well filled baps The Sheep Chronicles : These are the adventures of a Sheep, the Works Forecat and Naughty George,

[D9020 Nimbus]

Notice that calling something a BR/Sulzer type 2 doesn't distinguish between a class 24 and class 25. Normally locos in this era were named after the main contractor — usually the firm responsible for the mechanical parts, although the class 15 is an exception: the mechanical parts were made by YEC (pilot scheme locos) and Clayton (the rest).

 

For some reason the class 14 was usually referred to as a "Paxman type 1” — a designation that could have applied to all the type 1s except the EE Type 1 (class 20). 

[Oldddudders]

Very happy with terms like Clayton and Teddybear for classes 17 and 14 respectively. Less happy with Duff, which is a Brush Type 4. But everyone talks of Peaks, Warships and Westerns.

 

In another sphere, Thumpers were never so called in my hearing by any railwayman - and 50 years ago the Area 2 Controller on the next desk spent a lot of time keeping the Central 3H and 3D fleet in the right places, although it was only available thanks to the magic of the fitters at St Leonards, patron saint of DEMUs.

[New Haven Neil]

6 hours ago, The Stationmaster said:

Yes they did have a habit of not working.   Plus - something to remember when weathering - they also had an inclination for the V16 Paxman engines to catch fire

 

Paxmans in my old sphere were spawn of the devil, leaky things which were a nightmare to work on - the exhaust manifolds were just impossible to remove without making your own special tools to reach some nuts.  And they blew up.

 

Mention of the SLW Derby Type 2 sound above is correct, it is head, shoulders and post office tower above any other sound I have heard in a model.  As per recent conversation elsewhere folk may note I'm a listener, to engines in particular, the engineer training coming out - the 6 cylinder Sulzers have a very particular sound, and Paul Chetter has captured it superbly, ad the model reproduces it very well indeed.

[New Haven Neil]

PS - a 350 to me is an English Electric shunter, not a modern EMU!

[Steamport Southport]

9 hours ago, Oldddudders said:

Sorry, chaps, but a bit of nitpickery coming up. I refer to the habit in recent posts of referring to venerable diesel locos by their TOPS number. TOPS only came to fruition in the early '70s, yet Rob's recent acquisition is from a class that had all gone by 1972. It is actually a British-Thompson-Houston Type 1. It has a British Railways symbol from before the 1966 British Rail double-arrows, and a D prefix on its number - they had largely disappeared by 1970.

 

Similarly a Class 24 is a Derby-Sulzer type 2. And yet you all know what a Hymek is - no TOPS number being bandied about there.

 

Food for thought about terminology in Rob's chosen era? Sorry (not really) to be boring.

 

What about 35 017?

 

http://www.hondawanderer.com/35017_Watchet_1992.htm

 

 

[Oldddudders]

I am pointing out the anachronistic references to TOPS numbers on a green SYP 1960s model with British Railways logos. What happened in 1992 is of no relevance. 

[Tortuga]

1 hour ago, Oldddudders said:

Very happy with terms like Clayton and Teddybear for classes 17 and 14 respectively. Less happy with Duff, which is a Brush Type 4. But everyone talks of Peaks, Warships and Westerns.

But aren’t those (uh oh, potentially offensive term coming up) train spotters nicknames for different locos?

Peaks were obviously so nicknamed as they were all named after peaks, but doesn’t the nickname apply to three different TOPS classes all by the same manufacturer?

Theres two distinctly different designs of Warships and aren’t they by different manufacturers? I’m not sure which is which, but I’ve got an image in my head of a class 41 and a different image of a class 42.

Not a 100% certain what a Brush Type 4 is; could you clarify without sharing an image?

 

I don’t see an issue with using TOPS classes to refer to diesels regardless of the livery they’re in. It IS interesting to know what the original designations were, but the TOPS classes make it easier for all to know what’s being referred to. Besides, weren’t ALL the diesel types given TOPS classes whether or not they’d been / were going to be withdrawn?

 

Anyhow. I think I’ve hijacked Rob’s thread enough, but before I finish, people keep on referring to my Kombinationkraftwagen Type 2b incorrectly, so I do understand your point of view.

[NHY 581]

I think what needs to be taken into account is that whilst the locos are pre-TOPS, as are most of us here on, the acquiring of knowledge and therefore the terminology used to identify the locos ( in my case at least)  is post-TOPS.

 

We identify items using the terms in use at the time. 

 

Therefore, a class 15 is just that to me. 

[Stubby47]

Sounds like you need @2ManySpams's loco spotting guide.

[keefr2]

17 minutes ago, NHY 581 said:

Therefore, a class 15 is just that to me. 

 

And me....

 

[NHY 581]

[MrWolf]

Nice shot of lurking locomotive there.

[chuffinghell]

41 minutes ago, MrWolf said:

Nice shot of lurking locomotive there.

Agreed but it needs sprinkling with some of Rob’s weathering magic

 

Edited October 8, 2021 by chuffinghell

[MrWolf]

True, I doubt that the real thing would have been that shiny when new even. Maybe the scruffy wagons amplify the shine.

[St Enodoc]

10 hours ago, The Stationmaster said:

 i wouldn't be too surprised to find a WR Loads Book showing then as D82XX as they definitely worked to Acton at one time.

