. Like others I didn't fancy just hanging it from wall , but it is secured to prevent it falling over. While stable it is relatively narrow and that landing on someone would not do them good!

We'll I think we can rule out Bullieds Leader......Thank goodness!

There's a green late BR Hall in the Railroad range this year. Will look out for it

Agree on Hornby approach , probably meaning a J27 is likely. They do tend to concentrate on a region at a time. Hopefully we will find out in Engineshed sometime next year. Also agree LN&WR seems to be getting left behind at moment. Maybe it's because there are just so many prototypes it's difficult to specify any particular one that would be a good seller. A Cauliflower 0-6-0 maybe, or a 2-4-0 which is something a little different. A large boilered Claughton maybe (would look nice in LMS maroon) But of course the obvious area is Scotland , and the major difference is there are still preserved examples around .812 class 0-6-0 , 0-4-4 ,NBR Maude J36 0-6-0 . All could be modelled in pre grouping, grouping,early and late BR . And of course the Caley samples would look great in blue. Quite distinctive.

I think this has set the cat amongst the pigeons on costings. But there is a danger that the thread will get hi jacked by this (Guilty as charged!- I just find it fascinating) Probably better to concentrate on actual model and leave these discussions for another thread!

Spot on Mike! The notion that big boys have overheads that need to be paid for is a bit perverse. These overheads should only be there if they earn their keep. If not you have to take them out. And as you say there should be synergies in making mass produced models compared to one hand assembled one. I'm still excited by this project firstly because I think this genuinely a landmark product that has advanced the hobby, but secondly the level of pricing possible for a quality product ,hand assembled , surely now exposes some prices charged and claims being made on costs elsewhere.