pharrc20

Mainly rusty dusty stone brown and weathering to grey metal on the insides of HIAs I have seen up at Peak in the past. Oh and big damp patches where the wagons have been through Dove Holes tunnel lol. Cheers Paul

Hi SHMD Kev, there was a photo on Flickr that showed a crippled hopper wagon in the bay platform 2 I think at Crewe. Sometime in the 1990s when the offending wagon had been shunted out of a rake that had been diverted to run via Crewe and presumably the Middlewich line. There are only a couple of occasions where they ran with anything less than 3 wagons; the first was just after the New Mills South Jnc. accident in Feb 1980 when the class 25 and the leading undamaged wagon continued onto Northwich as visually observed by a friend of mine in Hazel Grove that same afternoon. Much later in the early 1990s I observed from distance a pair of 37/5s heading back to Tunstead with just 2 wagons in tow. And it was definitely only two as I grabbed the binos to make sure as I followed their progress between the rooftops as they headed along through Hazel Grove. Not sure why only 2 I never did find out. Otherwise there are some examples of pairs or three hoppers behind 8Fs in steam days returning empty in mixed freights or just on their own with the 8F and a brake. HTH Paul

Please don't start cutting any metal just yet... you need to check your research information more carefully as you have got some errors in there that will need correcting ASAP if you are to avoid any egg on your faces big time... For the record I did offer my knowledge of these wagons to Hatton's but they stated they had all the relevant information from an independent source and their own research at the Severn Valley Railway. Paul

Hi Martin, sadly no more outings at present. I have taken a break from Speedlow as just can't muster the enthusiasm for it right now ☹️. Trying to decide what to do as kind of stuck between a rock not having enough space to work on it and the hard place not being able to complete it quite how I would like it. So for the time being I am just concentrating on doing some stock up and seeing where it goes. Paul

Hi Andy, sorry for not replying sooner only just seen this! I haven't got any more confirmed dates for Speedlow at the moment though I did have two enquiries at The Model Show, whether these will turn into full invites remains to be seen. I was thinking of putting it up at the Hazel Grove open day in June but it would seem that I will need to put up the club layout that I help with Smethurst Junction up instead. Sadly not enough room to work on layout fully at home and so other option would be to take it down to the club and share the room on a working Friday night/Saturday. My layout mojo has slipped down a lot as of layout and hardly touched the layout to continue working on it :-( Paul

I bet National Grid are happy loosing Fiddlers Ferry and Rugeley... two double 275kV circuits from Fiddlers serving the North West and double 400kV circuits from Rugeley. Cheers Paul

Hi phoenixchris, the etched ladder is the Eckon etched signal laddering that you can buy I think still although you would need to check. It seemed the ideal type of laddering at the time and was pretty sturdy and resistant to damage. The number of rungs may not be quite right I can't just remember now but they look ok. Cheers Paul

Thanks Bob they don't come out to play too often now but when they do I sometimes try to run the entire rake with a Hornby 60 on the front. Cheers Paul

