Terminus acting as both a Marine and a General station ?

[Pacific231G]

I wasn't sure whethr to put this topic in UK prototype or overseas as it covers both

 

Maritime stations are justly popular subjects because they combine the fascination of a port with interesting train workings both passenger and goods.

The obvious examples such as Weymouth Harbour. Folkestone Harbour, and Dover Marine were purely marine stations that AFAIK handled just boat trains (though there may have been some doubling up at Dover Marine)

The same was true abroad such as at Dieppe, Calais and Cherbourg and in both cases regular trains normally used the town station while boat trains went through to the harbour usually no more than a few times a day to connect with regular ferry sailings. Sometimes the "boat train" was an extension of a more general service and at Dieppe a local train would be extended to the maritime station for passengers not going to Paris. ISTR that this sort of thing happened at Dover as well but only when there was a ferry to connect with and in principle only boat passengers were supposed to use the marine station. 

 

However what I'm wondering is how common was it to have a single terminus that served both the town and the port. I think Oban and Mallaig were like this with the station effectively on the quayside but they were quite small and Lymington Pier is even smaller.. The only true main line station that comes to mind is Portsmouth Harbour which is the passenger terminus of the main line from London and also a ferry terminal for the Isle of Wight- ditto of course at Ryde Pierhead though town passengers use Esplanade. 

 

The other obvious example of this was Kingswear where the quayside ran along the edge of the station site though this was AFAIK a purely commercial port with most passengers using the small ferry to get to Dartmouth.

 

I can think of a number of termini that had an extension going on to the port such as Plymouth Millbay and Southampton Terminus but many of these such as Plymouth Friary had only a goods line (to Sutton Harbour) extending beyond them. At Millbay and Southampton, the docks lines did carry some interesting passenger trains, quite recently at Southampton with Pullmans for the QE2 at Ocean Terminal but these were effectively avoiding lines and not part of the terminus itself.

 

I'm looking at the idea of an extended Minories with a quayside line forming the edge of the baseboard but want it to be a fairly normal though small mailn line terminus that  handles rather grander boat trains as well as the normal range of services and am looking for prototypes to justify that. I suppose Penzance was a bit like this though I don't think the GWR ran separate boat trains for the Scilly Isles services.  For some reason Tilbury Riverside also comes to mind but I'm not sure how that worked.

My terminus would be set in France but examples from anywhere in the world would be useful.

 

 

[pH]

Gourock and Wemyss Bay on the Clyde were the only stations in those towns. They handled a regular service, plus connections with ferry services. While most trains, including the boat connections, stopped at several stations on the way from Glasgow Central, there were some fast boat expresses. In addition, in summer, there was an up and a down CTAC Scottish Tours Express on Saturdays.

Edited April 18, 2017 by pH

[South Central]

Not quite what you are looking for but in the seventies and eighties, Newhaven Marine was served by a handful of daily local trains to supplement the "true" Victoria boat trains, their purpose being to carry local Dieppe day-trippers. At various times there were trains to/from Brighton, Littlehampton and even Portsmouth. 

 

Technically, the main "general" traffic was handled by Newhaven Town station in line with your other examples above. 

[Kris]

Most towns with major harbours are more than large enough to justify multiple stations. Most people visiting do not want to go to the docks, but to shops and places of work, so the main station is often far away from the dockside.

[Northroader]

Probably not what you got in mind, but Hythe, Hampshire, serves a maritime service(!) and a town, and is nice and compact.

[Zomboid]

Seems to depend on the town, but it's unusual. Even fairly small towns such as Newhaven, Stranraer and Harwich got separate stations for the docks and town.

I suspect Portsmouth & Southsea was the major station there, too (it had at least 4 terminating platforms).

I'm not aware of Holyhead having any additional stations, though. Nor Heysham.

[Northroader]

P.s. Just along from there, Lymington had a town station which was the terminus, and the passengers for the ferry walked a short distance along the quay, where it originally moored, before the line was extended over to the pier.

[Fat Controller]

Neyland and Holyhead, perhaps?

[Oldddudders]

Dover Marine, or Western Docks as it became late in life, was used by hourly services to/from Victoria via Canterbury East, certainly from the late '70s. This avoided the same train having to bounce back at Dover Priory, occupying a through platform on layover, but also served a market.

 

I also wonder whether Tilbury Riverside meets your brief - after all it was patently constructed for ocean-going traffic, yet right until closure in the early '90s saw regular services on the Tilbury Loop reversing there.

[Northroader]

One place which developed the other way, was Ostend, Belgium. Here there was a maritime station on the quay, and a town station nearby at right angles. There was a rationalisation in the 1930s which rebuilt the whole lot mainly on the maritime site, and the rest closed and removed.

