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Bachmann 2020 Range

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10 minutes ago, AY Mod said:

 

It isn't, but I won't tell you why.

There isn't a button for 'information intriguing rather than useful' Andy.  You are entitled to privacy in terms of your state of knowningness on the subject, so I won't ask why, and keep my guesses to myself for now...

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It also, I imagine, depends on the state of progress the project has reached, the further advanced equating to the more likely that the company will continue with it and recoup some of the money they've already put in.  Hanging on to a production slot in China may be worth a loss if it upsets an opportunity for the competition, enabling you to beat him to market and tap any reservoir of demand for that prototype.

 

The upcoming head to head between Dap and H over prairies is going to be good spectator sport.  Dap have, apparently (we do not know the details which is what makes it fun) deferred their 5101 in favour of the mogul, possibly (again, we do not know) in order to allow the Hornby 5101 to tap that market and then release theirs to cash in on scarcity of that version after the initial run sells out.  Now, there is a question mark over the arrival of the Hornby (Andy didn't affirm that there was no delay in his recent response to me, which may or may not be significant or insignificant), Dap are well advanced with the mogul, and there might be an opening for them to get their prairie in first and take money that would otherwise have gone to H.

 

Froth and secondguessing is fun, but not any indication of when models are going to turn up or where, or who, from.

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On 16/01/2020 at 21:51, it's-er said:

As I understood it, Model Rail commissioned their lovely USA 0-6-0T from Bachmann, and have exclusive use of it for 5 years.  That 5 years must be coming up soon, so I wouldn't be surprised if Bachmann announce it within their own range for 2020.

 

John Storey

 

I ummed and ahhed about the USA until the one I would have bought (SR black) was sold out, so amen to this.

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I do find this debate about product announcements most interesting - to announce or not announce, that is the question! It's a tough one to call and so difficult to get right.

 

For me, I am happy for Bachmann not to announce so much this year and hold announcements off until a model is further down the production line. 

 

I am minded to the 'announcement' of the 2-HAP. Announced in 2016 to coincide with the celebrations of 30 years since the start of operations of Network South East. Clearly 4 years on and still no model, one could assume that the model was at the very early stages of development when the announcement was made. I note that in the Winter issue of Bachmann Times  the model is listed as 'In Production' in the OO Scale Works Report, but not included on the Bachmann 'Coming Soon' flyer I picked up at Warley which lists up to March 2020 for OO. I don't realistically expect to see the 2-HAP until the summer 2020. 

 

Given the suggested move by Bachmann to hold off announcements until a model is further down the production line, the 2 HAP would not have been announced until the middle  of last year, somewhat missing the NSE celebrations by 3 years. Surely if Bachmann wanted to be part of the NSE celebrations then development of the 2-HAP should have started way sooner in 2011/12, they did have 30 years notice.

 

All that said, I am sure it will be a fine model when it arrives.

 

Mark

 

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16 minutes ago, Mark201 said:

I am minded to the 'announcement' of the 2-HAP. Announced in 2016 to coincide with the celebrations of 30 years since the start of operations of Network South East. Clearly 4 years on and still no model, one could assume that the model was at the very early stages of development when the announcement was made. I note that in the Winter issue of Bachmann Times  the model is listed as 'In Production' in the OO Scale Works Report, but not included on the Bachmann 'Coming Soon' flyer I picked up at Warley which lists up to March 2020 for OO. I don't realistically expect to see the 2-HAP until the summer 2020. 

 

Given the suggested move by Bachmann to hold off announcements until a model is further down the production line, the 2 HAP would not have been announced until the middle  of last year, somewhat missing the NSE celebrations by 3 years. Surely if Bachmann wanted to be part of the NSE celebrations then development of the 2-HAP should have started way sooner in 2011/12, they did have 30 years notice.

