pharrc20

More of my photos on my Flickr page which includes all of the photos from my old Fotopic and Tripod websites plus some photos of Oakleigh Sidings that I uploaded onto Flickr for the thread on the same subject. https://www.flickr.com/photos/34475484@N08/ Cheers Paul

Appleby Model Engineering did a sheet of transfers for the ICI hoppers and the short-lived resin kit that John produced many years ago. You could try contacting John Talbot to see if he still has any sheets left for sale. It is suitable for renumbering wagons in the late 70s to late 90s with the non-standard plain black with white stencilled letters and numbers plus the AME sheet also includes a few of the rarer plain white version of panels. For steam era wagons it is bit more difficult as there aren't any suitable transfers at present although I tended to use D and E locomotive numerals to number my wagons with. HTH Paul

Hi Dave, it would appear that they have swopped the set of wagons for the one that has recently been used a lot on the Dowlow-Ashburys circuit as that was formed of MBAs, JRAs and JXAs when I have seen it either at Peak Forest or Hazel Grove in the past couple of weeks. Cheers Paul

Those faded numbers white on grey/almost white are a sod to read at distance especially like today at Peak Forest! Cheers Paul

Yep no much good when the original material and drawings vanished. Good to hear they have made progress with new CAD/CAM

Yes they did indeed scan them 4 to 5 years ago... and now have had to scan them again. A second time. Not the only Dapol project to have been delayed in this manner hmmm!

Interesting posting on Dapol Facebook site about them laser scanning 59s at Tor Works! Another new model in the offering soon then.

Hi folks, I know it has been a while since my last issue but life and work got in the way. Quick update on the Bachmann Covhops I now have my rake of 12 wagons thanks to the timely re-release by Bachmann of their models and my 40th birthday money which allowed me to purchase the extra 6 from local model railway shops SMTF and Arcadia. These will be converted with new transfers as per the first batch of six using the remainder of the CCT sheet. I made a trip down to Somerset just after my birthday and popped into the Bristol Thornbury show on the Sunday afternoon and managed to purchase some replacement whitemetal self-contained buffers for the Covhops. I am in the process of removing the Bachmann buffers ready for the new whitemetal buffers to be added once the old plastic buffer shanks have been snipped off and pared back. The new buffers will just need a quick clean-up of any flash then they will be ready for affixing to the headstocks. Back in February I went to Glasgow show and picked up some Parkside PA07 unfitted Morton underframe packs. I have removed a set of the brake rigging as per Alan Monk's article in the June 2014 issue of Rail Express Modeller and I am modifiying them to fit as per Alan's notes and secure them to the brake lever cross shaft. Once that is done I will look at fitting some whitemetal vacuum-brake pipes on the headstocks to represent those forming the through vacuum pipes. Then lots of limestone wash weathering ought to make them look the part behind a grimy 8F with a fitted brake van on the end. On the Speedlow layout front all of the ballasting was completed. Now the layout is back home I need to create some space so that I can make a start on the scenery and work towards the Hazel Grove Exhibition at the end of October where the layout will be shown for the first time as an operational work in progress layout or however advanced it is by then! Still lots of stock locos and wagons to work on so the dining table will have to do for now when I am doing such work. Cheers Paul

Thanks John I will start to gather some tools and those parts together and have a go at making a rake suitable for the later years working out of Earle's Sidings, Hope. Cheers Paul

Looking good John. I too have a box of yellow and grey Cemflo wagons that I have wanted to re-work for a long time. Now you have given some info on how to modify and extend the tank parts maybe I will have a go myself and do wagons with both types of suspensions with the differing strengthening plates on the solebars to model them in service in the early 1980s before they were withdrawn. Cheers Paul

I never got that far down into Winnington works to see any of the loading areas and most I think by 1998 were long disused and only the unloading sheds for limestone and coke were still in use. Somewhere amongst my stuff is an interesting book I picked up published by ICI in the late 1950s/early 1960s on how the Northwich works came to be. I can't just remember whether it included a map of the different parts of Winnington and Wallerscote so I will try to find it for you. I did meet with a chap who worked at Winnington for a short period in the Research & Development labs and he was looking for information too. Cheers Paul