Here is my attempt at modelling just some of the CAIB PGAs that were used on the Tunstead to Northwich flow from the start of 1998 until 2001 when replaced by the new JEA bogie hoppers. The first box contains a motley collection of ex Yeoman liveried wagons And the second box the ex ARC liveried wagons That is only some of the wagons the main ones I tried to model as seen was the sole Yeoman liveried wagon, the one with the very faded and battered Yeoman plus the wagon with the pale aquamarine shade of blue. Most ex Yeoman wagons just had the Yeoman painted out in blue with the CAIB sticker added on top and sometimes the sticker was on the lower sloping panels. The ex-ARC wagons generally had the ARC logo painted out in grey in various shades although a couple did escape and retained the full ARC logo. Again CAIB stickers were applied and at least two different sizes. I used the Fox Transfers CAIB logos although these may not necessarily be correct but it is all I could get hold of at the time. I first did these models about 15 years ago using the Hornby model as the basis and then modifying and changing things as I went along. Top of the list was to get rid of the awful plastic ladders and end walkways and replace them with etched ladders, etched walkway and handrails and supports bent up from fine brass rod. The hand brake wheels were also changed as well and used press-stud fittings to try and represent the shape of the real hand wheels. Some of the ARC wagons had the higher top lip of the hopper body added. I left the buffers as they were and just painted and weathered them up and painted the shanks silver. Wheels were replaced to mainly with Bachmann wheel-sets except for the ARC wagons fitted with Cambrian BSC pedestal suspension these were fitted with Romford wheel-sets with added disc-brake faces added and painted silver. Modified Parkside plastic loads were used to make the stone loads that could be removed as required especially if running two rakes one loaded, one the empties to give more operational flexibility on Hazel Valley. And finally, the couplings were upgraded to the Bachmann mini-type ones replacing the large Hornby ones as fitted. Cheers Paul

That's my cue again lol... yes 13 of the British Steel (ex-Summers) unfitted PHO hoppers were acquired for ICI Mond (ICIM) via BR to replace 13 wagons written off in accidents and derailments and bring the ICIM fleet of wagons back up to 152 wagons. The PHO wagons were given a full overhaul to ICI specs at their Avenue workshops in Northwich located not too far from Winnington and Wallerscote works. These all became PHV wagons with the addition of vacuum-brake equipment to the same design as the ICIM PHVs (query whether these vacuum-brake parts were salvaged from the scrapped wagons or made from new?). The 13 ex-British Steel PHVs were numbered ICIM 19152 - 19164 and were initially put in the ICIM Road-stone pool of wagons to be used on aggregates traffic from Tunstead to the Manchester area road-stone depots at Stockport Portwood, Collyhurst Street near Miles Platting and Dean Lane opposite Newton Heath depot. After Portwood drops closed in late 1986 the service ran to the new terminal at Bredbury further back up the line towards Woodley. After the end of the Road-stone traffic in the early 1990s many of the Road-stone pooled wagons were already in use on the new flow of limestone between Tunstead and the sister ICIM works over at Hindlow. Once the Hindlow traffic went over to air-braked Tiphook KPA bogie hoppers the road-stone wagons including the 13 were stored for a while before joining the main Mond pool of wagons for taking limestone to Northwich for Lostock and Winnington works and in the process replacing original ICIM hoppers that had already succumbed to storage and the scrap man. As for the remainder of the 110 other British Steel PHO wagons a large proportion of the remaining fleet donated their plate-frame bogies to ICI Mond to enable the original diamond frame bogies to be withdrawn and replaced thus standardising the fleet - I reckoned at least 90 pairs of plate-frame bogies were purchased by ICIM to replace the pairs of diamond-frame bogies fitted to the original batch of 84 ICI wagons plus some maintenance spares. These all received BR/Timken roller bearings as per the ICI wagons. I believe the chassis and hopper bodies were scrapped on-site at Shotton unless anyone has information otherwise? So that leaves 20 wagons... 2 of these definitely escaped and made it to BSC Llanwern works. A photo of one of the pair is in the book and Paul Bartlett has some photos on his photo site of the same wagon. As for the remaining wagons.. again best guess is they were just scrapped. So any information on these PHO wagons from 1980 - 1983 and their disposal would be most welcome. You never quite know what might turn up. I am still finding and collecting new photos of the ICI Hopper trains and have turned up some real gems recently... hoppers with double-headed 8Fs for example!? HTH Cheers Paul

A shame they can't be moved to be with 19000 and 036 at Swanwick Junction and some sort of deal put together between Stanier and Class 20 Societies for their restoration... it would be nice to see them running again even if only the 4 wagons with the 8F or 20s on the front! Cheers Paul

