Hornby announce Class 800 IEP

[DJMR]

My supplier today, Derails (apt name), has been in touch to say they are working with Hornby to find a solution. Hornby are on the case and they will know more in a few days.

 

Cheers

 

Edit: clarification when Derails has been in touch; Today (05/03/2017). 

Edited March 5, 2018 by DJMR

[Matabiau]

I have just fitted mine with a DCC decoder, the 8 PIN harness version from Hattons. The tightest squeeze appears to be at the 8 PIN plug, the wire bundle rises off the plug. Thinking about it I could unbundle the wires to spread them out flat which would probably relieve the problem. The chip itself sits in the speaker bay, but only just, the harness is not quite long enough. Again, undoing the wiring bundle should ease this.

Without an modification of the harness the removable undercarriage bulges slightly where the fit is too tight.

 

On the problem of derailing, mine runs generally well over a figure of eight circuit with minimum third order curves. It even climbs the cirved inclines without slowing despite the trailing carriages being anything but free wheeling. One of the centre cars derailed once so far It appears that forsome reason the bogies twisted on a curveand pushed ou the sides of the body which sank onto the undercarriage. Consequently the bogie was blocked by the body sides. I haven't managed to reproduce the fault again though.

[SteveC32]

Anybody had any feedback from their supplier or Hornby?

Mine derails, the bogie appears to lock and jumps as it tries to straighten out.

My retailer has had loads of customers with the issue and he’s frustrated that the Hornby Sales Rep is not answering calls, instead letting them go to voicemail and not returning them - I think someone should tell him that hiding from a problem won’t make it go away

 

I’ve not had a reply to my e-mail to Lyndon Davies. I agree with ‘Legend’, Hornby should issue a statement on their website acknowledging the problem and outlining the steps they’re taking to resolve it - the trouble with that though is it’ll be a very public admission of a problem, a PR nightmare.

[DJMR]

My retailer has had loads of customers with the issue and he’s frustrated that the Hornby Sales Rep is not answering calls, instead letting them go to voicemail and not returning them - I think someone should tell him that hiding from a problem won’t make it go away

 

I’ve not had a reply to my e-mail to Lyndon Davies. I agree with ‘Legend’, Hornby should issue a statement on their website acknowledging the problem and outlining the steps they’re taking to resolve it - the trouble with that though is it’ll be a very public admission of a problem, a PR nightmare.

 

 

My supplier today, Derails (apt name), has been in touch to say they are working with Hornby to find a solution. Hornby are on the case and they will know more in a few days.

 

Cheers

 

Edit: clarification when Derails has been in touch; Today (05/03/2017). 

[Legend]

Yes but it sounds like a simple loosening of screws may cure the issue. By not saying anything they are really shooting themselves in the foot and giving their retailers a lot of hassle as customers take their models (quite rightly) back. If it’s a simple fix better say something as soon as possible .

[DJMR]

Yes but it sounds like a simple loosening of screws may cure the issue. By not saying anything they are really shooting themselves in the foot and giving their retailers a lot of hassle as customers take their models (quite rightly) back. If it’s a simple fix better say something as soon as possible .

 

Fully agree, I am still yet to receive any response to my email but Hornby has been in discussions with my supplier, should know in a few days what the solution is. 

[Legend]

Fully agree, I am still yet to receive any response to my email but Hornby has been in discussions with my supplier, should know in a few days what the solution is.

 

In fairness that might be how they are going to deal with it through your retailer. After all returning it to your retailer, who you have your contract with is the correct course of action . The retailer then takes it up with Hornby. But they could save a whole lot of hassle meantime if they’d just say something. There are some clever designers in Hornby . Given that on here folk have found out that loosening the screws helps , you’d have thought they have come up with something by now.

[Foo]

ah yes. speak to your retailer.... ordered mine direct from Hornby when announced so Hornby not replying isn't very reassuring

[DJMR]

ah yes. speak to your retailer.... ordered mine direct from Hornby when announced so Hornby not replying isn't very reassuring

 

Not satisfactory at all from Hornby and supposedly they read this forum but I will post updates when I get them from my Retailer.

[SteveC32]

Been in touch with Hornby and they say they will supply these bogies free of charge when parts are available if their tech boys think it will solve part of the problem, emailling it to Hornby tech services later today.

