RMweb Premium newbryford Posted December 19, 2016 RMweb Premium Share Posted December 19, 2016 I tend to agree with Chris M. Mixing and matching are fine on a home layout but when I go to an exhibition I want to see something modelled to a better and more realistic standard than I can achieve at home, something to give me ideas and inspire me. I dont necessarily expect to see exact train formations but something broadly representative of the era and area being modelled. Give it a month and I'll be able to run this in model form.............. Mixed livery formations like this are quite common in the present era. Cheers, Mick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Phil Bullock Posted December 19, 2016 RMweb Gold Share Posted December 19, 2016 Different chips in different locos? Tweaking needed! Cheers Phil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium newbryford Posted December 19, 2016 RMweb Premium Share Posted December 19, 2016 Quick DCC question re double heading....... Two different locos, say a Bachmann 47 and a Heljan 47, both with identical (or different ) chips will run exactly the same? Or do the chips need to be tweaked to match? Probably not for the first question, which means probably yes to the second............ Cheers, Mick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold TheSignalEngineer Posted December 19, 2016 RMweb Gold Share Posted December 19, 2016 Give it a month and I'll be able to run this in model form.............. Mixed livery formations like this are quite common in the present era. Cheers, Mick Anyone remember the scratch sets used when a limited HST service was run from Manchester to St Pancras during the WCRM works? We had sets cobbled together from MML original, MML refurbished, Virgin and FGW 'Fag Packet' liveries. Not sure if all four were in the same train at any time, but there were instances with three. http://paul3715.tripod.com/mml_hst_08.jpg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium newbryford Posted December 19, 2016 RMweb Premium Share Posted December 19, 2016 Anyone remember the scratch sets used when a limited HST service was run from Manchester to St Pancras during the WCRM works? We had sets cobbled together from MML original, MML refurbished, Virgin and FGW 'Fag Packet' liveries. Not sure if all four were in the same train at any time, but there were instances with three. http://paul3715.tripod.com/mml_hst_08.jpg It never happened........................ Cheers, Mick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ess1uk Posted December 19, 2016 Share Posted December 19, 2016 And there is still a mixed HST running EMT power cars and Virgin coaches on the ECML. Today I saw a blue 90 on a rake of mk4s. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold TheSignalEngineer Posted December 19, 2016 RMweb Gold Share Posted December 19, 2016 https://flic.kr/p/bCAg1X It never happened........................ Cheers, Mick Never say never, Mick. Even as I post there are probably 25 anoraks surfing the net trying to prove you wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium newbryford Posted December 19, 2016 RMweb Premium Share Posted December 19, 2016 https://flic.kr/p/bCAg1X Never say never, Mick. Even as I post there are probably 25 anoraks surfing the net trying to prove you wrong. Flickr-ing as I type....................... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Johnster Posted December 21, 2016 RMweb Gold Share Posted December 21, 2016 'Incorrect' mixes of stock are one of my bugaboos as well; I can't get past the idea that, if the layout's exhibitor's are not prepared to run correct trains, why should I take anything they do seriously at all. But that begs the question of how one defines a correct train. We all know what we mean by the phrase, but I bet if we examined it closely, my definition would be different to yours! Many years ago I went to a Bristol show, this was before they were in Wapping Wharf, and someone, Bristol MRC I think, was operating a very good 4mm Yatton layout, which impressed me no end. Yatton did not alter much visually for many years except to get dirtier... It ticked a all the boxes in terms of realism, running, scale speeds with scale length trains, but ran to a sequence in which the trains represented GW and WR main line practice from about 1900 up to the green (maroon) small warning panel diesel era, so about 65 years. The concept exploited the overlap periods when stock of different designs or liveries ran together, so that, although at no time were there trains visible on the layout that could not have been seen with each other in those particular liveries, one gradually moved forward through time as the sequence progressed, so that a Dean single might pass a coal train hauled by an Aberdare, and be followed by Saint or Star, then a 43xx passing a 28xx in the loop, and so on. I thought it was a brilliant idea that could easily be employed on many exhibition tail chasers and, easily enough, on the smaller blts. It is probably the medium size terminuses that would be difficult. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johndon Posted December 22, 2016 Share Posted December 22, 2016 Many years ago I went to a Bristol show, this was before they were in Wapping Wharf, and someone, Bristol MRC I think, was operating a very good 4mm Yatton layout, which impressed me no end. Yatton did not alter much visually for many years except to get dirtier... It ticked a all the boxes in terms of realism, running, scale speeds with scale length trains, but ran to a sequence in which the trains represented GW and WR main line practice from about 1900 up to the green (maroon) small warning panel diesel era, so about 65 years. The concept exploited the overlap periods when stock of different designs or liveries ran together, so that, although at no time were there trains visible on the layout that could not have been seen with each other in those particular liveries, one gradually moved forward through time as the sequence progressed, so that a Dean single might pass a coal train hauled by an Aberdare, and be followed by Saint or Star, then a 43xx passing a 28xx in the loop, and so on. I thought it was a brilliant idea that could easily be employed on many exhibition tail chasers and, easily enough, on the smaller blts. It is probably the medium size terminuses that would be difficult. Should I ever get my magnum opus built, I will be doing something similar with correct trains running through the period 1965-1985 John Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