 

Be of good cheer, it's apparently on the roadmap for a July release:

But don't crack the champagne just yet! ;)

 

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3 hours ago, The Johnster said:

It also, I imagine, depends on the state of progress the project has reached, the further advanced equating to the more likely that the company will continue with it and recoup some of the money they've already put in.  Hanging on to a production slot in China may be worth a loss if it upsets an opportunity for the competition, enabling you to beat him to market and tap any reservoir of demand for that prototype.

 

 

And that has just been demonstrated now, Cavalex have put the 4mm project on stop as a result of Hornby. Which is a shame as it will have given Hornby the desired result and will almost certainly mean they'll do it again (if it was done as a reaction to Cavalex)

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With regards to the announcement of new models when they are ready for tooling - I presume the scenecraft range isn't affected by this and will be announced at the main catalogue & range announcement? I'd certainly like to see Bachmann expand their range of GWR Station buildings and signal boxes. 

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1 hour ago, surfsup said:

With regards to the announcement of new models when they are ready for tooling

 

To be clear this was just a guess, Bachmann haven't made anything public yet about their policy going forward.

 

1 hour ago, surfsup said:

I presume the scenecraft range isn't affected by this and will be announced at the main catalogue & range announcement? I'd certainly like to see Bachmann expand their range of GWR Station buildings and signal boxes. 

 

The February announcement will not include anything new based on what Andy Y has posted on here multiple times.

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1 minute ago, mdvle said:

 

To be clear this was just a guess, Bachmann haven't made anything public yet about their policy going forward.

 

 

The February announcement will not include anything new based on what Andy Y has posted on here multiple times.

 

I'm fully aware of that, but wondering if the Scenecraft range is included in that or not. The possible new policy will likely be for the main range models, but may or may not be applicable to the Scenecraft range. 

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14 hours ago, Mark201 said:

I do find this debate about product announcements most interesting - to announce or not announce, that is the question! It's a tough one to call and so difficult to get right.

 

For me, I am happy for Bachmann not to announce so much this year and hold announcements off until a model is further down the production line. 

 

I am minded to the 'announcement' of the 2-HAP. Announced in 2016 to coincide with the celebrations of 30 years since the start of operations of Network South East. Clearly 4 years on and still no model, one could assume that the model was at the very early stages of development when the announcement was made. I note that in the Winter issue of Bachmann Times  the model is listed as 'In Production' in the OO Scale Works Report, but not included on the Bachmann 'Coming Soon' flyer I picked up at Warley which lists up to March 2020 for OO. I don't realistically expect to see the 2-HAP until the summer 2020. 

 

Given the suggested move by Bachmann to hold off announcements until a model is further down the production line, the 2 HAP would not have been announced until the middle  of last year, somewhat missing the NSE celebrations by 3 years. Surely if Bachmann wanted to be part of the NSE celebrations then development of the 2-HAP should have started way sooner in 2011/12, they did have 30 years notice.

 

All that said, I am sure it will be a fine model when it arrives.

 

Mark

 

 

So...

Are they announcing that there are no announcements about the previously announced 2-HAP?

Or are they not announcing that they are making any more announcements about other announcements?

Or are they going to announce that they aren't making any more announcements until the previously announced announcements about the 2-HAP have been dis-announced?

 

My head hurts...…………….

:mellow:

 

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My copy of the 2020 combined edition catalogue, has just dropped through the letterbox.

 

I’ve only had a chance to quickly scan the accompanying letter, but it seems to confirm that there are no “new items” and that future new releases will be notified by a quarterly bulletin.

A quick glance indicates quite a few new liveries, but it’s mostly consolidation and the same as last year.

 

In future, no more photos of the prototype, or graphics illustrations to accompany new announcements.
They say they will only show photos of real examples of a model when making announcements of new releases.

Correct me if I’m wrong, but that basically says they won’t announce anything until it’s only a few months off being ready to ship.

 

I’ll have a proper read, later on today.

 

 

Ron

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I am surprised at how fast they got out re-releases in new colours last year. So my guess is more re-releases and price increase for other items already announced and priced last year.

