Jump to content

Dick Turpin

Hornby P2

Recommended Posts

7 minutes ago, Paul_sterling said:

 

I recall a note once, (it might well have been from O.S. Nock) , that as the britannias and the 9f shared identical motion, when you consider how fast the piston speed on the 9f was at 90, the britannias should have been able to match 4468! 

Using speed and wheel circumference I would estimate that 90mph on a 9F would be equivalent to approximately 120mph on an A4 at the same rpm. 

  • Like 1
  • Agree 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 minutes ago, TheSignalEngineer said:

Using speed and wheel circumference I would estimate that 90mph on a 9F would be equivalent to approximately 120mph on an A4 at the same rpm. 

 

Just checked, and I agree. I'm correct in respect of the quote, but the quote is incorrect. thanks. 

 

Paul.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Good information.

 

Wasn't the Bulleid boxpok design said to be lighter - less inertia / momentum when running?

As you say, the tyres may have been a limiting factor.

 

I've read the same regarding the 6' 2" wheels - dimension applies to Blue Peter and Bulleids as well as Brits I suppose so we must have read the same book somewhere - I did have a fair amount of OS Nock in my distant past!!

 

I would be more concerned of piston speeds for the reciprocating gear - and 'breathing'.

 

Wonder what Coronation would have reached then .... ???   !!!

 

We're all allowed to 'let's suppose' once in a while.

 

Al.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I have read that the claimed maximum wheel speed at over 90mph* for one of the 9Fs was at around 8.8 revs a second, the same as Mallard at 126mph.

*Might be a bit of an exaggeration?

 

As an aside the GWR was going the same way re wheel size, as the County was intended as a simpler & cheaper replacement for a Castle and had 6' 3" wheels.

This was an unlikely precedent to the similarly power rated Britannia.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I suppose as time went on, designers were looking at axle loading permitted versus tractive effort / acceleration out of stations to try and speed throughput.

 

Never looked at County Class locos the same way I do Castles TBH - just don't look as impressive.

 

Al.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Different eras and needs.

 

There was no need for speed in post war Britain. The infrastructure was terrible after six years of neglect due to war. Hence the reason there was no "top link" express passenger locomotives in the BR Standards*. 71000 was an after thought only allowed due to the demise of 46202.

 

* Britannias were mixed traffic officially. 7MT.

 

 

 

Jason

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Agreed, Jason. We already had 50 Stanier Pacifics, 30 Kings and lots of Castles, the Merchant Navies and Gresleys Pacifics which could all run heavy expresses at speeds in excess of those permitted right across the system until the late 1950s. 

What was needed was to get rid of the mass of non-standard bit and pieces often inherited from pre-grouping companies. I doubt many of those would have lasted past 1950 had the war not interrupted building programmes of the Big Four in favour of military equipment.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
9 hours ago, atom3624 said:

Good information.

 

Wasn't the Bulleid boxpok design said to be lighter - less inertia / momentum when running?

As you say, the tyres may have been a limiting factor.

 

I've read the same regarding the 6' 2" wheels - dimension applies to Blue Peter and Bulleids as well as Brits I suppose so we must have read the same book somewhere - I did have a fair amount of OS Nock in my distant past!!

 

I would be more concerned of piston speeds for the reciprocating gear - and 'breathing'.

 

Wonder what Coronation would have reached then .... ???   !!!

 

We're all allowed to 'let's suppose' once in a while.

 

Al.

 

For what it's worth in the context of wheel diameters and speed, Andre Chapelon had planned a 232 or  4-6-4 for post-war France and he chose 7'3" for drivers with a envisaged top service speed of 200km/hr.  I believe he knew a thing or two about steam engineering including breathing and economy, too.  :)   The designs were mentioned I think in Col. H.C.B.Rogers' book 'Chapelon. Genius of French Steam'

 

Most of his plans were thwarted alas by the SNCF going electric...    mind you, 205mph by 1955 with electrics wasn't half bad!  Or for that matter the more recent, what was it, 560-something km/hr ? A lot of metallurgical knowledge and electrical power there!

