Building kits for Tyneside in the BR era. J24 and PDK D49/2

[Jol Wilkinson]

Have you measured the actual wheel, Hornby are'nt always the exact size, quite often they are slightly oversize and have deeper flanges too . They are designed for their range and I wouldn't use them on a scale model personally.  

    I have just done a ex NER N10 and that came with option of cutting the rear of the frames off and using a pony truck , it was supplied on the etch. LRM do a etch of the trailing/radial  truck, its on their LNWR list page, but it should be near enough for your needs.

The LRM radial truck etch was originally developed for use in the LNWR 4-4-2 Precursor Tank chassis and then in the LNWR 4' 6" 2-4-2T and Teutonic 2-2-2-0. A number of customers who had built those kits asked if it could be made available as a separate item for use in other kits, so it must work satisfactorily. It has been produced as .015" N/S etch with adaptor guides to fit into standard hornblock cut outs.

 

It is actually easier to incorporate a radial truck than a pony truck, as it takes up little space and doesn't require a spacer to provide a mounting/pivot point. One caveat is that pony trucks can be designed with a smaller phivot radius to suit tighter curves. Of course, lateral wheel movement may be limited by chassis width and wheel B2B or, in some cases by cab steps,

[Michael Edge]

It's not too difficult to incorporate a pony truck in an electrically driven model but it does often go through the area normally taken up by the ashpan. Pony truck radius is vitally important, there are ways of working this out but it's usually quicker and easier to follow what was done in full size. If the pivot is too long the truck will tend to derail on plain curves, if it is too short it will tend to go the wrong way through K crossings (OO gauge makes this effect worse). The best demonstration of this is the BR 1Co-Co1 bogie, most models have a very short pony ruck pivot which makes the end wheelsets very wayward. The theoretical pivot point is near the adjacent driving axle which is usually impossible for us because of the gear drive and impossible full size because of the traction motor. The solution was to pivot the truck inside out with swing links - If I ever find the drawing of this again I'll build one to demonstrate the principle. I know I've seen the drawing of this but I don't know where it was.

[Jol Wilkinson]

Mike,

 

if the anchor points for two swing links are "inside" the wheelbase of the model, then the inner links pivots should be nearer together than the outer ones.

 

If the anchor points for two swing links are "outside" the wheelbase of the model, then the inner links pivots should be  further apart than the outer ones.

 

The lengths of the links and their relative anchor points will define how much the pony truck axle swings laterally as it moves sideways. Hopefully the attached will show how this works.

 

 

Pony truck swinging links.pdf

 

 

[Michael Edge]

They are outside, the pivots are inside the semi circular bulges on the buffer beams. I know the principle but I would like to see BR's design rather than work it out myself.

[rowanj]

I do actually run these things from time to time. This is the first corner of my new layout. Will it ever be finished?

[rowanj]

Thanks to the advice, I now have the N5 running well. Motor is Mashima 1020, with High Level Compact+ with 45-1 gears. the body is straightforward so far, and the SEF overlays for the tank sides have been ordered. 

 Boiler fittings and cab roof are just perched for effect,

John

Edited November 15, 2017 by rowanj

[rowanj]

And for my next trick... The box spells the kit incorrectly as Metro Cammel, and the instructions as Metro Camel. I trust building it wont give me the hump.

Edited November 15, 2017 by rowanj

[Chris-GNR]

Evening.

 

Possibly a bit late in the day but here is a link to my build of the SEF N5.

 

http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/88522-chris-gnr-workbench/page-1

 

Keep up the good work.

 

Cheers

Chris

[rowanj]

Evening.

 

Possibly a bit late in the day but here is a link to my build of the SEF N5.

 

Keep up the good work.

 

Cheers

Chris

 

Hi Chris - yes I follow your excellent thread. The Q1 looks really promising.

 

The link seems to be missing from your post. It would be well worth putting it in, so others can find you via me, if necessary.

 

Thanks again

 

John

[rowanj]

A small tip - when soldering detail in the cab, be careful where you rest the iron, But I suppose at least it proves that damage is usually reversible and I could probably, if all else failed, have obtained a replacement from SEF who are usually very good about these things. The picture of the repair is, literally, watching paint dry.

 

John

[Bucoops]

Whoops!

[rowanj]

Whoops!

 

That wasn't exactly the word I used, but as my wife and daughter were present, perhaps "Whoops" would have been better...

[Bucoops]

I can imagine!

[rowanj]

While waiting for the paint to dry on the N5, I opened the box of The Dave Alexander kit of the 1938 Metro-Cammell EMU Parcels Van, built for the North Tyneside loop. The kit is all whitemetal other than etches for the coach sides.

 

I'm going to use quick set epoxy this time, not because of worries about soldering, but because I've never built a kit like this before, and it will be easier, I think, to dismantle any parts where I may make an error. I cant find a build of this kit online, so if anyone can help, that would be great.

 

The instructions are a mixed bag. There is a pretty good exploded diagram, but the narrative has a few helpful tips, along with assemble parts 1,2,3,4 etc. One immediate problem is that the floor was originally in 4 pieces with a series of cross braces.. The revised floor is in 2 parts, much easier to get straight and square, but the instructions and diagram still refer to the original 4-piece. The rear piece on the photo isn't shown on the instructions, but I assume it is the support for the dummy bogie. I cant see how to fit the Tenshodo bogie.

 

Well, Dave did say it wasn't a kit to be hurried.

 

A couple of pics of the real thing...