I guess when they feel confident that they can get all new models within a reasonable time scale (say less than 3 years) then they may announce other items.

 

I can imagine that they not only wish to clear the backlog but equally ensure new models continue to sell (and in what quantities). They already stopped doing some items due to being un-economic. And others may follow.

 

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Personally, I think that this is a good move by Bachmann; pushing back the announcements to give a shorter, and more realistic, time to delivery.

 

My one caveat is over commissioners' announcements. IDK, but I guess that commissioners want to get some idea of market desire before committing themselves; in which case, early announcements for pre-orders might be important. OTOH, if commissioners have the same degree of market intel that the manufacturers have, and why wouldn't they?, then it may well be moot.

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19 hours ago, TomScrut said:

 

Yes I agree, it is more that if a company says they are doing a product there is a situation where another company looking at the same product has a decision to make. Do they a) continue and beat the other one to the market b) continue and not beat the other one to the market or c) cut their losses and pull out. 

 

I'd be interested to know which is more common! I would imagine it depends on the companies involved.

I should think that the decision is made on how far along the production a model is. There comes a point where it is better to continue and make a small loss than to write off costs already incurred and make a bigger loss. Then there is the matter of the Terrier. Hornby got to market first but Dapol then knew what it had to beat and is going ahead, claiming to produce a model better than the Hornby. I have one Hornby but two Dapol on order. I’m curious to see how the two compare.

 

There was a case a few years ago where the Bachmann catalogue was rather thin because a couple of key items were cancelled duplicates. I have often thought that Bachmann’s habitual announcements shortly after Hornby were a mistake. I wonder how the new system will work. It seems that no longer will I have the  pleasure of following a desired item through all the stages of production. Last minute announcements will cause havoc with budgeting.

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13 minutes ago, No Decorum said:

I should think that the decision is made on how far along the production a model is. There comes a point where it is better to continue and make a small loss than to write off costs already incurred and make a bigger loss. Then there is the matter of the Terrier. Hornby got to market first but Dapol then knew what it had to beat and is going ahead, claiming to produce a model better than the Hornby. I have one Hornby but two Dapol on order. I’m curious to see how the two compare.

 

There was a case a few years ago where the Bachmann catalogue was rather thin because a couple of key items were cancelled duplicates. I have often thought that Bachmann’s habitual announcements shortly after Hornby were a mistake. I wonder how the new system will work. It seems that no longer will I have the  pleasure of following a desired item through all the stages of production. Last minute announcements will cause havoc with budgeting.

 

I suspect rather than last minute "These are on the ship; fill your boots!" announcements, we might see more details released as they get to EP stage.

 

Clearly I could be wrong, but I wouldn't have thought it would be in their interest to announce so close to delivery - they could end up with an over-stock situation.

 

I'm waiting for my new look combined catalogue / letter with interest..... although the last Bachmann Times took 5 weeks to get here! I might have a wait on my hands :-(

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1 hour ago, Ron Ron Ron said:

 

Correct me if I’m wrong, but that basically says they won’t announce anything until it’s only a few months off being ready to ship.

 

I’ll have a proper read, later on today.

 

 

Ron

So if that's correct it will significantly increase the risk of duplication I would think? Sounds like they're going to operate more like Hornby timescale wise, and look at the aggro that's  causing!

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EP to deco sample and then production can still be a fair while, so announcing at EP stage would still allow time to establish demand and give dealers time to place orders. All in all that makes sense to me.

 

Roy

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If I was Bachmann when the 158s were done, I would have had a massive run of them and thus have some ready for release very soon into the new 2020 calendar to take advantage of interest generated in new model and the cashflow that it will bring.

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Whats meant by "combined edition" ?  Is that Bachmann and Farish?   Are there new liveries on existing models in there or is it just the same as last years catalogue?

