Stoke Courtenay

[KNP]

Nice set of pictures, sometimes, just sometimes you don't need any loco's in the pictures of a model railway.

Keep them coming.

[THS92-GWR-NO]

Having watched the BRM video of this layout ten twenty times I keep thinking there should be a follow up done with all the progress you made since BRM visited 

[checkrail]

3 hours ago, THS92-GWR-NO said:

I keep thinking there should be a follow up done with all the progress

There are some video clips on youtube.  I'll try to find the links.

 

Thanks for kind comments.

John.

[checkrail]

Here are the hidden sidings/offstage storage loops/fiddle yard/'Much Fiddling in the Tunnel,' call it what you will, shown from left (Exeter end) to right (Plymouth end), with the branch fiddle yard at the back.  Had to take 5 shots due to restricted height in the loft. 

 

 

 

 

The central crossover between the nearest 'up' and furthest 'down' loops was removed this afternoon.  I'd never used it once in ten years!  Now I'm awaiting more supplies before further work which I hope will include a link from the up main line to the branch fiddle yard to allow the trip/branch goods to work both ways.  The key to this is a Peco asymmetric  3-way point I've just bought from Waltons of Altrincham, but it will probably need some reconfiguration of existing pointwork to fit.  And I've found from experience that when prising up well-stuck-down Peco points the survival rate is about 50%.

 

John C.

[St Enodoc]

8 hours ago, checkrail said:

I can understand that John, especially with a large system designed with prototypical operation by several people in mind.  You need to replicate the functions of signal boxes.  But horses for courses:  I love the simplicity of doing everything from the handset, especially with the one key route setting which macros enable.  Only exceptions are the signals which operate from switches/push buttons on the fascia - but though working, they're really for cosmetic effect only.  Like so many little boys I wanted to be an engine driver but I don't ever recall wanting to be a signalman!

I was (am?) the other way round!

 

To be clear, I use (Modratec) lever frames at the stations but the route-setting mimic panels are ideal for the off-stage storage areas/fiddle yards.

[The Fatadder]

11 hours ago, checkrail said:

The central crossover between the nearest 'up' and furthest 'down' loops was removed this afternoon.  I'd never used it once in ten years!  Now I'm awaiting more supplies before further work which I hope will include a link from the up main line to the branch fiddle yard to allow the trip/branch goods to work both ways.  The key to this is a Peco asymmetric  3-way point I've just bought from Waltons of Altrincham, but it will probably need some reconfiguration of existing pointwork to fit.  And I've found from experience that when prising up well-stuck-down Peco points the survival rate is about 50%.

 

John C.

 

My first thought seeing the crossover between the up and down fiddleyards was "why didnt I think of adding that", but now you mention it I dont think I have ever had that thought while actually operating.   I have been thinking about the same sort of issue for Brent, with the Newton Abbot - Brent  goods (for which I dont think there was a balancing working listed with the locomotive staying to work some branch services before returning to NA in some way I am unsure of.)  Like you I have the issue that it will leave the down main fiddleyard, but arrive into the up main yard.  A crossover between up and down main at the entrance to the fiddleyard would have been my solution if i had thought about it earlier (although it would require some complicated curved 3 way points to make it work).    For now I think I will have to stick with the NA - Ivybridge goods that is a lot simpler to run!

[checkrail]

2 hours ago, The Fatadder said:

My first thought seeing the crossover between the up and down fiddleyards was "why didnt I think of adding that", but now you mention it I dont think I have ever had that thought while actually operating.   I have been thinking about the same sort of issue for Brent, with the Newton Abbot - Brent  goods (for which I dont think there was a balancing working listed with the locomotive staying to work some branch services before returning to NA in some way I am unsure of.)  Like you I have the issue that it will leave the down main fiddleyard, but arrive into the up main yard.  A crossover between up and down main at the entrance to the fiddleyard would have been my solution if i had thought about it earlier (although it would require some complicated curved 3 way points to make it work).    For now I think I will have to stick with the NA - Ivybridge goods that is a lot simpler to run!

My thought processes have been very similar to yours in that I usually run a pick-up goods from NA to points west, calling at Stoke C.  but rarely run one up or down the branch due to FY constraints.  There's also the significant factor of the FY loops being more or less permanently full, so at present there'd be nowhere for the goods train to end up if it went the other way!

 

Crossovers (preferably scissors) at each end of the FY would be great but I just have no room to even consider them.  The central FY crossover seemed a good idea at the time to enable re-marshalling of trains, but there was always some other train standing on it, so it never got used.  In practice, if I want to re-marshal I run the trains onto the scenic sections and use the station crossovers - or just pick them up.  

 

But I always knew I was trying to squeeze a quart into a pint pot.

[The Great Bear]

1 hour ago, checkrail said:

My thought processes have been very similar to yours in that I usually run a pick-up goods from NA to points west, calling at Stoke C.  but rarely run one up or down the branch due to FY constraints.  There's also the significant factor of the FY loops being more or less permanently full, so at present there'd be nowhere for the goods train to end up if it went the other way!