Edited November 21, 2017 by rowanj

[jwealleans]

I have a feeling Paul Gallon (Worsdell Forever) built one of these or similar for his layout ‘Fellburn’. He might be able to advise if you get stuck.

[Worsdell forever]

I have a feeling Paul Gallon (Worsdell Forever) built one of these or similar for his layout ‘Fellburn’. He might be able to advise if you get stuck.

 

Yes, but it was 14 years ago... seem to remember it was pretty straight forward, the only difficult bit was removing the parcels door handrails to make it into the earlier version.

[rowanj]

The N5 in service. The driver from Sunderland MPD is wondering what the devil the shed foreman was doing giving him this thing for a turn to Newcastle. He will be even more upset that I have yet to fit a fireman in the cab. But, luckily, the loco runs/steams really nicely. Its pulling a couple of old Kirk Gresley suburbans which I dug out, with the intention of some major renovation (starting with the roof, and a duster - bloody photographs !)

 

The small photo shows, I hope, that even what appears to be an unmitigated disaster can be rectified to a point.

 

This kit was as straightforward as any I've built, and as far as I'm concerned, makes a perfectly acceptable layout loco.

 

John

[rowanj]

I passed a really pleasant hour with Dave Alexander today, picking up a couple of castings missing from the kit, and the Romford wheels for the dummy bogie.

He told me that the Tyneside EMU perambulator van is almost complete, and the 2 Car articulated set is about half way there. He intends to produce a dummy pair for those who want a longer train.

He did say he wouldnt be designing any more locos, but a few existing ones might get new moulds. But he has no intention of packing in, health permitting.

Apparently Heljans releases have virtually ended his diesel production,and the Hornby Q6 means he won't make any more of those.

A lovely man,who has been a stalwart of railway modelling on Tyneside for years.

John

F

Edited November 23, 2017 by rowanj

[Sandhole]

Good to know the man is still producing stuff.

I've built a couple of his tender kits for the old Hornby 9F. Very nice

                 Chris.

[nerron]

I passed a really pleasant hour with Dave Alexander today, picking up a couple of castings missing from the kit, and the Romford wheels for the dummy bogie.

He told me that the Tyneside EMU perambulator van is almost complete, and the 2 Car articulated set is about half way there. He intends to produce a dummy pair for those who want a longer train.

He did say he wouldnt be designing any more locos, but a few existing ones might get new moulds. But he has no intention of packing in, health permitting.

Apparently Heljans releases have virtually ended his diesel production,and the Hornby Q6 means he won't make any more of those.

A lovely man,who has been a stalwart of railway modelling on Tyneside for years.

John

This is good news. I have been waiting for the 2 Car set having built the parcels van some seven years ago. I met him in 2013 at Raillex NE when I collected my J77 kit.

Edited November 24, 2017 by nerron

[46256]

John, Mr Alexander and Chris at high level are,along with your good self a credit to the Nor East of this wonderful country.i will send my full details on a PM so you can make out the cheque ....best wishes Brian

[rowanj]

Parcels Van body. Apologies for the lousy photo but it gives you the idea, This was not the easiest to get right, and there are still some rough parts. Each side consists of 4 whitemetal doors and 4 etches, which must then be married to the ends, roof and floor The roof is too light, so I'll track down a darker grey. I cant find a photo of the interior, so settled on a "custard" which I recall from the Artic sets, 

 

The instructions for locating some of the underframe detail don't match photos I have, so I'll rely on the latter. 

 

Not having built a fully etched coach kit before, I really should have started on something simpler, but - hey - I wanted a Tyneside Electric, I think it will look OK once the 3 foot rule is applied.

 

John

Edited November 28, 2017 by rowanj

[rowanj]

These are the bogies for the Parcels Van. I suppose for those who know about these things, assembly is straightforward, However, as a first-timer, I had a bit of thinking to do. The instructions and diagram just say "assemble the bogie sides to the Tenshodo bogie" It does remind you that the sides are "handed" with the rather puny sandboxes to the front. , but doesn't say that the rear of the castings are different between the dummy and motorised bogie. the dummy, once I twigged this, was easy, but I couldn't see a recommended method for the Tenshodo. In the event, I cut down the pinpoint axles and found an unillustrated casting which I stuck to the bogie and then to the Tenshodo . At least it works.

 

The instructions advise that the 3rd rail pickups are fragile and should be fitted last. This is good advice, and the diagram does have an illustration. However, I couldn't find anything like this in the kit, so have fabricated a simple arrangement to at least give the illusion of the real thing.

[rowanj]

Though not my finest hour, I do at least have a working EMU to trundle through Little Benton - it's actually being held a Little Benton South's block signal. As you see, there is lots still to do.

 

There is not much wrong with the kit, and I'm sure anyone who has built coaches or diesels would have no problem with it.

 

John

[rowanj]

Returning to more familiar territory, I've begun planning the building of the London Road J25. I'm given to understand that there are a few things not quite right with the model but photos I've seen sugges5 it will make a perfectly açceptàble model for my purposes. Those looking for something more accurate may prefer to see Mikemeg,s excellent posts of his ArthurK build.

The kit comes with a large set of drawings and instructions. The loco chassis can be either rigid or compensated. The tender chassis gives the option of either a fold up or traditional 2 sides and etched spacers.The boiler is pre rolled.

I will build the loco ànd tender body alongside the chassis as far as possible to check for height and clearance issues. I want to get the Mashima1020 and High Level Compact+ into the frames at an early stage,as I suspect clearance in the firebox or boiler will be tight. I want to drive off the centre axle if possible, but have a feeling I will be using the rear one.

John

Edited December 4, 2017 by rowanj