 

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2 hours ago, Legend said:

Whats meant by "combined edition" ?  Is that Bachmann and Farish?   Are there new liveries on existing models in there or is it just the same as last years catalogue?

 

Graham Farish, Narrow Gauge, Thomas and Friends, Branchline, Scenecraft, EFEand Modelmaker

 

N, OO9, OO, O, 16mm and G scale

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Theres going to be an awful lot of Class 66s' about. Just saying.

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I have my combined volume and after a quick glance it is just Models previously announced I did not spot any new liveried items. So having read the letter I am still a little confused.

Are we every three months going to get a leaflet detailing new releases which means new tooling and new liveries on existing tooling?

Does this combine therefore replace the old catalogue so next year we get a new combine including the new models which have been released over the past year?

Maybe all will be explained in February and at this event will we find out what the new liveried items for the next 3 months will be?

What if there is nothing to be announced over the 3 month period?

I suspect no one will know but will wait till after Feb then pose any questions to Bachmann.

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2 minutes ago, Markwj said:

I have my combined volume and after a quick glance it is just Models previously announced I did not spot any new liveried items. So having read the letter I am still a little confused.

Are we every three months going to get a leaflet detailing new releases which means new tooling and new liveries on existing tooling?

Does this combine therefore replace the old catalogue so next year we get a new combine including the new models which have been released over the past year?

Maybe all will be explained in February and at this event will we find out what the new liveried items for the next 3 months will be?

What if there is nothing to be announced over the 3 month period?

I suspect no one will know but will wait till after Feb then pose any questions to Bachmann.

 

I don't know if I am more or less confused after reading your post TBH!

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4 hours ago, Bob83a said:

Graham Farish, Narrow Gauge, Thomas and Friends, Branchline, Scenecraft, EFEand Modelmaker

 

N, OO9, OO, O, 16mm and G scale

 

Now the big question is, will there be 00-9 gauge Thomas items appearing this year?

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6 hours ago, Markwj said:

I have my combined volume ......... So having read the letter I am still a little confused.

Are we every three months going to get a leaflet detailing new releases which means new tooling and new liveries on existing tooling? ......

 

To quote from the letter accompanying the Combined Volume.  (my bold highlights)......

 

Quote

"The Combined Volume illustrates ongoing items that are available to purchase from your local retailer, or have been included in previous catalogues for delivery at a future date.

It does not include any unseen re-livery or new tooling products."

 


 ".......so starting this February each issue of your Bachmann Times magazine will feature a new product brochure, highlighting completely new items to be released during the following three months.
New tooling announcements will no longer be illustrated by black and white photographs of the original prototype, replaced instead by pictures of our actual models."
 

 

 

A key bit here.....

 

Quote

"While we continue to deliver items previously announced, it is anticipated that

your first new product brochure will highlight fewer items than those you will receive towards the end of this year.
This is quite natural as we reduce the number of outstanding items, clearing the path for an increasing quantity of exciting new models."
 

 

To me, that sounds like each quarterly Bachmann Times magazine, will include a separate brochure, or pamphlet, much like that for the Members exclusive models, containing the new release details.

If they stick to their stated intention, the new items will then be available to purchase from anytime from a few weeks, up to 3 months from the time of the announcement.

 

 

6 hours ago, Markwj said:

......Does this combine therefore replace the old catalogue so next year we get a new combine including the new models which have been released over the past year? ......

 

We don't know yet if they'll repeat the Combined Edition next year, but it might be a likely scenario.

If so, it might not include models that have been released earlier in the preceding year, but which have long sold out. There'd be no point in including them if they were no longer available to buy.

Again, we'll have to wait and see.

 

 

6 hours ago, Markwj said:

.....What if there is nothing to be announced over the 3 month period? .....

 

I suspect they will have plans to spread new releases over the 4 quarters, possibly using re-liveries and accessory items to fill the gaps where newly tooled models are not planned to appear.

We have already been warned (quoted above) not to expect much in the first quarter of this year.

 

 

 

 

 

.

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