Hi Monjac, the Summers wagons were painted in a light grey livery I don't know the exact shade but not too dissimilar to the shade used on the ICI wagons. The first Summers wagon no. 60 was out shopped with white SUMMERS with JOHN above the middle M and & SONS below the middle M lettering and wagon number along with the repair script information, tare and load markings and NON POOL marking. Whether this was just for photographic purposes at Charles Roberts works I am uncertain. However the second wagon no. 61 came out with black lettering replacing all of the white ones described above. Obviously the black lettering stands out much better than the white. I don't know whether no. 60 was repainted before it left the works to goto Shotton or Bidston to enter traffic. However the next photo taken by Chas Roberts was of wagon 119 and this still had the black lettering but more bold thicker lines making up the letters and they had dropped the JOHN and & SONS above the middle M. A further photo of no. 162 appears to be the same as 119. I have no idea as to the font but if you want some more info on the lettering then send me a PM. Cheers Paul

Hi Marcus, ah PIR is Kingspan well that is okay as I have got loads of different thicknesses of off-cut sheets as my next door neighbour is a builder by trade and got me a load of pieces in plus some nifty thick plastic sheets that will eventually form the backscene. My book is An Illustrated History of the ICI Hopper you might find a copy online or try some of the secondhand railway booksellers maybe even Booklaw in Nottingham as I know they took quite a lot of surplus stock some years ago. Cheers Paul

Peak Forest without the ICI hoppers is just not the same. You will definitely need to get some hoppers . As for 37s pretty much any livery and sub-class except for the /9s were seen at some point on the hoppers pre and post privatisation from the BR freight and departmental sectors to the early freight companies Transrail then EWS absorbed companies then EW&S/EWS liveries and any mixture of until the end. Almost always pairs of 37s from the early 90s onwards until the end with very rare substitution by a 31 and 37 combo that happened only two or three known times. If you haven't already seen my book on the ICI hoppers then its well worth a look (no plug intended lol). What is the PIR that you mention in relation to making the rock faces? I will need to do something similar for my own layout based on Peak District freight operations and have the line coming up from the fiddle yard that will be in a shallow limestone cutting plus other outcrops buried amongst the reclaimed quarry workings now landscaped a la Peak Forest next to the road bridge. Cheers Paul

Looks like you got the DBS liveried JGA at the head of the Washwood Heath empties plus I see they have had a clear up of the Down sidings next to the Cemex sidings as this wall full of a mix of boxes and hoppers when I went up. Plus the HTAs in the Up Sidings looks like they have crippled a few already! Was the sole JEA still in the Up Sidings perchance? Cheers Paul

I have some info on the Summers lettering and details of the smaller script that was used for a private commission for a 7mm etched version of these wagons and this info was used to produce some rather nice looking black transfers for the chap. You could also go on and do the later BSC white lettering for the later livery that some of the wagons gained before the traffic to Shotton ended in 1980. Cheers Paul

Hi Bob, thanks for the comments glad you enjoyed it. Granted it is quite a specialised subject and title was in hindsight not quite the one originally intended but came around after a lot of word arranging with the publisher. But the content inside more than made up for that in the end. As far as I am aware the book is now out of print. I sold my last two copies recently and only have three personal copies left in my own collection. Cheers Paul

Ha I like that. As the main author of that book I am glad to see that you are appreciative of the hard work that went into getting that book into print. There were some compromises from the planned book and what got printed namely a reduction in the amount of colour plates as this had to be scaled back due to prohibitive price increases that would have pushed the final book price up beyond the planned £13.95. I am very proud of the book all these years later. As WBM has pointed out there are some differences between the ICI and Summers wagons and if you wished to overlook these and went for the its my layout I'll operate what I like viewpoint then you could just as well use the ICI versions without the letters and repaint into Summers grey and remove the vacuum cylinders and pipework. Remember to use only wagons with plate frame bogies. Commission some transfers and go from there. I have a feeling that a company Black something or other did some 4mm Summers in a rub-down format. But I am uncertain whether Hattons/Oxford Rail have realised how much demand for Summers wagons as well and if they have done their homework then they will suss out the common parts. Cheers Paul