 

thread drift warning  ...   but entirely to do with Bugatti-nose P2s.  !

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If / when Hornby produce a P.O.W. P2 is going to look much different in appearance to Cock O The North. Will it be fitted with the external pump system on front righthand side.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)

Like 70000 Britannia?

 

If/when Hornby model it, there are scale Westinghouse pumps.

 

I fitted one to the front of my Hornby Britannia.

 

 

 

Al.

70000_-_Britannia_-_pump_-_warnings_-_drains_20181024-1.jpg

Edited by atom3624
  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

No.  2001 was fitted with an ACFI feed water heater when built.  It's visible in the first photo on this page.

 

The LNER tried these on a number of different locomotives - several B12s, 2 A1/3s and (I think) a J6.  The apparatus was removed from all of them by early in the Second War. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
17 minutes ago, jwealleans said:

No.  2001 was fitted with an ACFI feed water heater when built.  It's visible in the first photo on this page.

 

The LNER tried these on a number of different locomotives - several B12s, 2 A1/3s and (I think) a J6.  The apparatus was removed from all of them by early in the Second War. 

 

in 2001's case, when it was rebuilt to conform with the rest of the class. 

 

P. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The P2 Quartet.

The far left P2 is the origianal TTS Version.

Next is the gloss coated version now fitted with TTS.

The next two are both R3207 version now both TTS fitted .

All the four P2s are now fitted with X9108 5 pole motors. 

4.jpg

1.jpg

3.jpg

4.jpg

  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Why on earth would you need 4 of the same loco lol

  • Agree 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, Hilux5972 said:

Why on earth would you need 4 of the same loco lol

Especially given the P2s shortcomings, although DonnyRailMan has dealt with one of them (the motor).

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I bought 2 - one for the sake of it, and one to hack around

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, Hilux5972 said:

Why on earth would you need 4 of the same loco lol

For starters it's my railway and two of them are to be renamed. And there will be a other one could be coming to have a make over done on it. Similarly to the projects I have had done in the past to other locos.

A d it dose not bother me if the are right or not right as some people say. 

  • Agree 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
23 minutes ago, bigwordsmith said:

I bought 2 - one for the sake of it, and one to hack around

Me too, especially as the second one came with a complete trainset for £70 in an online Black Friday sale! Sold on, the individual parts of the train set and ended up with a loco for £30

 

Mike Wiltshire

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I was joking dude. I’ve got 3 5972. And will have 2 more when they are released this year. Didn’t mean to offend.

  • Friendly/supportive 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
13 minutes ago, Hilux5972 said:

I was joking dude. I’ve got 3 5972. And will have 2 more when they are released this year. Didn’t mean to offend.

 

Same here did not mean to offend you either.

  My 5th P 2 is going to be the railroad version and will be done in War Time Black. Also will be fitted with TTS a d be fitted with the X9108 motor. Plan is end of year / new year .

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I can think of less interesting locomotives to have 4, now 5 of ....

 

Why not add 2 more and you've got the lot?  !!

 

PoW!!

(As they say)

 

Al.

  • Funny 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I’m looking forward to Hornby releasing the P2 as 2007. Hopefully with a completely reengineered super detail version! 

  • Agree 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, atom3624 said:

I can think of less interesting locomotives to have 4, now 5 of ....

 

Why not add 2 more and you've got the lot?  !!

 

PoW!!

(As they say)

 

Al.

 

I love it! 

  • Agree 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, atom3624 said:

I can think of less interesting locomotives to have 4, now 5 of ....

 

Why not add 2 more and you've got the lot?  !!

 

PoW!!

(As they say)

 

Al.

I'm thinking of even doing a 2008 

name it after a town that was on the P2s line / route. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

We have placed cookies on your device to help make this website better. You can adjust your cookie settings, otherwise we'll assume you're okay to continue.