DropTheTap Posted April 7, 2017 Share Posted April 7, 2017 Bachmann are not in the business of mass production as the run for each model can hardly be called 'mass'! The majority of today's highly detailed locos are niche and bespoke. Versus someone who produces high quality, customized models for an individual consumer... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium DRS Crewe On A Mission Posted April 8, 2017 RMweb Premium Share Posted April 8, 2017 Are you having a laugh? So retooling a body and a repaint, with a £20 increase is 'expensive?' Glad you aren't one of my customers. The £20 price difference between two different locos produced by two different manufacturers was purely observational. I never said that I wouldn't be buying a Colas 70 because of the price. In fact quite the opposite, I am hoping to buy one or two of them to run with the engineers wagons that I have. My point is that the only visible difference between the original Freightliner 70s produced a few years ago and the Colas and Freightliner 70s due to arrive later this year is that they have the small air intake boxes fitted to the side. Although the Colas livery is also been produced this time that can't be classed as something that is different or an extra because every loco/model produced wears a livery. So in fact for an extra £20 all we getting different/more from what we can physically see is two small air intake boxes. That's how and why I was comparing to the Dapol Class 68. It's nothing personal or against Bachmann because the locos that they do produce are of a high quality and I have a lot of their locos. I am just simply comparing what we are paying for two different locos. I am really looking forward to the Colas Class 70 arriving later this year. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
frobisher Posted April 8, 2017 Share Posted April 8, 2017 Except that Bachmann are in the business of mass production, so it's really somewhat of a false equivalence. Assuming everything else is equal - this variant having the same production and material costs, this £20 over 500 models is what, £10,000? This is definitely the right order of magnitude to cut the new body tooling that was needed to produce it. That would be looking to a single production run to recover the extra development costs. Future production runs will obviously have increased profit margin, but also some resilience against rising costs. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mevaman Posted April 8, 2017 Share Posted April 8, 2017 I think that comparing Bachmann with Dapol is problematic. From my experience of generally poorer quality of Dapol diesel locos (colour, livery, electrics, lighting), I am very happy to pay proportionately more for Bachmann locos. You pays your money.... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSpencer Posted April 8, 2017 Share Posted April 8, 2017 I think that comparing Bachmann with Dapol is problematic. From my experience of generally poorer quality of Dapol diesel locos (colour, livery, electrics, lighting), I am very happy to pay proportionately more for Bachmann locos. You pays your money.... Looks a good comparison to me. I find that Bachmann were not only generally better in quality than the niche players (Heljan and Dapol), they were cheaper too. Now the 2 big players have the most expensive RTR on the market. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Roy Langridge Posted April 8, 2017 RMweb Gold Share Posted April 8, 2017 The £20 price difference between two different locos produced by two different manufacturers was purely observational. I never said that I wouldn't be buying a Colas 70 because of the price. In fact quite the opposite, I am hoping to buy one or two of them to run with the engineers wagons that I have. My point is that the only visible difference between the original Freightliner 70s produced a few years ago and the Colas and Freightliner 70s due to arrive later this year is that they have the small air intake boxes fitted to the side. Although the Colas livery is also been produced this time that can't be classed as something that is different or an extra because every loco/model produced wears a livery. So in fact for an extra £20 all we getting different/more from what we can physically see is two small air intake boxes. That's how and why I was comparing to the Dapol Class 68. It's nothing personal or against Bachmann because the locos that they do produce are of a high quality and I have a lot of their locos. I am just simply comparing what we are paying for two different locos. I am really looking forward to the Colas Class 70 arriving later this year. So the livery doesn't cost anything? I think you may find that statement is incorrect - it is called licensing. Roy Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium DRS Crewe On A Mission Posted April 9, 2017 RMweb Premium Share Posted April 9, 2017 So the livery doesn't cost anything? I think you may find that statement is incorrect - it is called licensing. Roy Yes the livery does cost something but that can't be classed as something new or extra that you are getting with the loco. My point is that every loco has to come with a livery applied. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Roy Langridge Posted April 9, 2017 RMweb Gold Share Posted April 9, 2017 (edited) Yes the livery does cost something but that can't be classed as something new or extra that you are getting with the loco. My point is that every loco has to come with a livery applied. You are missing the point, the livery has to be licensed (i.e. paid for). Do you know the Colas license costs no more than others? It has been indicated before that some licenses are more expensive. Roy Edited April 9, 2017 by Roy Langridge Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium phil-b259 Posted April 9, 2017 RMweb Premium Share Posted April 9, 2017 You are missing the point, the livery has to be licensed (i.e. paid for). Do you know the Colas license costs no more than others? It has been indicated before that some licenses are more expensive. Roy Indeed. Modellers need to remember that every single paint scheme applied since privatisation is the intellectual property of the owner and cannot be reproduced without express permission of said owner. Said owner is entitled to charge a fee of their choosing if they say yes. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium DRS Crewe On A Mission Posted April 9, 2017 RMweb Premium Share Posted April 9, 2017 You are missing the point, the livery has to be licensed (i.e. paid for). Do you know the Colas license costs no more than others? It has been indicated before that some licenses are more expensive. Roy Indeed. Modellers need to remember that every single paint scheme applied since privatisation is the intellectual property of the owner and cannot be reproduced without express permission of said owner. Said owner is entitled to charge a fee of their choosing if they say yes. Yes I am aware that some liveries cost more than others because of the licensing but that aside £145 for one loco is still a lot of money. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Roy Langridge Posted April 9, 2017 RMweb Gold Share Posted April 9, 2017 (edited) Yes I am aware that some liveries cost more than others because of the licensing but that aside £145 for one loco is still a lot of money. Funny, that isn't what you posted where you commented that the livery costs the same (or more precisely, that it does not contribute to the price difference). Oh well. Roy Edited April 9, 2017 by Roy Langridge Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Dunsignalling Posted April 9, 2017 RMweb Gold Share Posted April 9, 2017 (edited) You are missing the point, the livery has to be licensed (i.e. paid for). Do you know the Colas license costs no more than others? It has been indicated before that some licenses are more expensive. Roy It is also the case that every time a new livery is applied to an existing model, there is design work required in the same way as for any other partial retooling Then it is necessary to transfer the design to the painting and printing equipment and ensure the output is as planned / expected.. Some colour schemes are more complex / difficult / expensive to achieve than others - a prime example was Hornby's LNER Teak Gresley coaches which reputedly required getting on for a dozen passes through the printer compared to two for the BR livery ones. Every additional pass increases the risk of defect and rejection. Colas obviously isn't in the same league but I suspect that getting that pronounced colour change half way along the sides consistently crisp on model after model after model, may not be easy. John Edited April 9, 2017 by Dunsignalling Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
MatthewCarty Posted May 24, 2017 Share Posted May 24, 2017 Bachmann's website seems to have changed the status of the V2 from §=On Order to =Out of Stock, does anyone have any idea what this might symbolise? I hope they haven't been cancelled! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium newbryford Posted May 24, 2017 RMweb Premium Share Posted May 24, 2017 My point is that the only visible difference between the original Freightliner 70s produced a few years ago and the Colas and Freightliner 70s due to arrive later this year is that they have the small air intake boxes fitted to the side. There's als the fairly visible diagonal "crease" in the cabside. Only applies to 70001-70006. All since 70007 have flat cabsides. Cheers, Mick Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium brushman47544 Posted May 26, 2017 RMweb Premium Share Posted May 26, 2017 Bachmann's website seems to have changed the status of the V2 from §=On Order to =Out of Stock, does anyone have any idea what this might symbolise? I hope they haven't been cancelled! definitely not cancelled. may just be an error, but on one occasion the model concerned had arrived in the warehouse but not yet been added to stock for delivery to retailers. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Black 5 Bear Posted May 26, 2017 Share Posted May 26, 2017 Will we ever see the Class 24(1) in light of the superb SLW products ??? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Legend Posted May 26, 2017 RMweb Premium Share Posted May 26, 2017 Also I think SLW is holding his price despite Brexit. If I were Bachmann I wouldn't want to launch a product against an established model that's viewed very favourably. There wasn't competition at the time of announcement ,but there is now. In such circumstances even though they may have spent some money on it, I think I'd can it and use the resources elsewhere. After all they are not exactly decimating their backlog . Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Ian Hargrave Posted May 26, 2017 RMweb Gold Share Posted May 26, 2017 Also I think SLW is holding his price despite Brexit. If I were Bachmann I wouldn't want to launch a product against an established model that's viewed very favourably. There wasn't competition at the time of announcement ,but there is now. In such circumstances even though they may have spent some money on it, I think I'd can it and use the resources elsewhere. After all they are not exactly decimating their backlog . There can be no doubt that Phil Sutton's 24 is as good as it gets.It is light years ahead of the competition in every respect.As you say the price differential ....considering what you get out of the tin .....(Yes,I did say tin )...... is marginal. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Hawkins Posted May 26, 2017 Share Posted May 26, 2017 Will we ever see the Class 24(1) in light of the superb SLW products ??? To put in simple terms........nope. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
class37418stag Posted June 22, 2017 Share Posted June 22, 2017 Hello everyone I has searched online to find photo of OCA Railfreight distribution livery but can't find Thank you Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Southernman46 Posted June 22, 2017 Share Posted June 22, 2017 Nope - they've been mostly Red (when new) and Dutch (in CE use) - might have been the odd loadhaul / mainline / grey one. This is pretty much the defacto source of liveries carried over the years ........................... http://paulbartlett.zenfolio.com/oca Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Posted June 23, 2017 Share Posted June 23, 2017 I seem to recall there is photo of oca in RFD (grey sides with yellow ends) in Chenoas modern wagon series books if you have access to them. Maybe not a common livery but believe there was a least 1. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rob D2 Posted June 23, 2017 Share Posted June 23, 2017 That's sometimes the issue with blue box wagons.....one offs, so I can't buy ten and run them as a rake. Missing a trick a little. As an aside I'm guessing DB schenker/ EWS licence is more expensive than others judging by the cost differential on upcoming class 66s Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Melly Posted June 24, 2017 Share Posted June 24, 2017 Hello everyone I has searched online to find photo of OCA Railfreight distribution livery but can't find Thank you Here you go. . . . https://www.flickr.com/photos/53055234@N08/33401645961/in/faves-95910128@N06/ Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
class37418stag Posted June 24, 2017 Share Posted June 24, 2017 Thanks melly and carry wheels but I would like see more Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now