Peak Forest based layout oooh yes! Looking nice Marcus. I was up there two days last week and the traffic seemed to have slackened off a little since I last did a full day up there. But still plenty of good locos and wagons to keep looking at too and its amazing how things change too in what wagons operate on the different service. For example I never really expected to see any ex-Sheerness steel JXAs working up there but yes now there is and four are in use on the Dowlow to Ashburys aggregates traffic running with three of the usual JRA RIV bogie box wagons. Cheers Paul

Generally speaking it was as follows for loaded trains 4F and 11 hoppers (or 9 if routed via Romiley and Tiviot Dale) 8F and 16 9F and 18 A single and pairs of Type 2s (28s) upto 19 during May 1963 to March 1964 Single Type 4 (40) upto 16 ditto Thereafter single Type 2 (25s) upto 18 The Roadstone aggregate services that started in 1968 loaded upto 18 wagons depending on the destination and initially used a pool of ex Mond traffic hoppers and later gained the 13 refurbished and vacuum-braked ex-Summers hoppers. The Mond (Northwich) traffic generally still loaded upto 18 wagons regardless of traction Once the refurbished 37/5s came to Buxton trailing loads were gradually increased to 24 wagons right until the end of the hoppers on the mainline in 1997. But don't forget demand and requirements at the Northwich end would dictate the daily number of wagons and rakes and services run along with any diversionary routes especially at weekends. And has been noted return empties could vary again. So to model a rake of 24 with a pair of 37/5s on the front would take a lot of room and a rather large sized layout. A rake of just over half that would still look very commanding. I have for several years operated rakes of 4mm hoppers and 8 to 10 hoppers usually looks just right. HTH Cheers Paul Cheers Paul

Hi Martin, Yes I only know this from a conversation with a chap who told me some years ago. I never saw the actual event nor attended the open day (I was 5 then!) and only heard about it years later and managed to find a photo posted online of the deed but I haven't come across anymore as yet. Cheers Paul

And I am told that the local management at Northwich got a severe bollocking the day after 5000 had done the deed that afternoon! Cheers Paul

A quick look in my book on these wagons shows two photos one from October 1950 with 48089 with three hoppers at the front of a mixed train at Chapel-en-le-Frith and another at Chinley North Junction around 1960 with 48677 with just two hoppers and a brake van both trains heading towards Peak Forest. The only other times I know of where short rakes of hoppers were seen were following the derailment at New Mills South Junction in 1980 where the class 25 train engine and lead hopper continued to Northwich and another time in the early 1990s where I saw myself a pair of 37s pass through Hazel Grove hauling a single wagon back to Tunstead alas no photos. Having helped Matthew at WBM with his kit for these wagons it is just typical this happens! As much as a surprise to me this announcement when a friend rang me up yesterday ironically whilst I was out at Peak Forest the hoppers old stamping ground! Cheers Paul

I have a pair of Bachmann Autoballasters stripped down into parts waiting for a suitable gap to commence backdating to a PIA in Tiphook white/blue livery as per the Flickr link. One day!! Cheers Paul

Hi Paul, thanks for the reply. Hmmm interesting how it is marketed as a Summers wagon when it actually builds up into an ICI one?? As far as I was aware and trying to recall what Warren Shepherd did with the original artwork I understood that he had just reduced his 7mm artwork down to make the two test etches that he gave me one in 10thou brass the second in 15thou I think. Not sure where the error of the base of the body came into being. So as the kit appears to be an ICI one then the vertical end ladders can be omitted as the original ICI wagons bar one only ever had angled ladders fitted. I have a list of wagons known to have been fitted with angled ladders somewhere. Cheers Paul