 

Crossovers (preferably scissors) at each end of the FY would be great but I just have no room to even consider them.  The central FY crossover seemed a good idea at the time to enable re-marshalling of trains, but there was always some other train standing on it, so it never got used.  In practice, if I want to re-marshal I run the trains onto the scenic sections and use the station crossovers - or just pick them up.  

 

But I always knew I was trying to squeeze a quart into a pint pot.

I've forgotten, you don't run to a timetable but you run some "typical" trains that's it?

 

What do you do for storage off the layout, I expect it is very neat as all your work!

 

I think FY design is a balance, space is good, opens up more options but complex track arrangements may lead to problems, more to maintain and more source of runnign issues/derailments. Certainly has been in my case where I've removed a scissors crossing as the facing curved point into it was a regular source of problems.

[MrWolf]

On 22/01/2022 at 13:39, checkrail said:

I've just had a small quantity of bus wire delivered from DCC Concepts, so while I stroke my chin and ponder my forthcoming automation of the fiddle yard pointwork here are a few vignettes of scenes around Stoke Courtenay.

 

 

 

John C.

 

Sorry about the loop back to the previous page. I just wanted to say thanks for posting these images as they gave me the necessary push to get on with installing my own station fencing and continuing work on the surrounding area. 

 

Rob Wolf

[checkrail]

2 hours ago, The Great Bear said:

I've forgotten, you don't run to a timetable but you run some "typical" trains that's it?

 

What do you do for storage off the layout,

Yep, that's right Jon.  As for off layout storage i use some cheap plastic drawer units on castors from B & Q.  I did think about cassettes, but where would I put them?  And there's no obvious point for docking them to the layout unless I kept them to about two coach lengths.  As you say, it's a balance.

[TrevorP1]

I think very few of us have the fiddle yard space for the trains we run. Mine run to a sequence based on the timetable and CWNs (plus photo evidence where possible). The trains themselves are those which I find interesting and come from the period early 50s to early 60s but the consist of the trains are as correct as I can get for the period each train represents. eg You won’t find my Star on maroon Mk1s.

 

Just lately I’ve spent time developing the sequence and have split it into four, morning, afternoon, evening and… wait for it…. night. That makes for 40 odd different trains. Each part of the sequence runs till  I’m bored, changing engines for a bit of variety, then it’s a change round to move onto the next part.

 

Some trains are kept in cassettes, eg The Duchy. Others live in plastic trays with lids or an old chest of drawers. I don’t like handling the vehicles too much for fear of finger marks or damage but as you say cassettes can become unwieldy. As to the space, even my cassette road becomes a siding with a removable section of track!

 

Some trains are fixed sets, others made up of loose stock. Hunt couplings are a boon for this!

 

Good luck with the changes John.

[checkrail]

Stoke C has a traffic jam!  While I work on the fiddle yard there's nowhere else to put them.

 

 

 

 

John C.

[gwrrob]

There’s a guy who needs some Really Useful boxes.

[THS92-GWR-NO]

38 minutes ago, checkrail said:

Stoke C has a traffic jam!  While I work on the fiddle yard there's nowhere else to put them.

 

 

 

 

John C.

Looks like Bill and Ben have been working as signal engines

 

Jokes aside, nice to see all those engines and rolling stock!

[MrWolf]

That's a far more interesting traffic jam than any I've ever been stuck in!

[Coach bogie]

I do not use DCC but do like signaling.  Point work is all solenoid operation apart from siding close to the operator which are all push rod. Mainline signals are all solenoid linked to the points. If the points change direction, so do the bracket signals. This provides a visual guide on how points are set. Non mainline signals are all push rod as here.

 

Track circuits are all on a diagram with control selectors and on/off. The complex Junction feeder points and track circuits select automatically based on which destination line has been set. All works and I have never seen the need go DCC with it. A couple of years ago, I built a similar control panel for a friend with DCC as he was fed up punching numbers into his controllers and wanted a more visual way of setting up routes. I have two panels. one for the mainline and a second for the holding loops which hold 2 or 3 trains each. Both panels have "King" switch, disconnecting feed power to the solenoids, effectively locking the points in position- stops any accidental changing of point work, especially from the junior operators.

There is a third panel which was added later on for my son who wanted his own holding sidings. I added an extra board in a spare part of the room which can just hold a five coach train, perfect for his Voyagers etc. To make this one a bit easier for him, he just selects a track number and the route is set through a diode matrix. We designed and soldered it up together. His teacher was horrified I let him use a soldering iron. He is at university now and is the only one who knows how to solder up a circuit board, a skill he is used recently when building a bass guitar from a various discarded parts.

 

Mike Wiltshire

 

 

[checkrail]

1 hour ago, Coach bogie said:

I do not use DCC but do like signaling.  Point work is all solenoid operation apart from siding close to the operator which are all push rod. Mainline signals are all solenoid linked to the points. If the points change direction, so do the bracket signals. This provides a visual guide on how points are set. Non mainline signals are all push rod as here.

Nice work Mike. 

[checkrail]

Another trio of snaps from a perambulation around Stoke Courtenay the other day.  One actually includes a locomotive - two even.