muddy water Posted December 28, 2016 Share Posted December 28, 2016 Sometimes it is older guys running club layouts with modern stock and younger guys running steam era stock, that problems arise. Clubs need to have an 'expert' to check the stock is correct for the time period. Otherwise you get unfitted coal trains with no brake vans and 2 car DMUs with the driving cabs coupled together, so the driver can not see! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Londontram Posted December 28, 2016 Share Posted December 28, 2016 This is one of the good things about modeling the pre grouping Caledonian like I do, the basic train for the Caley was only four coaches long with stock added as required. Even the Grampian stock trains started at three carriages upwards, so a basic train would be brake third, third, first and another brake third further coaches added to strengthen the train as needed. The down side is being pre grouping everything has to be scratch or kit built or cut and shut but hay at least you don't need that many for a typical train Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davefrk Posted December 28, 2016 Share Posted December 28, 2016 How's about a Tri-ang Caley Single and one coach, not even a brake coach, advertising a club layout in an exhibition guide. I won't name the club but surely someone could have done something better. Dave Franks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
muddy water Posted December 28, 2016 Share Posted December 28, 2016 Saw a DRS 57 with one mk2f TSO near Dalston, London. It was possible a replacement for loco hauled trains out of Norwich. So anything is possible if you can get a picture. (not photoshopped of cause!) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robertcwp Posted December 28, 2016 Share Posted December 28, 2016 How about a DRS 68 and a single Mark 3a: P1070868a by Robert Carroll, on Flickr Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Johnster Posted January 6, 2017 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 6, 2017 Why would the milk train need a brake van? The whole train is vacuum braked and the guard can ride in the rear cab. Not until the single manning agreement in 1969, by which which time Maroon Westerns with small yellow warning panels were rare as rhs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris M Posted January 22, 2017 Author Share Posted January 22, 2017 if anyone tells you your train formations are wrong just tell em you are using "alternative facts" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GreenGiraffe22 Posted January 22, 2017 Share Posted January 22, 2017 Or a post-truth representation Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Black Hat Posted January 23, 2017 Share Posted January 23, 2017 Preserved Railway goods trains for those that model such a thing has to be another area that throws up a whole manner of different variations - 16ts, van wagons, coal hoppers, brake vans, bogie bolsters, all in the same rake... Or are we all like the Great Central, and have lovely fixed rakes of engineers, mineral wagons etc, running around all over? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TEAMYAKIMA Posted January 23, 2017 Share Posted January 23, 2017 I regret I have not read every post on this thread, but I must say that I am all in favour of prototypically believable train formations. But it's also nice if you can do something that looks 'wrong' but you know is 'right'. My next exhibition layout will go public in Spring 2018 at the Bristol show,. The main feature will be a banking station ........ (it's a non-UK layout) ,,,,,,, a large 2-8-2 will arrive from the fiddle yard into a loop hauling just eleven 100ton bogie coal cars..... then two equally large 2-8-2's will be attached as bankers .... eventually the 11 coal cars with three 2-8-2's will depart ............... I am waiting with great expectations for the first exhibition viewer to comment and question that formation ..... I can then get out my photos of exactly that formation storming out of the prototype banking station that inspired my layout. I might even show them my video of such a formation stalling on the 1/30 grade up to the steelworks and having to back down and attack the grade a second time! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vitalspark Posted January 24, 2017 Share Posted January 24, 2017 Prototypical formation? Larbert viaduct with Scot and 'train' heading north. Think I might include this train in our new project Larbert..plus have the pic handy. Dave. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Steven B Posted January 24, 2017 RMweb Premium Share Posted January 24, 2017 Don't many/most modellers choose to model what looks good rather than what was common? A block train in one livery, or odd one-offs like the Mk1 CK & LMS brake van above either look good or are more interesting. A train of mixed coaches (Big-four/BR or Mk1/Mk2/Mk3) in mixed liveries were very common but as they don't look as nice they get modelled less often. Happy modelling, Steven B. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Roy Langridge Posted January 24, 2017 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 24, 2017 There has been much discussion recently about train speeds and acceleration at exhibitions. To me a much bigger problem is that far too many layouts do not run trains that would have been seen together or with plain wrong train formations. I'm all for a bit of modellers licence but there are far too many absolute howlers. For instance:- Diesels without a yellow warning panel pulling blue grey coaches Just stumbled across this thread... So this never happened? I think you will find that it did. So in this case may the layout be right and the viewer wrong? What winds me up is layouts that are full of one-off liveries, named locos when the majority were not... Roy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
43110andyb Posted January 24, 2017 Share Posted January 24, 2017 We exhibited our club layout Darlington Parkgate many years ago now and it was set in the late 80's ECML. one of our members with limited knowledge of the 'modern' era came to help, I was late down to the Sunday morning session and he had coupled the two HST power cars to a rake of MK2D coaches and were merrily belting around the layout to my horror. Needless to say they were quickly swopped back and we had a right laugh about it. No harm done and punishment was minimal. Ps (A challenge for someone to find if it ever happened and I can then humbly fall onto my sword). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Roy Langridge Posted January 24, 2017 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 24, 2017 We exhibited our club layout Darlington Parkgate many years ago now and it was set in the late 80's ECML. one of our members with limited knowledge of the 'modern' era came to help, I was late down to the Sunday morning session and he had coupled the two HST power cars to a rake of MK2D coaches and were merrily belting around the layout to my horror. Needless to say they were quickly swopped back and we had a right laugh about it. No harm done and punishment was minimal. Ps (A challenge for someone to find if it ever happened and I can then humbly fall onto my sword). Closest I can think of is the NMT, so I think your safe. Roy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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