There are six preserved in total; the two on the SVR nos. 19052 and 19129 preserved in May 1994 and have spent most of their preserved careers in storage so far. The next to be preserved was 19161 (ex-John Summers version), which went to the former Rutland Railway Museum in Cottesmore and was intended to be used in the project to put restored Wisbech & Upwell tramway coach body onto the much modified chassis. This was delivered there in February 1998 and languished there for several years and was later purchased by Andrew Goodman for his collection once the tramway coach body had progressed using another donor chassis. The next two to be preserved went to the Class 20 Locomotive Association in November 1999 and based at Swanwick Junction on the Midland Railway Centre line. These two were first built wagon 19000 and 19036 and both have been received overhauls and repaints into an approximation of the original grey and black livery. The sixth and final wagon to be 19154 another ex-John Summers wagon that was acquired by the NRM and initially stored at York and later transferred to Locomotion Shildon site where it remains today. It is a great pity that the other 6 that used to be stored at Tunstead did not make it into preservation despite some last minute negotiations they were scrapped on site without ceremony or thought. HTH Paul

Looks on track to me a couple of details to add as they have said and some to check. I'd love to know where they got their drawings from though aside from any done from laser scans!

I spoke to Oxford at Warley and they advised me that the delay in their project with Hatton's has been down to trying to obtain the relevant permissions from the owners of the ICI name and trademark and thus this has put the project back. They did have a small poster on the outside of their stand showing the details and the chap said they expected the models to be available in 9-12 months time. The permissions is interesting as I know quite a bit about this as does WBF when he got his permission sorted for his kit. Still some alarm bells ringing for me though about this Hatton's/Oxfordrail project... oh well. Cheers Paul

Hi, there is a proposal to build a new link road from the A6 to link with the A5145 at the Travis Brow/George's Road junction and onwards to the M60 Junction 1 roundabout. This is in part to relieve the traffic pressure on the existing link roads George's Road to the north and Heaton Lane to the south. The proposals can be seen here in this link under section 800 http://www.stockport.gov.uk/services/communitypeopleliving/newapproach/investingingrowth/towncentretransport/. The new road will cut across the former Kwik Save store site now just abandoned waste ground and therefore at this point be situated right above what is the tunnel shown in the photos earlier in this thread. The new link road will mean the removal of the tunnel structure beneath and pass underneath the viaduct and then drop down onto a new junction on Travis Brow near to the ambulance station site. Drawing 801 provides the detail for the proposed link road http://www.stockport.gov.uk/2013/2978/8803/998531/1177152/0527_DF4_TCAP_COL_801. Whether it will get built or not remains to be seen... HTH Cheers Paul

I asked in the shop last weekend and was told it is at first CAD stage with fine detail to be added and initial production may start 2nd quarter 2016... the chap I spoke to mentioned about Summers wagons but they haven't said they will ever do them. Cheers Paul

Hi Marcus, glad you enjoyed reading the first few parts. I need to get my finger out and write the next few and bring the Speedlow story right up to date. Yes the flow of the track was something I wanted from the start plus the unusual baseboard shape that would hopefully complement the track layout. Interesting comments about the Hatton's decoders I have been wondering about getting some 8-pin older locos. Cheers Paul

Hi Marcus, if you have a look on my profile I have put a few blog entries on about my layout Speedlow and some of the stock I am slowly working on. I had the layout at my local show in Hazel Grove two weekends ago and although it is far from complete got a lot of good comments and questions both days and also got an invite to take it as is to The Model Show in Poynton Cheshire in early December. Cheers Paul

Hi Marcus, thanks glad the information and photo proved useful, had lots of likes for my post on the PGAs and CBAs. Yes wagons are my passion especially the private owner ones that used to work around Buxton as I will be using them plus others on my Speedlow layout eventually. Cheers Paul