[clecklewyke]

Look North, young man - Gourock, Craigendoran, Oban, Mallaig, Kyle of Lochalsh, Peterhead, Aberdeen (?) and lastly, and magnificently, Burntisland (1883).

 

Ian

[MarkC]

Pembroke Dock?

[Joseph_Pestell]

Dover Marine, or Western Docks as it became late in life, was used by hourly services to/from Victoria via Canterbury East, certainly from the late '70s. This avoided the same train having to bounce back at Dover Priory, occupying a through platform on layover, but also served a market.

 

I also wonder whether Tilbury Riverside meets your brief - after all it was patently constructed for ocean-going traffic, yet right until closure in the early '90s saw regular services on the Tilbury Loop reversing there.

In my student years (late 70s), I used the local service from Dover Marine quite a lot as it was easier than going up to Victoria on a boat train and then back again to Bromley South.

[Joseph_Pestell]

In France, the original PLM station at Sete (then spelt Cette) served as both maritime and town station. But then trains  started to run through more and the Midi station became the main town station.

Bordeaux may have been similar in pre-nationalisation era.

St Malo may be worth a look.

But other than that, I can't find a suitable location in France. All the ports such as Marseille and Port-Vendres had separate maritime stations.

[luckymucklebackit]

Look North, young man - Gourock, Craigendoran, Oban, Mallaig, Kyle of Lochalsh, Peterhead, Aberdeen (?) and lastly, and magnificently, Burntisland (1883).

 

Ian

 

Ardrossan WInton Pier? Still around as Ardrossan Harbour, albeit just a siding now.

 

Jim

[The Johnster]

Fishguard Harbour just about qualifies, with an auto train shuttle from Fishguard and Goodwick.  Lots of cattle wagon shunting as well.

[Gwiwer]

Ardrossan WInton Pier? Still around as Ardrossan Harbour, albeit just a siding now.

 

Jim

 

Ardrossan Harbour (also sometime Winton Pier) is very much around and even got lucky being electrified when some branches might have been closed.  It serves the marina area of the town remote from South Beach and farther from Town station.  The hourly service is far and away better than the boat connection alone would support though it wasn't always thus.  Back in DMU days fewer trains ran beyond Town and largely to connect with shipping.

 

I used the branch in 1978 when the station was named Ardrossan Harbour but the destination blind on the DMU still read Ardrossan [Winton Pier].

Edited April 18, 2017 by Gwiwer

[ejstubbs]

Look North, young man - Gourock, Craigendoran, Oban, Mallaig, Kyle of Lochalsh, Peterhead, Aberdeen (?) and lastly, and magnificently, Burntisland (1883).

 

I think that must be the first time that I've ever encountered the word "Burntisland" associated with the concept of magnificence...

[caradoc]

Stranraer had separate Town and Harbour stations but Town was then closed, leaving Harbour to serve all passengers.

Edited April 18, 2017 by caradoc

[Stevelewis]

Holyhead?

[34theletterbetweenB&D]

...My terminus would be set in France but examples from anywhere in the world would be useful.

 The Mediterranean (and its subsidiary seas) is fruitful of examples, in that small coastal ports that got a railway service very frequently had the station colocated with the port, because that was where 'everything' worth mentioning of the town's economic activity was anyway, and there was only the narrow shelf of flat land on the coast suitable for a railway route so choice of site was severely restricted.

 

And then of course there's Venice.

[luckymucklebackit]

Stranraer had separate Town and Harbour stations but Town was then closed, leaving Harbour to serve all passengers.

 

Then the Ferry Operators moved their bases to Cairnryan, so the station is now inconvenient for everyone.....

[Steamport Southport]

Birkenhead Woodside?

 

 

 

Jason

[D854_Tiger]

Does North Woolwich count?

 

Liverpool Lime St.

[pH]

Look North, young man - Gourock, Craigendoran, Oban, Mallaig, Kyle of Lochalsh, Peterhead, Aberdeen (?) and lastly, and magnificently, Burntisland (1883).

 

Ian

I would question Craigendoran. There actually used to be three almost separate stations there. As far as I know, the terminal platforms on the pier were only used for boat connections. The 'regular' service didn't terminate at Craigendoran, but used through platforms on the way to Helensburgh. (The third 'station' was the platforms on the West Highland line, which had branched off east of Craigendoran.)

 

Having thought about it, I would suggest Greenock Princes Pier as a location that might answer the OP's requirements. It certainly wasn't the only station in the town, and wasn't even a major one for regular service. However, it did have a passenger service from Glasgow St. Enoch till 1959. What it did have was trains taking passengers to and from Cunard and Canadian Pacific liners, which lay off in the anchorage at the Tail of the Bank and were serviced by Clyde steamers running as tenders from Princes Pier. These liners called regularly (each weekly?) into the 1960s - the last boat trains ran in 1965.

Edited April 18, 2017 by pH