Not listed as such in the October 1966 edition, which is the only one I have. They only appear in the London Division Local Tables, as D.8200-D.8243 (sic) in respect of working between Latchmere Junction and North Pole Junction. They're not mentioned at all in the Western Region - Southern Region table at all.

[NHY 581]

5 hours ago, chuffinghell said:

Agreed but it needs sprinkling with some of Rob’s weathering magic

 

 

4 hours ago, MrWolf said:

True, I doubt that the real thing would have been that shiny when new even. Maybe the scruffy wagons amplify the shine.

 

 

Thanks both. 

 

Bizarrely, I'm not at all confident about weathering the diesels as of yet. It's something I need to look into and read up on. 

It will obviously happen but I don't want to cock it up {obviously} so considerable prior thought shall be given to it ahead of any distressing taking place. 

 

As ever, colour photos will be sought. 

 

Rob. 

[mullie]

A 15 and a 24, I would look at some of the Suffolk lines - the East Suffolk line, Aldeburgh and Framlingham branches. The Snape line down to the Maltings never saw diesels but is well worth a look. A lot of the DMUs are available too.

 

East Anglia was dieselised by the early 60s and there is the potential to run your locos, though ideally without a yellow warning panel, alongside a J15 .

 

Martyn

[sb67]

39 minutes ago, mullie said:

A 15 and a 24, I would look at some of the Suffolk lines - the East Suffolk line, Aldeburgh and Framlingham branches. The Snape line down to the Maltings never saw diesels but is well worth a look. A lot of the DMUs are available too.

 

East Anglia was dieselised by the early 60s and there is the potential to run your locos, though ideally without a yellow warning panel, alongside a J15 .

 

Martyn

 

I maybe a bit biased as it's my 'manor' but I think East Anglia and the surrounding areas are fascinating for early diesels. A line that draws me in is the Maldon branch, seen some great photos of BTH type 1's and a perfect home for a W&M Railbus.

[NHY 581]

Morning all. 

 

It does appear my diversion by way of the internal combustion engine has generated much comment, which is fab. 

 

As you may well recall, I have a leaning towards the more bucolic backwaters and I can see the addition of early diseasels into this enviroment as nothing less than a good thing. 

 

Plans are ahoof for an 08 to join the fray along with the aforementioned 24. 

 

Quite frankly, I haven't worked all these additional hours not to be able treat myself. 

 

Now, there may be a bit of progress with Project X this weekend by way of ground cover etc............with the usual and obvious caveat of family and stuff....

 

 

Rob. 

[Oldddudders]

11 hours ago, Tortuga said:

But aren’t those (uh oh, potentially offensive term coming up) train spotters nicknames for different locos?

Peaks were obviously so nicknamed as they were all named after peaks, but doesn’t the nickname apply to three different TOPS classes all by the same manufacturer?

Theres two distinctly different designs of Warships and aren’t they by different manufacturers? I’m not sure which is which, but I’ve got an image in my head of a class 41 and a different image of a class 42.

Not a 100% certain what a Brush Type 4 is; could you clarify without sharing an image?

 

I don’t see an issue with using TOPS classes to refer to diesels regardless of the livery they’re in. It IS interesting to know what the original designations were, but the TOPS classes make it easier for all to know what’s being referred to. Besides, weren’t ALL the diesel types given TOPS classes whether or not they’d been / were going to be withdrawn?

 

Anyhow. I think I’ve hijacked Rob’s thread enough, but before I finish, people keep on referring to my Kombinationkraftwagen Type 2b incorrectly, so I do understand your point of view.

Peaks were BR Sulzer Type 4s. The first 10 were named after peaks, and that set the trend for the rest. I think we were all a bit puzzled when D100 was named Sherwood Forester about 60 years ago. 

 

Warships were in three batches and two distinct body-styles. I think the nameplate included the words "Warship Class", so pretty official, really. Brush Type 4 became Class 47.

 

Lastly, people talk about Beattie Well Tanks. Yet they were known as Class 0298 in Southern and BR(S) days until withdrawal.......

[New Haven Neil]

I'm with Oldudders.  Many of the nicknames for loco classes are modern, and date from well after the eras we model.  EE type 3's for instance, were just that, not 'tractors' or other nonsense. DMU's were 'multi's' and no class numbers - we had no idea of them but knew a Met-Cam from a Birm (-ingham RCW).

 

Now Sheepsy needs a NB Type 1 to go with the BTH......

[St Enodoc]

1 hour ago, Oldddudders said:

Brush Type 4 became Class 47

Generally known as a "four-and-a-half".

[Oldddudders]

5 minutes ago, St Enodoc said:

Generally known as a "four-and-a-half".

Did Carolyn G not get involved in trying transplanted prime movers in them?

[St Enodoc]

2 minutes ago, Oldddudders said:

Did Carolyn G not get involved in trying transplanted prime movers in them?

Yes - 47601/901.

[New Haven Neil]

1 hour ago, St Enodoc said:

Generally known as a "four-and-a-half".

 

Brush 4 to us northerners, as opposed to a Peak.  Did you know Mark Clark by any chance BTW?