 

 

 

John C.

[Graham T]

I especially like the church gate; a lovely little scene there.

[Nick Gough]

Everything fits so nicely together to create not just a model railway but a whole miniature countryside.

[Sandhole]

1 hour ago, checkrail said:

Nice work Mike. 

Mike is one of my oldest and dearest Friends.
He is my Obi Wan in all sorts of model railway stuff.
His signals are superb!
Regards,
Chris.

[MrWolf]

1 hour ago, Graham T said:

I especially like the church gate; a lovely little scene there.

 

Have to say that is one of the most convincing churchyards I've ever seen modelled. 

Churchyards are another one of my obscure fascinations, of course, I don't go in them, as bursting into flames tends to spoil my day...

[checkrail]

22 hours ago, Sandhole said:

Mike is one of my oldest and dearest Friends.
He is my Obi Wan in all sorts of model railway stuff.
His signals are superb!
Regards,
Chris.

Indeed, and he's been very helpful and encouraging to me, especially when i first started coach building.

[checkrail]

All went well with the first conversion from wire-in-tube to Rails of Sheffield surface-mounted digital solenoid point motors.  This point gives access to the 2-road branch fiddleyard.  'Proof of concept!' I told myself, 'Now to order another five 3-packs'.   Next for attention were the two crossover points which link these two roads, so that automation and route setting in the branch FY would be sorted, giving me confidence for the bigger task of converting all the main line running loops.

 

 

Famous last words - after that everything that could possibly have gone wrong did.  More anon, in the hope that it provides some amusement. 'After all, yer gotta larf'.   But - I hope - we're now on the road to recovery.

 

John C.

[checkrail]

My most recent examples of the curse of Murphy's Law were:

 

1) Having congratulated myself on the success of the first installation I started to look at the other FY points and realised I'd been lucky.  The great majority of the other points have had the little vertical posts on the tiebar ends removed, so the Rails solenoids won't latch on to them.  I have no recollection whatsoever of doing this but I'm the only possible suspect.  My guess is that I cut them off 9 or 10 years ago, possibly because they caught on the track rubber when cleaning.  It's instructive that the three newer points on the lift-out hatch, installed some years later, are still intact.  All lost in the mists of time but indicative of a lack of foresight on my part.  

 

2)  Then an idea came to me.  I would place the solenoids at the front of the FY and link them to the points via the existing Mercontrol wire and tube set-up.  So I got to work and fitted one to operate one of the branch FY turnouts.  No dice: there was too much play or too much friction in the system (or a bit of both) to get the point to throw, with or without the omega loop.  Back to the drawing board.

 

3) So I thought about installing sub-baseboard solenoids only to remember that it would mean lifting the pointwork anyway.  As I've said earlier, with them all firmly glued down (more lack of foresight) the survival rate when doing this is about 50% at best.  So I'm looking at buying a fair number of new points as well as all the solenoids, and have started small by nipping up to Walton's of Altrincham last Friday for two Peco medium radius points to replace the branch FY crossover.

 

4) Should all have been plain sailing then?  Er, no.  To bring the first Rails solenoid up to the right height for the track and dense foam underlay I'd mounted it on a rectangle of plywood glued to the baseboard.  Just right. But when I came to insert similar plywood plates in recesses cut out of the foam I inadvertently cut pieces from the wrong strip of ply, one that was quite a bit thicker.  And I'd glued them down with Evo-Stik resin W.  They used to advertise it as 'Stronger than the wood itself'.  Too right!  There was no way I could get the point motors to latch at this height so I spent a day hacking out layers of plywood perilously close to the new points, with the point and blade of the Stanley knife and a bit of gouging with the Dremel, leaving a rather rough and rocky surface.  But the second attempt at the second point went well.  I was pleased, and moved on to point number 3.  My troubles seemed to be over.  Nothing else could go wrong could it?

 

5)  Now being in a hurry to make up lost time (often a danger warning), instead of using thin ply to form a new sub-base i cut a bit from an offcut of stout Plastikard and stuck it into the recess with superglue.  I used rather too much and didn't wait to let it cure properly.  Nor did I realise that the bit of scrap Plastikard had a pre-drilled hole in it.  I fitted the point motor but found on testing that not only would it not work but it was glued firmly to the Plastikard baseplate, the adhesive having oozed out via the hole.  That could be separated, but unfortunately the solenoid itself is now glued up solid.  So now I've a replacement point motor on the way by 1st class post from Rails to use with the decoder I already have.  

 

All this was (when not crouched under the boards trailing a hot soldering iron) done leaning right over to the back of the layout under the eaves, with no room to get any but the shortest screwdrivers vertical, and with the aid of a little mirror for soldering on the far side of the rails.  I also have a number of cuts and bumps on the crown of my head from the purlin just millimetres above me.

 

Once I've got the branch FY points done I think I'll give this project a rest for a couple of weeks or so to get my breath back.  Besides, I want to see some trains running!  But that Peco 3-way assymetric point and the wiring of the two motors it will require looks interesting ....

 

John C.

Edited February 1, 2022 by checkrail