Ah you mean the CBA covered hopper wagons. A batch of 52 wagons was constructed at BR Shildon in 1969 and delivered new for powdered limestone traffic from Tunstead to Margam steelworks in South Wales initially running six return trips per week. In later years this was down to three a week. Five wagons were lost in accidents and written off and so five new wagons were built by BREL Shildon in 1977 as replacements. As the years went by some wagons got transfered into Potash traffic but the corrosive nature soon damaged the wagons and most were withdrawn and scrapped from this traffic. The flow of limestone transfered from Tunstead to BSCs own Hardendale lime works in 1990 probably connected to the break-up or divesting of the ICI empire including the Mond Division that dealt with lime/stone products. Further wagons were withdrawn and additional wagons in the form of the ex-Maltsters bogie grain hoppers were used alongside them to Margam until the last 10 CBAs were withdrawn at the start of 2001 and later scrapped on site at Margam. They are essentially a version of the standard MGR coal hopper with different door release equipment and the top roof to protect the lime. Originally fitted from new with a curved roof profile but the replacement 5 wagons were built with an angled roof and this was later rolled out to all of the original wagons as standard. I wrote an article on the history and operations of the wagons for DEMU. I have modelled some myself using the Hornby HAA wagon and homemade roof parts and some etched walkway parts and I am making a rake of 12. Occasionally you used to see the odd CBA dumped in the one of the old sidings that used to be just behind what was the station building at Peak Forest now the staff offices. I have put all of my wagon photos from my old websites onto a Flickr page https://flic.kr/s/aHsjLRpvGV Cheers Paul

Ashamed to say that web site is still around lol oh well that the internet for you. I have a lot of info on the designs of PGAs that were used on the Tunstead-Northwich traffic from January 1998 onwards once the old JGVs had finally taken their bow from the mainline. By way of a quick summary the wagons hired by Brunner Mond UK Ltd from CAIB until December 2000 were as follows: PR 14265 - 319 (55 wagons) to design PG 013D ex-ARC mustard livery running on BSC Friction Pedestal suspension (like Lima model) with enclosed hopper top lip as I called it! PR 14322 + 323 (2) PG 015A ex-Yeoman blue/silver grey livery running on Gloucester Floating Axle suspension (like Hornby model) - body as per Hornby model - NB the other two wagons from this batch PR 14320 + 321 were to my knowledge and observations never in this pool or traffic. PR 14324 - 328 / 330 - 332 (9 wagons) ex-ARC PG 016B mustard livery on Gloucs Floating Axle - as per Hornby model - NB PR 14329 believed to have been scrapped prior to 1997 PR 14333 - 341 (9) ex-Yeoman + PR 14342 - 345 (5) ex-ARC with lip + PR 14382 - 388 (7) ex-Yeoman - all to PG 013E on Gloucs Floating - as per Hornby Model except ex-ARCs with lip PR 14434 - 466 (33) ex-Yeoman to PG 013E on Gloucs Floating as per Hornby model. I have a rake of 36 odd wagons modelled on wagons used on the Tunstead circuit and sometimes run them on club layout alongside the ICI hoppers in a transition period setting with pairs of 37s on the JGVs and a 60 on the PGAs. Lots more info and photos on the PGAs but that is a quick summary. Cheers Paul

Hi steve22, yes Lucy Harrison, Chief Inspector of Trackwork Division often assisted (hindered?!) me with the track laying stage. Now the layout is back at home and the middle two boards are up and covered over with an old cloth sheet, she has taken to sleeping on my empty Walthers cement works cardboard box! LOL! Cheers Paul

....And seen parked up in platform 3a bay at Stockport on display for the Stockport Railshow held on platform 3 from 10am until 4pm and well worth attending to find some more new photo of ICI hopper workings. View from the No.2 Cab window I took photos of most of the cab interior including this handy diagram on the bulkhead Cheers Paul

I have quite a few more photos of the PGAs when they were used on the Tunstead-Northwich traffic along with copious notes on which wagons were in the pool and what livery and branding they carried. Cheers Paul