Good news that they appear to be doing something to investigate the issue. But if they think they can send me ‘free of charge’ parts (how generous of them! ) for me to fix their manufacturing problem when they should have supplied a fully working model in the first place then they can think again - my expectation is that they’ll pay to have the 2 IETs I own returned to them to modify them (and fix the electrical issue I have with one of them) - that’s what a warranty is for after all

[dibber25]

If Hornby look at my post 502 the investigation has been done for them. It took me one afternoon to investigate and rectify. It's not a difficult fix but it is quite time consuming and it should not need replacement of the bogies. It is, however, a model which is likely to be always intolerant of track which is either laterally complex or vertically uneven. (CJL)

[NickC]

Loosening the screws is not a total solution, it didn’t work for me. Besides the screws are not too tight. They have shanks and have been tightened up correctly. Now whether the shanks are too short is another question.

[keybuk]

As for sound chip fitting had mine chipped by olivias trains they put the speaker in the tray and the chip inside the body behind the grey door uprights and used a small half round file to remove the plastic on the pcb edge in the tray  adjacent to the chip socket just enough allow the wires through to the seating area.

 

 

I've been experimenting with this approach myself, and I'm cautious to commit to it until I at least hear some alternatives:

 

 

While the wiring routing isn't an issue, the LokSound V4.0 doesn't fit in the space so I would have to cut the interior plastic out of the way as marked in the image, and make a hole for the wiring.

 

I think I can just about tuck this so that it won't be directly visible through the doors; there's 34mm between the glazing, and the decoder is 32mm long.

 

I've had to do worse to models before to get a decoder in, but none of those models were considered "DCC Sound Ready" by the manufacturer

[mski]

Keybuk mine are fitted like similar .I have some photos for you but cant post them for the moment cheers

[jonesey]

Hornby got back to me after my initial phone call to their Service Department requesting me to send my set back to them to investigate/fix the problem.  So they are definitely doing something, even if public communication from them isn't great.

 

Like many others, although I tinker with my running stock, the last thing I want to be doing is trying all manner of things to fix an issue on a brand new £400 model.  I'm not expecting to loosen this, change that, file here, scrape there, etc on something that should be right first time.

[No Decorum]

Loosening the screws is not a total solution, it didn’t work for me. Besides the screws are not too tight. They have shanks and have been tightened up correctly. Now whether the shanks are too short is another question.

The tight screws I encountered were those holding the lavatory tanks on. It has also been observed that the screws which have to be removed to get access to the speaker/decoder compartment are difficult to shift. I mentioned that using a different screwdriver helped to shift them.

 

The screws holding the couplings in place are slotted and easy to turn. I think what Hornby needs to do is to use screws with an unthreaded shank long enough to permit vertical movement – rather like the screws used for steam locomotive and tender drawbars. Just how long the unthreaded section needs to be is a matter for experiment. Perhaps Hornby should add a couple of sets of its own inclined piers to its test track and work to that.

 

The matter of the bogies derailing on curves is curious. The train is stated to be able to go around second radius curves. Surely Hornby tried this on its own test layout. It also occurs to me that the model is very fast indeed. I think it would be unreasonable to expect it to go around second radius curves at full pelt without “coming off at the corners” to use the old-fashioned phrase. However, the problems which other posters have reported are clearly not related to speed. Here again, CJL has come to the rescue.

[NickC]

Mine has no issue with 90 degree R3 and R4 curves where there is a significant straight before and after the curve, i.e. a normal 'loop'.

However what does cause it to derail the central coach is stretched curves such as  R4 curve, ~200mm straight, R4 curve!

[Simon_H]

My model shop is not dispatching mine and others until he hears from Hornby so I have not had the outlay for this model yet and I’m unable to experience or attempt a repair but I’m also mindful about actually getting the model. It might be worth cancelling my order and wait to see if or ever a response will be made by Hornby.

[wormoworm]

I received my 800 yesterday, and two of the coaches exhibit the bogie catching issue. On the third coach, I can see a small amount of material has been removed from the inside of the white pieces on the body, similar to what Darius reported. When I tested each coach on my test track (settrack with a mix of 2nd and 3rd radius curves), the two unmodified coaches consistently derail on the curves, but the modified one does not.

 

Since I live abroad and sending the set back will likely take time and effort, I decided to try and solve the problem myself. Using a fine file, I chamfered the inside edge of the body, along just a small 4-5mm strip where the bogie was hitting. I also applied a very very slight chamfer to the corresponding area on the top of the bogie. After these modifications, the coaches run perfectly! Neither of these tweaks are visible in normal operation, and I'm not worried about them potentially affecting any future warranty claims, as they are actually less extreme than was has been done to the third coach at the factory.

 

When coupling the train together, I discovered another issue. When the last two vehicles (coach and dummy driving car) pass through a 2nd radius "S" curve (2nd radius right immediately followed by a 2nd radius left), the dummy driving car is forced off the track. Driving the train slowly through this S curve reveals the problem: on the dummy car, the close coupling mechanism is pushed all the way to the right and hits the silver boxes mounted on the underside as the curve tightens. At some point it can't go any further and the dummy car derails.

 

Luckily for me, my order from Hattons also included plenty of 4th radius curves, so this won't be a problem. But I thought I would report this, as my model (and probably others) can definitely not negotiate a 2nd radius S curve. Perhaps this is why Hattons have written that 3rd radius is the minimum.

 

/Tom

[Fireline]

Hornby got back to me after my initial phone call to their Service Department requesting me to send my set back to them to investigate/fix the problem.  So they are definitely doing something, even if public communication from them isn't great.

 

Like many others, although I tinker with my running stock, the last thing I want to be doing is trying all manner of things to fix an issue on a brand new £400 model.  I'm not expecting to loosen this, change that, file here, scrape there, etc on something that should be right first time.

 

You can't call their Service Department. You get through to their "Customer Care" team. The Repairs/Service Department is in a different building, and not at Sandwich!

[Darius43]

On the third coach, I can see a small amount of material has been removed from the inside of the white pieces on the body, similar to what Darius reported. When I tested each coach on my test track (settrack with a mix of 2nd and 3rd radius curves), the two unmodified coaches consistently derail on the curves, but the modified one does not.

/Tom

Given that at least Tom and I have coaches that have plastic carved away by third parties in the Hornby supply chain, I am wondering where this leaves us warranty-wise if, for example, we were to be accused of carving the plastic ourselves...

 

Darius

[John ks]

Mine arrived a couple of days ago

Took it to a friends DC layout & the second bogie on the second coach would derail at the same place

Loosened the couplings which seemed to help

 

Next day I had a closer look & decided to slightly bevel the top of the bogie & the white plate, this helped but I could still get the bogies to catch

 

Using insight gained from previous posts I went to plan B which involves gluing a small piece of plastic to the floor. Shown in blue

 

 

 

​

 

MSKI pointed out that the bogies on the driver trailer (DT) & the coaches are different

 

The white plate on the DT is lower than the coaches & the shock absorber bracket is not as tall

  Driver Trailer

 

Coach

 

When I get around to fitting DCC I can run it at home & see if the mods are a success

​I did try pushing 2 modified coaches up a grade (at the top is a tight curve & the grade transitions to flat) with reasonable success

 

John

 

Edit If you decide to try this mod do not allow the glue to get between the floor & body of the coach.

Edited March 8, 2018 by John ks

[keybuk]

Took the plunge and did the heavy decoder fitting on the 800. Cut out the side parts as I drew in my previous post, and filed a hole in the base to route the cables through so that they tuck behind the decoder rather than being visible through the door:

 

 

Passed the 8-pin plug through the hole in the chassis that already exists, along with the speaker wires and rejoined these to the speakers. I'm using a DCC Supplies 4 Ohm "Base Enhanced" Speaker for this, it's not quite as punchy as a full bass reflex which doesn't fit in the space, but it should give the diesel sound more than enough kick.

 

 

Getting the PCB back in, and in particular plugging the plugs back into it, was the fiddly bit; but once it's all in, and the decoder is plugged into the socket, it ends up looking pretty neat underneath:

 

 

And with a little careful positioning, the decoder is very nicely hidden in the space between the two doors, behind the GWR logo; leaving the ability to see through one door and out of the other:

 

[mski]

Exactly the same as my fitting apart from L/H part of partition trimmed to allow chip to sit back, no problem will email photo soon.

[mski]

Forgot to mention you done a better job routing the cable , but mines fine for me, eyesight s not that good that it matters mines got a black out tape covering the chip.